Attention all VIR drivers
06-10-2011, 11:30 AM
#16
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how many YEARS have people been using the dirt with no issues? Seems to me like whomever they contracted to backfill used a poor choice of substrate.
Another easy solution that wouldnt involve corner workers now staring and taking their attention off other issues would be to install those plastic poles.
Another easy solution that wouldnt involve corner workers now staring and taking their attention off other issues would be to install those plastic poles.
06-10-2011, 03:32 PM
#18
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When I am instructing I try to get the student to understand why there is no grass on the other side of the gator and how close you need to be. Not on the gator or in the dirt. Not gonna lie ..I have put 2 off on the out lap after the checkered flag at T6...one of the best gestures I have seen from that flag stand...
06-10-2011, 04:15 PM
#19
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I've always taught that the track included several feet of green/brown stuff on either side of the black stuff assuming your car has sufficient ground clearance. buncha spoilsports
06-10-2011, 04:37 PM
#20
I for one am glad they will try to enforce it.
Had a guy in a 325 a few years ago who took the uphill esses in a straight line. I could not get him to understand that he was putting 2 wheels off. He said someone told him that was the fast way through the esses...dumbass...Took him out in my car (similar HP) and took 15 seconds off his best time...
On another note that will cost some big bucks. Do they have it?
Had a guy in a 325 a few years ago who took the uphill esses in a straight line. I could not get him to understand that he was putting 2 wheels off. He said someone told him that was the fast way through the esses...dumbass...Took him out in my car (similar HP) and took 15 seconds off his best time...
On another note that will cost some big bucks. Do they have it?
06-10-2011, 04:47 PM
#21
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I for one am glad they will try to enforce it.
Had a guy in a 325 a few years ago who took the uphill esses in a straight line. I could not get him to understand that he was putting 2 wheels off. He said someone told him that was the fast way through the esses...dumbass...Took him out in my car (similar HP) and took 15 seconds off his best time...
Had a guy in a 325 a few years ago who took the uphill esses in a straight line. I could not get him to understand that he was putting 2 wheels off. He said someone told him that was the fast way through the esses...dumbass...Took him out in my car (similar HP) and took 15 seconds off his best time...
06-11-2011, 01:56 AM
#23
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Too bad he blamed the track for HIS mistake. Of course, that's too easy.
It's the loose nut behind the wheel. Or "the Auberlen line."
And the fastest line is not "wheels in the dirt," unless you're in a Spec Miata or Spec E30. Especially in a proper race car.
Hats off to Craig Stanton in his video where he drives totally over the dirt in 5A, 6 and 6A, but others are quicker in GT in the same car and don't go off the pavement or existing curbing.
And yes, I was hired to place and consult on the NJMP TBolt curbs. The Lightning curbs are more like the VIR curb design. I placed the VIR curbs in 1999 and they're fine. It's a driver's issue...
I agree the policy is unwieldy and puts the onus on the F&C folks instead of the event organizer, where it should be. But you should approach Kerrigan.
He's a good Director of Track Operations and he's trying to look out for ALL the track users. He's also always open to discussion.
I speak in NO OFFICIAL CAPACITY at VIR. YMMV.
It's the loose nut behind the wheel. Or "the Auberlen line."
And the fastest line is not "wheels in the dirt," unless you're in a Spec Miata or Spec E30. Especially in a proper race car.
Hats off to Craig Stanton in his video where he drives totally over the dirt in 5A, 6 and 6A, but others are quicker in GT in the same car and don't go off the pavement or existing curbing.
And yes, I was hired to place and consult on the NJMP TBolt curbs. The Lightning curbs are more like the VIR curb design. I placed the VIR curbs in 1999 and they're fine. It's a driver's issue...
I agree the policy is unwieldy and puts the onus on the F&C folks instead of the event organizer, where it should be. But you should approach Kerrigan.
He's a good Director of Track Operations and he's trying to look out for ALL the track users. He's also always open to discussion.
I speak in NO OFFICIAL CAPACITY at VIR. YMMV.
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06-13-2011, 09:05 AM
#26
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Here is what I found:
The profile depends on whether it is an entry, exit or apex kerb and the speed profile for the corner.
FIA kerbs are all 800mm wide.
Apex kerbs rise from 0mm at the track edge to 50mm at 400mm from the track and then stay flat to the rear edge (800mm from the track). These are known as bevelled kerbs.
Exit Kerbs are a bit more complicated to explain but have a 50 to 100mm 'ripple' depending on speed profile. Each ripple is an 800 x 800mm square with a dual grade on the surface on the diagonal to create the ripple against the previous and following 800mm square. The ripple obviously has its tapered rise in the direction of travel. Just to confuse you further this can be a positive kerb (also known as a Vallelunga kerb) i.e. rising from the track surface or a negative kerb (also known as a Melbourne kerb) falling away from the track. Again this is dependant on speed profile. Negative kerbs have only a 25 to 50mm ripple.
Optionally a 2m wide strip of artificial turf to discourage use of the verge behind the kerb is installed at kerbs.
The profile depends on whether it is an entry, exit or apex kerb and the speed profile for the corner.
FIA kerbs are all 800mm wide.
Apex kerbs rise from 0mm at the track edge to 50mm at 400mm from the track and then stay flat to the rear edge (800mm from the track). These are known as bevelled kerbs.
Exit Kerbs are a bit more complicated to explain but have a 50 to 100mm 'ripple' depending on speed profile. Each ripple is an 800 x 800mm square with a dual grade on the surface on the diagonal to create the ripple against the previous and following 800mm square. The ripple obviously has its tapered rise in the direction of travel. Just to confuse you further this can be a positive kerb (also known as a Vallelunga kerb) i.e. rising from the track surface or a negative kerb (also known as a Melbourne kerb) falling away from the track. Again this is dependant on speed profile. Negative kerbs have only a 25 to 50mm ripple.
Optionally a 2m wide strip of artificial turf to discourage use of the verge behind the kerb is installed at kerbs.
06-13-2011, 12:07 PM
#28
Race Director
Any good racer will use a much curb as the car can stand that will make a good lap time. Some curbs despite their profile just beg to "used and abused". Others just don't make sense. Putting two wheels off is great way to striaghten a section of track assuming you can live with the consequences.
There are tracks where I used ALOT of curbing. Gators or not I used them. There are places I don't touch a curb because when I do it upsets the balance of the car and makes me slower.
Point is racers will find the fastest way around the track and that often means taking liberties with the layout. Course designers constantly need to combat this and do so at various tracks to varrying degrees.
There are tracks where I used ALOT of curbing. Gators or not I used them. There are places I don't touch a curb because when I do it upsets the balance of the car and makes me slower.
Point is racers will find the fastest way around the track and that often means taking liberties with the layout. Course designers constantly need to combat this and do so at various tracks to varrying degrees.
06-13-2011, 12:21 PM
#30
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Yes, the "Vallelunga" Profile.
Works well and that is what the letter specifies as being the goal, assuming finances work out.
You drive the track... and yes, I believe the curbings are an extension of the track.
Going off the track means you don't know how to place your car precisely, IMO.
Works well and that is what the letter specifies as being the goal, assuming finances work out.
You drive the track... and yes, I believe the curbings are an extension of the track.
Going off the track means you don't know how to place your car precisely, IMO.