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Safety...gone too far?

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Old 11-28-2011 | 07:10 PM
  #16  
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Originally Posted by RayDBonz
FWIW - there are companies that already make FR cotton dress shirts, t-shirts, henleys, etc in the $40 - $60 range. Marketed to electricians, welders, LEO's, etc. They also make FR cotton pants and FR denim jeans.

FR cotton is only rated to NFPA 2112 and is meant to protect against flash fires of short duration. The standard calls for flash fire testing to be conducted at three seconds with a pass/fail rate of 50% total body burn under ASTM F1930 (Standard Test Method for Evaluation of Flame Resistant Clothing for Protection Against Flash Fire Simulations Using an Instrumented Manikin) testing protocols.

Better than being naked, but not all that much protection in a burning vehicle.
Yes you are correct. Lots of stuff out there for different industries. For some reason, not much for motorsports. The idea is to make them to add SOME protection, as right now most of us either have zero or use nomex/carbonx underwear. I've sourced a company that produces FR cotton that has the same fire resistance as nomex and that's what I'm targeting. For me, I'm not one to use a fire suit unless I'm racing...probably should, but don't. Just too hot, no place to change, it's not convenient, etc. So, if done right, I would love to have a shirt that would offer protection of nomex underwear that I could use around the paddock all day without sweating to death. I was hoping there are others out there with the same desires. But, to your point, I guess it boils down to one question, "If I did encounter a car fire, would I want some protection, or none at all?" The answer to that is easy for me. But, I'm spoiled and I want to be comfortable as well. Thanks for the feedback!! It is well-received.
Old 11-28-2011 | 10:24 PM
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Half the people in DE seem to either wear Jeans or Race Suits. I think the idea is great for AutoX or DE's...or just walking around the grid and pits.
Old 11-29-2011 | 09:33 AM
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I like the idea as I wear an FR shirt (henley from FR Depot), pants (jeans by Carhart), nomex socks (Sparco) and shoes (Oakley) and would love Nomex type protection via casual clothes versus a racing suit.
Old 11-29-2011 | 09:42 AM
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Originally Posted by cannon1000
Half the people in DE seem to either wear Jeans or Race Suits. I think the idea is great for AutoX or DE's...or just walking around the grid and pits.
Hmmm. AutoX.
Originally Posted by TAI2
I like the idea as I wear an FR shirt (henley from FR Depot), pants (jeans by Carhart), nomex socks (Sparco) and shoes (Oakley) and would love Nomex type protection via casual clothes versus a racing suit.
Smart way to go. Thanks for the input!
Old 11-29-2011 | 10:25 AM
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I've always thought that if you buy safety equipment that it should be of the quality that racing organizations endorse. Fires are extremely rare at DE's and I don't think that an FR shirt would provide much protection. If you are worried about fires then buy a 3-ply NOMEX suit.

BUT... I think its a great idea!
Why? It gets everyone thinking about safety equipment and that is ALWAYS a good idea. Many DE'ers in the lower groups, i.e. folks who are not gutting their interiors for a cage, would consider the purchase of reasonably priced protective garments especially if they are sold at the track. Also great idea to offer the garment to clubs/regions for branding and inclusion in their goodies-for-sale lines.

Good luck!

-- Mindy
Old 11-29-2011 | 10:55 AM
  #21  
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For DEs/instructing particularly when it's cooler, I wear a lightweight, zip up, long sleeve, high collar sweatshirt. It's almost a heavy T shirt material, so not hot over a tshirt, the collar zips up to cover your neck under the helmet/hans, it has a small pocket for the chatterbox/credentials. The clubs hand out Tshirts, short sleeve buttondowns and fleeces for instructors, but something like this made out of FR material with the club logos would be great. My old standby is wearing out and I haven't found anything like it...
Old 11-29-2011 | 11:10 AM
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Originally Posted by mhm993
I've always thought that if you buy safety equipment that it should be of the quality that racing organizations endorse. Fires are extremely rare at DE's and I don't think that an FR shirt would provide much protection. If you are worried about fires then buy a 3-ply NOMEX suit.

BUT... I think its a great idea!
Why? It gets everyone thinking about safety equipment and that is ALWAYS a good idea. Many DE'ers in the lower groups, i.e. folks who are not gutting their interiors for a cage, would consider the purchase of reasonably priced protective garments especially if they are sold at the track. Also great idea to offer the garment to clubs/regions for branding and inclusion in their goodies-for-sale lines.

Good luck!

-- Mindy
Thanks Mindy! Great insight.

