RA1 vs R6 vs R1
05-31-2011, 02:34 PM
#16
Nordschleife Master
05-31-2011, 02:58 PM
#17
Rennlist Member
yep, im spoiled now that I have access to cheap , good , used A6s. (4 heat cycle). I have won races on RA1s, but after seening the difference, and trying to fix grip issues with set up and pressures, the A6s or R6s are the easy solution. your right, the RA1s shouldn be a first choise, by any stretch. (even in the rain, ive done well on bald A6s) But, the grip is just so much better with the Hoosiers, it makes racing much more fun and the car a lot less of a handful.
RA1 is a different animal -- it's a relatively inexpensive DOT tire that cannot be compared to a racing slick. But it will heat cycle forever and can be used for several seasons, making it the ultimate tire for the occasional HPDE. For racing, unless the RA1 is a spec tire, [AND IT'S NOT WET] it's never going to be the best choice. [Edited. ;-)]
05-31-2011, 03:59 PM
#18
IMO, the key for A6 vs R6 use is tire temps. If your pyrometer shows around 190 degrees, you should run R6. If you are below 150, you should use A6. A second factor is that A6 doesn't really call for scrub-in, whereas the R6 [arguably] benefits from it.
Based on these fundamentals, most folks will want to use the R6 for sustained laps on a track, unless they are just not generating heat in the tires [perhaps because of speed, lots of straights, or very cold temps]. If you are knocking off a flying qualifying lap, maybe the A6 is better.
YMMV. And I have no experience in anything, including cars, women or XBox. And I didn't stay at a holiday in Express either.
-td
Based on these fundamentals, most folks will want to use the R6 for sustained laps on a track, unless they are just not generating heat in the tires [perhaps because of speed, lots of straights, or very cold temps]. If you are knocking off a flying qualifying lap, maybe the A6 is better.
YMMV. And I have no experience in anything, including cars, women or XBox. And I didn't stay at a holiday in Express either.
-td
05-31-2011, 04:27 PM
#19
Rennlist Member
IMO, the key for A6 vs R6 use is tire temps. If your pyrometer shows around 190 degrees, you should run R6. If you are below 150, you should use A6. A second factor is that A6 doesn't really call for scrub-in, whereas the R6 [arguably] benefits from it.
Based on these fundamentals, most folks will want to use the R6 for sustained laps on a track, unless they are just not generating heat in the tires [perhaps because of speed, lots of straights, or very cold temps]. If you are knocking off a flying qualifying lap, maybe the A6 is better.
YMMV. And I have no experience in anything, including cars, women or XBox. And I didn't stay at a holiday in Express either.
-td
Based on these fundamentals, most folks will want to use the R6 for sustained laps on a track, unless they are just not generating heat in the tires [perhaps because of speed, lots of straights, or very cold temps]. If you are knocking off a flying qualifying lap, maybe the A6 is better.
YMMV. And I have no experience in anything, including cars, women or XBox. And I didn't stay at a holiday in Express either.
-td
05-31-2011, 04:30 PM
#20
Rennlist Member
I have to disagree with this as well. The temps of a well over 190degrees and lap times of 1:29 car at laguna seca, in the hot pit area are common for high HP cars. These cars, like Kip Olsen's NSX with over 600hp , and Darrel anderson's mustange with also over 600hp and 3000lbs both use A6 for sprint races and all out qual laps. you can run a slightly slower tire, like the R6 and maybe not be concerned or not show care for driving style and get away with it, but in the end, you will be slower on all laps, even the ones where the A6s might have fallen off a bit.
so much depnds on setup and driving style too. I would say that care on the tires would greatly dictate their grip going 100% effort. my video will show a car in front of me, that I was able to pass very late in the race, where he was not taking good care of the tires and they did go off. same tires, almost same exact lap times, same weight of car. (I was at a GREAT HP disadvantage, 370 vs 550hp)
I did stay at a house in pebble beach over the race weekend vs the tent this time.
so much depnds on setup and driving style too. I would say that care on the tires would greatly dictate their grip going 100% effort. my video will show a car in front of me, that I was able to pass very late in the race, where he was not taking good care of the tires and they did go off. same tires, almost same exact lap times, same weight of car. (I was at a GREAT HP disadvantage, 370 vs 550hp)
I did stay at a house in pebble beach over the race weekend vs the tent this time.
IMO, the key for A6 vs R6 use is tire temps. If your pyrometer shows around 190 degrees, you should run R6. If you are below 150, you should use A6. A second factor is that A6 doesn't really call for scrub-in, whereas the R6 [arguably] benefits from it.
