Martin S.

I agree 100% with 67 King....if it is a Race Car. You need a cage and ALL safety gear. But for DE and AX, not so much.

A street/race car is the worst of both worlds, in most cases. Invariably it will be too heavy for the track. And by the time all the suspension mods are bolted on, street comfort will be gone.

Re. the trailer, I have a pal that rents a diesel PU from Enterprise Commercial. It is cheap too...then rent an aluminum trailer from U Haul as suggested above or any trailer for that matter. The diesel truck doesn't care!

sqweak

To be clear, the street usage/legality is limited to driving (up to ~100 miles) to/from nearby tracks. Also, this is intended to be an autox/de car for at least the next few years. I don't intend to do wheel to wheel racing at this time. For those familiar with POC, I'm looking to run it in PDS and TT.

If weight is an issue, there's an extra 100ish lbs of driver ballast that should go before I start stressing about the car's diet.

I don't follow 67king/Martin: What does cage have to do with streetability? Besides the inconvienence of ingress/egress, is there a safety issue?

Martin S.

I know it well....you don't need a cage, but a roll bar would be good, to attach your 5/6 point belts to. The roll bar also stiffens up the car a bit. AutoPower make a popular bar. I prefer the DAS-sport bar.

I'd also recommend a dual purpose seat such as a Sparco EVO seat, decent entrance/egress and it will hold you in and allow you to drive the car, as opposed to just hanging on. A racing steering wheel is a good investment too.

There is good competition and participation in the POC Stock and Improved classes classes, II for the 78 83 SC, and JI for the 84 - 89 Carrera. I'd stay away from the 964 car, although it can be obtained on the cheap, the car is too damn heavy.

I have an article on POC class selection, written for a future edition of Velocity...it is in the draft stage. I'll send it to you if you send me an e-mail. mfschacht@gmail.com

cannon1000

Just my $0.02 worth.

$25000 for a mostly track car is going to be tough. I agree - if you must drive a 911 then the 996C2 is about your only choice. They are the cheapest 911's you can buy - and you might even get lucky and find one that already has some track mods on it. But operational costs and going down the slippery slope you can easily move into the $40k range by the end of the season.

Here was my own situation: As I got faster I needed better suspension, later I needed better pads (which sound horrible on the street). I also had dedicated track tires and wheels. Harness bars are pretty much not allowed by most clubs and having only a 3-pt seat belt started worrying me. So I had to make a choice...race seats I could still use comfortably on the street and a bolt-in roll bar w/harnesses. Then all I would end up with is a heavier but safer street car. All of this for not cheap. Not to mention the cost of the wear items (Oil, tires, brakes, etc.). Parts on 911's are never "cheap".

What then to go faster? To truly make it a "track" car?? Gut it - get rid of the crap you don't need on the track. Save weight, Improve handling, maximize safety (roll cage), exhaust, engine enhancements, etc. By now you are a ton of $$ into it and it can no longer be a "street" car, maybe just barely if you're lucky.

So the point of all this is - if $25 grand is your budget - I would take a good look at a 944. They are great track cars - you can get one street legal enough to get to the track but has all the track goodies in it. With that budget you can get a car, helmet, suit, cool shirt, hans and still have some money for tires, brakes, oil for a season.

sqweak

I appreciate all input, I love to learn and as I'm new at this there is plenty to be learned!

Martin: I will drop you an email, thanks!

25k is not my season + car budget, just car. I understand consumable costs and the slippery slope of a few grand here for wheels, a few grand there for seats, etc that I will be headed down if I get something stock.

I have a stock 944 beater (pic in avatar) now, that was purchased for cheap to get started with tracking. I came to the conclusion that for the amount of money I could spend bringing it up to spec I would prefer to put into a 911 that more "does it for me" than the 944. That said, I'm going to see about a spec prepped 924S tomorrow. I may end up picking it up to run for half or whole season while I decide where I want to go in the hobby and want in a 911.

cannon1000

'tis funny because I am going from a 996 Turbo to a purpose built 924S for this very reason. More track time in an affordable platform.

Chris M.

And don't forget to be sure that whatever you choose is 100% expendable. Know that the second you leave the hot pit it could be wadded up in a ball and worth absolutely nothing. Be it a mechanical failure on your car or someone else's or a driving error, it can and will happen if you spend enough time at the track. If you can picture yourself walking away from a crumpled heap that used to be worth $25000 then go for it.