Originally Posted by J richard
For DEs/instructing particularly when it's cooler, I wear a lightweight, zip up, long sleeve, high collar sweatshirt. It's almost a heavy T shirt material, so not hot over a tshirt, the collar zips up to cover your neck under the helmet/hans, it has a small pocket for the chatterbox/credentials. The clubs hand out Tshirts, short sleeve buttondowns and fleeces for instructors, but something like this made out of FR material with the club logos would be great. My old standby is wearing out and I haven't found anything like it...
Thanks for your help! Sounds like you've already addressed the safety aspect somewhat. Most in the south only wear t-shirts and many wear shorts...even instructors in which I'm guilty of myself. I'm never wearing shorts again though as I think that is really pushing it if I had to exit the car quickly.
Old 11-29-2011 | 11:37 AM
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Just adding my $0.02 worth. When racing, I wear the required suit, gloves, etc… I save my Carbon-X under garments for race weekends. On DE weekends, I typically wear old cotton slacks and the short sleeve instructor shirt issued by my local club. On the rare weekend when it is cold, I might wear a cotton based sweatshirt. I personally do not like getting in the passenger seat and seeing the Green or Blue student fully suited up. It seems to set expectations that are not productive in a DE learning environment. For the more advanced students, it is OK but I personally would not go out of my way to encourage it. IMHO, the niche market you are after is being met by existing products. Maybe expand your horizons to include the racing community with a lightweight, breathable FR long sleeve T-shirt that has a competitive price point with the lower end NOMEX shirts. The selling point that would make you unique is that your shirt would be comfortable to wear while the similar priced NOMEX is hot and heavy. Your market should include the Circle Track and Drag Racing crowds as well as Road Racing and DE/ Track Days. BTW, I had a similar idea when I did my MBA but my “team” just could not get there head around the idea so it was dropped. Good luck.
Old 11-29-2011 | 11:57 AM
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IMHO, a nomex suit is mandatory anytime you set foot on a track, even moreso in street cars that don't have installed fire suppression systems.
Old 11-29-2011 | 12:12 PM
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Originally Posted by CAM14
Just adding my $0.02 worth. When racing, I wear the required suit, gloves, etc… I save my Carbon-X under garments for race weekends. On DE weekends, I typically wear old cotton slacks and the short sleeve instructor shirt issued by my local club. On the rare weekend when it is cold, I might wear a cotton based sweatshirt. I personally do not like getting in the passenger seat and seeing the Green or Blue student fully suited up. It seems to set expectations that are not productive in a DE learning environment. For the more advanced students, it is OK but I personally would not go out of my way to encourage it. IMHO, the niche market you are after is being met by existing products. Maybe expand your horizons to include the racing community with a lightweight, breathable FR long sleeve T-shirt that has a competitive price point with the lower end NOMEX shirts. The selling point that would make you unique is that your shirt would be comfortable to wear while the similar priced NOMEX is hot and heavy. Your market should include the Circle Track and Drag Racing crowds as well as Road Racing and DE/ Track Days. BTW, I had a similar idea when I did my MBA but my “team” just could not get there head around the idea so it was dropped. Good luck.
Thanks! This is excellent. It def is a niche market and if pursued would be out of the love of the sport (I love it way too much) rather than the potential profit, which I think is negligible. The original idea was for racing community and still will be. But, I just don't see that many wearing nomex undergarments. Thankfully, this MBA project is solo...we have WAY too many group projects.
Originally Posted by Nizer
IMHO, a nomex suit is mandatory anytime you set foot on a track, even moreso in street cars that don't have installed fire suppression systems.
Do you wear one at every DE? I agree safety is necessary, but it's often 90+ degrees at our DE's and street cars usually don't have a cool shirt system. Of course, if we ever encountered a fire, everyone would wished they had a suit on. Overall, I'm looking at increasing the safety of the sport, even if just a little, with a product that most will wear and enjoy.
Old 11-29-2011 | 01:12 PM
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Originally Posted by Nizer
IMHO, a nomex suit is mandatory anytime you set foot on a track, even moreso in street cars that don't have installed fire suppression systems.
Meh, not really.

It is MUCH easier to bail out of an uncaged street car than a fully caged race car.
Old 11-29-2011 | 01:16 PM
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I like the idea expressed about a FR long sleeve T. Most clubs I track with suggest only natural fibre clothing as well as long sleeve shirt. The idea being to keep bare skin to a minimum.

I think you might be onto something here ... good luck with this

BG
Old 11-29-2011 | 01:29 PM
  #28  
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If it were me I would want a mock turtle neck to protect the neck lower face.
Old 11-29-2011 | 01:30 PM
  #29  
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Here is an idea for you to expand your market too. Most corner workers wear some kind white shirt and painter paints. They typically do not have any kind of real personal safety equipment. A lightweight, long sleeve white FR shirt with a chest pocket which is at the lower end price scale would/should be well received in the world of corner workers. At the club race level, these guys/gales are neither buying Carbon-X nor NOMEX type of personal protection but I think there is a real need for something. Maybe you can fill that need?
Old 11-29-2011 | 01:34 PM
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Originally Posted by Veloce Raptor
Meh, not really.

It is MUCH easier to bail out of an uncaged street car than a fully caged race car.
Ahhh. Very good point. Which means a little protection could go a long way in a quick exit. Might be the difference between red skin and a burn that needs a doctor's care.
Originally Posted by MY86Carrera
I like the idea expressed about a FR long sleeve T. Most clubs I track with suggest only natural fibre clothing as well as long sleeve shirt. The idea being to keep bare skin to a minimum.

I think you might be onto something here ... good luck with this

BG
Thanks! I appreciate the encouragement.
Originally Posted by FGL28
If it were me I would want a mock turtle neck to protect the neck lower face.
Def already part of the design. So, when you wear a balaclava, you are fully covered. Thanks!


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