Based on these fundamentals, most folks will want to use the R6 for sustained laps on a track, unless they are just not generating heat in the tires [perhaps because of speed, lots of straights, or very cold temps]. If you are knocking off a flying qualifying lap, maybe the A6 is better.
YMMV. And I have no experience in anything, including cars, women or XBox. And I didn't stay at a holiday in Express either.
-td
Based on these fundamentals, most folks will want to use the R6 for sustained laps on a track, unless they are just not generating heat in the tires [perhaps because of speed, lots of straights, or very cold temps]. If you are knocking off a flying qualifying lap, maybe the A6 is better.
YMMV. And I have no experience in anything, including cars, women or XBox. And I didn't stay at a holiday in Express either.
-td
05-31-2011, 04:33 PM
#21
Banned
Sorry for the interruption Gentlemen, but....
Mark, I'm all done with you for now. Since 1998 on the 928 e-mail lists, I've been dealing with your vitriolic outbursts. Lately, it would appear that your sole purpose in life is to post anything in these forums to belittle others' efforts, posts and threads and try to hijack the same.
You are now banned until you contact either Bob or myself and explain how you will refrain from such actions in the future. From my end of the telescope - I'm done defending you. I should have been done defending you in 1998.
Shame on me then. Shame on you now.
Have a great day,
John
Mark, I'm all done with you for now. Since 1998 on the 928 e-mail lists, I've been dealing with your vitriolic outbursts. Lately, it would appear that your sole purpose in life is to post anything in these forums to belittle others' efforts, posts and threads and try to hijack the same.
You are now banned until you contact either Bob or myself and explain how you will refrain from such actions in the future. From my end of the telescope - I'm done defending you. I should have been done defending you in 1998.
Shame on me then. Shame on you now.
Have a great day,
John
05-31-2011, 04:37 PM
#22
Three Wheelin'
Join Date: Sep 2005
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History has been made, although I'm not sure this thread was the appropriate place or time. Mark actually made some valid points in this thread, whereas before some of his posts were straight out attacks.
05-31-2011, 04:40 PM
#23
I have to disagree with this as well. The temps of a well over 190degrees and lap times of 1:29 car at laguna seca, in the hot pit area are common for high HP cars. These cars, like Kip Olsen's NSX with over 600hp , and Darrel anderson's mustange with also over 600hp and 3000lbs both use A6 for sprint races and all out qual laps. you can run a slightly slower tire, like the R6 and maybe not be concerned or not show care for driving style and get away with it, but in the end, you will be slower on all laps, even the ones where the A6s might have fallen off a bit.
-td
05-31-2011, 04:42 PM
#24
Rennlist Member
05-31-2011, 05:05 PM
#25
Banned
https://rennlist.com/forums/8599866-post20.html (I just deleted that post. If you didn't get to read it, well - you missed it
)That broke the camel's back:
https://rennlist.com/forums/8599978-post24.html
I won't bore you with a thirteen year (yes, that is 13 YEARS - this month, almost EXACTLY to the DAY! May 28, 1998) legacy from there to here, today - but I could.
I've been doing this a long time.
My Best Always,
John
Last edited by John D.; 05-31-2011 at 08:31 PM. Reason: updated
05-31-2011, 07:44 PM
#26
Still plays with cars.
Lifetime Rennlist
Member
John, you beat me to it. I was deleting and red carding posts when I jumped to the end ... You're fast! 
05-31-2011, 07:54 PM
#27
Rennlist Member
05-31-2011, 08:04 PM
#28
Banned
05-31-2011, 08:07 PM
#29
Rennlist Member
To continue the productive side of the thread, here is the exact recommendation from Hoosier regarding their tire temps.
"Tire Temperature Recommendations
For best performance the expected temperature range will vary from track to track. Generally, optimum traction will be generated when the pit lane temps show 180-200 degrees for the R6 in Roadrace applications, and 140-150 degrees for the A6 in an Autocross application."
"Tire Temperature Recommendations
For best performance the expected temperature range will vary from track to track. Generally, optimum traction will be generated when the pit lane temps show 180-200 degrees for the R6 in Roadrace applications, and 140-150 degrees for the A6 in an Autocross application."
05-31-2011, 08:34 PM
#30
"Tire Temperature Recommendations
For best performance the expected temperature range will vary from track to track. Generally, optimum traction will be generated when the pit lane temps show 180-200 degrees for the R6 in Roadrace applications, and 140-150 degrees for the A6 in an Autocross application."
For best performance the expected temperature range will vary from track to track. Generally, optimum traction will be generated when the pit lane temps show 180-200 degrees for the R6 in Roadrace applications, and 140-150 degrees for the A6 in an Autocross application."
-td