67King

I personally don't like driving hard on the track in a stock car. i've some some really, really nasty stuff at DE's, though no rollovers. I am surprised they allow cars without cages to do time trials, to be honest. A roll bar would be an absolute MUST, though.

But yes, a cage is a safety issue in a street car, because you aren't wearing a hlemet, and your head can hit the cage in an accident. Al Unser (think it was him) had a daughter killed by hitting her head on a dune buggy's roll bar.

The cage wasn't my only point. It is really about driving a compromise. Making sure you keep it streetable (even barely) will impede your ability to do two things to it - 1) make it as good a trac car as you can dn 2) drive the car, which is your only way home, as hard on the track as you can. I drove my track car, before the cage, to Road Atlanta once, and my back hurt for 6 weeks. I was mid 30's, so not youg, but not that old.

The best track car you can get for your budget won't be a 911. You can probably swing a Boxster S and have $10K left for upgrades right away. You can find a good 968 and have even more (968's are going to be a lot more reliable than 944T's). While not as fast, they aren't that much slower. And as mentioned by Chris M., the most important factor is this: If you can't afford to LEAVE it at the track, don't TAKE it to the track.

Upstate101

Having been bitten hard by the track bug since starting down the slippery slope of this hobby not even quite a year ago, I recently went with a fully prepped 944 S2 track car (gutted, full cage, seats, harnesses, racing suspension) for around 15k and it has been a blast. The S2 is certainly fast enough for me and the low weight and suspension goodies make it tremendously fun and capable in the corners. It has about 50-60 hp more than the base 944. Just something else to consider.

MUSSBERGER

Good choice

mck911

If you're interested in a 968 I've got a great example that's ready to go (set up to be a good DE / street car).

Recent repairs / mods (within last 1200 miles or so):

-Timing belt, water pump, rollers, and all oil seals on front of motor
-Valve cover gasket replaced
-New battery
-Rear main seal replaced
-Transmission pulled to replace pinion bearings (Factory Limited Slip Differential)
-New spark plugs
-Drive belts
-Motor mounts
-Oil pan resealed and new level sender
-Whatever was needed got replaced

Modifications:
-New clutch with lightweight flywheel
-RS Barn chip designed with open air box and open free flow exhaust (cat bypass / modified resonator / magna flow muffler / stock tip).
-Koni coil overs front and rear. Torsion bars removed.
-M030 front and rear sway bars
-BBS wheels with new Toyo R888 tires.
-Corner balanced and aligned for track
-Kirk Racing 4 point bolt in roll bar
-Sabelt Titan Seats with Sabelt 6 point harnesses. Stock belts also in place and functional
-Sparco Steering wheel with Momo adapter and NRG quick release
-Design 1 racing lower caster brace
-KLA strut brace
-Camber plates
-Pagid Black Pads all the way around with OE Pagid street pads as well
-Zimmerman cross drilled rotors all the way around.
-Custom lightweight door panels
-Rear seats removed
-Stainless brake lines
-Super Blue Racing fluid
-GT Racing front splitter (fitted to car, not painted in pics)

Asking $17k

Email for pics

mck911

http://s607.beta.photobucket.com/use...tml?sort=3&o=0

juddtaylor

14k for a new X51 engine a few years ago...

juddtaylor

I wanted a 993 bad when I ended up getting my 996 and tracking it. I didn't want one anymore after driving circles around a 993 cup car on the track (me with the stock engine, and a tip trans).

mtesh73

i went through almost the same thing. i decided on a 2000 purpose built track car. came prepped with roll bar, GT3 seats and harnesses, coilovers, GT3 decklid, stock GT3 wheels as well as a set of modulars, 993TT brakes, cup car like exhaust, interior was gutted, fire extinguisher. car was a convert from a tiptronic, with high miles, but passed the PPI flawlessly. prior track car was a 996TT, this car is literally twice as fun to drive and STOP on the track as the turbo. the only thing left for me to do is shed the door panels and possibly some miscellaneous wiring, as the AC, radio etc are gone. what a world of difference between the 2 cars, its not like work on the track anymore, its actually fun.

a package like this than can be had for around 32-33 ish, i know its more than your budget but figured i would chime in with what others are getting for a like vehicle. best of luck.
mike