Neck Collar versus HANS
#46
Mr. Excitement
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
#47
Mr. Excitement
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
When your head moves forward the force is counteracted by the bottom of the back plate staying tight against your spine. Unless you are tightly restrained against the seat there is nothing other than the strap pulling against your chest to stop the back plate moving away from your spine. It would still limit the movement but all the force would be on your chest without the extra support of the seat. Maybe that's enough to work better than nothing, but your head is still going to move a lot more than if your are strapped in tight with shoulder straps to keep you from bending forward.
Unrestrained people are pretty bendy when the forces are high enough!
Unrestrained people are pretty bendy when the forces are high enough!
Just remembered the case of a 911 that side swiped the blue bushes drivers left coming out of the toe of the boot at WG. Was during a DE and thus no window nets in use. Car had standard type race seats and belts. Car took a fair flat slap but was not totaled. Driver was OK, the drivers helmet had blue paint on it.
#48
The Penguin King
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
42MPH impact without HANS
And with HANS
And with HANS
#49
Rennlist Member
^^ Not a subtle difference! From personal experience, when I replicated a lawn dart flight path with my car in 2009 (flew over culvert and buried car's nose in soft ground -> endo), I had no neck stiffness or soreness whatsoever. Raced the next day in a rental 944. All thanks to HANS.
#50
Thanks Mike, that is a very interesting pair of videos, and clearly reinforces how the HANS (and probably other) restraints do help.
Regarding Glen's position that only cars with race seats, harness and HANS be on track, while perhaps ideal is not realistic. A lot of people like HPDE's and its a great way to keep people feeding into the car racing world. And there are a lot of people, myself included, that like to drive their non-race prepped car on track. While I would not push as hard in my street car as I would in the race car, the 991 is pretty fast and safety needs to be considered.
I have not heard back from Simpson yet, and am not sure I will. The question of the value of an R3 in a car with airbags still seems unclear. It would seem to me that it could only help, but it would certainly be nice to have some scientific proof.
Regarding Glen's position that only cars with race seats, harness and HANS be on track, while perhaps ideal is not realistic. A lot of people like HPDE's and its a great way to keep people feeding into the car racing world. And there are a lot of people, myself included, that like to drive their non-race prepped car on track. While I would not push as hard in my street car as I would in the race car, the 991 is pretty fast and safety needs to be considered.
I have not heard back from Simpson yet, and am not sure I will. The question of the value of an R3 in a car with airbags still seems unclear. It would seem to me that it could only help, but it would certainly be nice to have some scientific proof.
#52
Thanks Mike, that is a very interesting pair of videos, and clearly reinforces how the HANS (and probably other) restraints do help.
Regarding Glen's position that only cars with race seats, harness and HANS be on track, while perhaps ideal is not realistic. A lot of people like HPDE's and its a great way to keep people feeding into the car racing world. And there are a lot of people, myself included, that like to drive their non-race prepped car on track. While I would not push as hard in my street car as I would in the race car, the 991 is pretty fast and safety needs to be considered.
I have not heard back from Simpson yet, and am not sure I will. The question of the value of an R3 in a car with airbags still seems unclear. It would seem to me that it could only help, but it would certainly be nice to have some scientific proof.
Regarding Glen's position that only cars with race seats, harness and HANS be on track, while perhaps ideal is not realistic. A lot of people like HPDE's and its a great way to keep people feeding into the car racing world. And there are a lot of people, myself included, that like to drive their non-race prepped car on track. While I would not push as hard in my street car as I would in the race car, the 991 is pretty fast and safety needs to be considered.
I have not heard back from Simpson yet, and am not sure I will. The question of the value of an R3 in a car with airbags still seems unclear. It would seem to me that it could only help, but it would certainly be nice to have some scientific proof.
Until someone dies.
Then it's just stupid if you don't mandate it...42 mph...wow.
Instructors are a very courageous group for sure!
#53
Rennlist Member
The NecksGen is just a reincarnated Defnder. I had a Defnder and liked it a lot. In my opinion it is more comfortable than the HANS. Its one major draw back is the frame that holds the support straps. They are fairly tall and can interfer with helmet movement if you have a short neck. The helmet strap can take getting used to the HANS quik release is much easier to deal with.
#55
Race Car
I wore a collar when that was all there was.... in my many low speed impacts I thought they helped, especially in the side to side motion.
I wear the R3, w/ 6 points in my car, but also use it in the right seat.
Should I be concerned about sitting in the right seat of a stock car... even with the R3?
+ is that Leatt brace better than the R3 or issac types?
I wear the R3, w/ 6 points in my car, but also use it in the right seat.
Should I be concerned about sitting in the right seat of a stock car... even with the R3?
+ is that Leatt brace better than the R3 or issac types?
#56
Mr. Excitement
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
I wore a collar when that was all there was.... in my many low speed impacts I thought they helped, especially in the side to side motion.
I wear the R3, w/ 6 points in my car, but also use it in the right seat.
Should I be concerned about sitting in the right seat of a stock car... even with the R3?
+ is that Leatt brace better than the R3 or issac types?
I wear the R3, w/ 6 points in my car, but also use it in the right seat.
Should I be concerned about sitting in the right seat of a stock car... even with the R3?
+ is that Leatt brace better than the R3 or issac types?
Seems that many of the test videos that used to be easy to find are gone or hard to find and the one video sled test is all over the place. I note that there is very little body deformation in this set.
#57
Wow, those hans videos posted above are quite sobering. I've done two DEs in my completely stock Cayman. I'm probably going to do another one at the end of the year. Now I'm wondering if I should get an R3 or something for my neck.
Here's one for the instructors. If I'm an intermediate student wearing an R3 in a completely stock car, how are you going to feel if you only own a HANS device and can't use it in my car? Is that going to freak you out?
Here's one for the instructors. If I'm an intermediate student wearing an R3 in a completely stock car, how are you going to feel if you only own a HANS device and can't use it in my car? Is that going to freak you out?
#58
The Penguin King
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
This is not to say that additional protection won't help, just to point out that those videos really only address the case where you are wearing harnesses.
#59
The Penguin King
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
Airbag video
#60