jcb-memphis

I put a full track suspension on my TT....superb on track and for DD, ok. GT3 seats...custom ...weight down to 3200...


JIC 8/12kg/mm springs..so stiff. Other solutions exist too. (KW, PSS10, etc.). And they are pretty affordable. The power is addictive...even at 1.0 bar...

Jeff

roberga

I put 70,000 miles on mine in 5 years. THe GT3 is fine as a DD. What makes it harder is when one starts the evolution towards a track car. Just do not put drinks in the cup holder and leave the splitter at home until track days.

That being said, a normally aspirated RWD is hard to beat at the track.

PPo

How many people can get in the drivers seat of your current car and drive it faster then you?

Spend the money on track time, brake pads, tires, saftey equipement, and ******.

When any of those items are tired, used up, and looking bad from all the wear and tear, replace them. Consider them all consumables to help improve yourself where it counts... but the time you can work all of them to the limit a few times, most likely your life will have changed enough that your boundaries for making the decision to buy another car will have changed...

Keep the 996...

GTgears

No matter how much I beat my P-cars at the track, I love them too much to abuse them with a 6 mile commute everyday. That's barely enough time to get up to operating temperature. You need to find somewhere to park your Porsche for the weekends when you will properly drive it, buy a cheap beater to drive to work, and go the GT3 route that others have advised.

ervtx

+1

No matter what you buy, you will "continue investing time and money".
C4: 1 Turbo: 1

Whether you stick with the C4 or go with the turbo, you have determined that for now, you are still the limiting performance factor:

C4: 2 Turbo: 2

Perhaps the tie-breaker question is "what to do with the cash in your pocket that = the cost of a new engine?"

Keeping it in the bank as insurance, while continuing to drive the C4 is not a bad option. If you were to need that new engine some day, you'll have the funds to replace it w/o blinking, and keep on tracking for thousands of more miles - probably outliving the newer Turbo. If you really want a new car just to feel more serious about the hobby, then figure out how to gather up a bit more cash and buy something that will truly be different enough to justify the expenditure.

BTW, the effect of Porsche's AWD on the track is negligible. You're either on the gas, or on the brakes, but AWD is working only when on the gas. And unless you're going uphill or in the wet, the AWD is really not a factor other than adding weight and contributing to understeer; PSM has a much greater effect on masking mistakes. But on the street, in the wet/snow, AWD makes a huge difference, so given your region, and need for a DD, AWD is a good compromise.

Tytus

I track my 996tt and DD it every day. I have a great time every day and at the track. In the wet the car is like cheating at the track. Mine is even a Tippy and is still a lot of fun and the wife can drive it too. For the snow I have a set of Blizzaks mounted and really enjoy it throughout the winter. I have another sports car, NSX with a 6 spd and a Suburban and the wife drives a Subaru. Needless to say the tt gives us both the most enjoyment out of all the cars since it is so versatile. Best track car, no, best snowmobile, darn close to the suburban except for the clearance, but it is a combination of all my cars all wrapped up in one car.

Get the tt, you won't regret it. BTW it is also sledge hammer reliable.

Tytus

steepsnow

I have a '99 C4 "multi-purpose" car. I use it as a 1/2 daily driver, 4-seasons including snow driving with a ski-rack; even DE's it on and ice-lake last year (FUN!).

Last year, I decided to get some upgrades and make my C4 the best possible "multi-purpose DD and track toy - and FOCUS on my driving skills. ...until I figure out what type of dedicated track car I really want

The upgrades made a HUGE difference on the track:
PSS10
H&R Sway F+R
Upgraded brake fluid and track-pads
Dedicated track tires/wheels

This setup literally transformed my car and my lap times dropped >10 seconds (at High Plains in CO) - and I know the car could do it much faster. I know it might not be as "pure" as a GT3, but for improving my skills, I like the confidence of the AWD in terms of saving the car if it starts to break free a little.

The car is a chameleon that easily changes if "focus:"
I run the PSS10 at F:8-R:9 and then F:4-R:6 on the street. The adjustment is simply a twist of a dial with easy "clicks" if you did not know that already.

BTW - For summer, the alignment is set to GT3 specs. (looks much better nice and low)

For winter, I use 17-inch F:7 and R:9 wheels with dedicated snow tires. During the winter transition, I can raise the ride-height and get a winter alignment. ...back to the stock "SUV" height.


BTW keep in mind that a DD with a snow consideration, the C4 NB will be better than the turbo.

wanna911

If you are a casual DE driver there is nothing wrong with the Turbo. The 996 GT3 is far less forgiving, and is pretty stiff. You better be hard core to daily drive it. From an all around standpoint (including) weather. The Turbo is definitely a better car, far less sacrifices for the Turbo on the track than for the GT3 on the street. There is no PSM on the GT3 and you can disconnect everything from PSM to AWD on the Turbo if you like and DIY pretty easily.

I wouldn't stick with the NA 996 unless it was a 3.6.

Quinlan

+1 on the cheap track car.
I have a 996tt, which I used to track, and a 944 turbo which I now use as a track car.
One "off" in the tt, or one engine or transmission problem, and you will be spending more on fixing the tt than you will have in the entire track car. In fact, you will be praying that the cost to fix it will be less than the track car. These things are HUGELY expensive to fix!
The twin turbo's power is addictive, but it also makes up for many deficiencies in the driver. The slower, dedicated track car is frankly more fun - you don't want to wad it up, but if you do, it won't be divorce material. In the mean time, you are forced to learn later braking, better lines and the elusive "momentum" you need to carry through turns.

Maxhouse97

I rent a garage for $50 in Woburn - 15 min north of Boston. Easy cheesy. Get the SM, or Spec Boxster if you want a P-car.

racer

The biggest issues are the compromises..

To make the car work as a DD, would imply that you likely would keep a stock suspension, interior and no rollbar/rollcage

To make the car work as a track car, you would want a modded (lowered) suspension, rollbar/cage, harnesses and seats. Then add the squeaky track pads, superwide R comp tires etc.

A "stock" GT3 would be a great compromise car as others have mentioned, but then you have to feel comfortable driving it in the winter and snowstorms (or at least the residuals of the storms since you have relatively no ground clearance).

A TT is nice, but as mentioned, about 500lbs too heavy to begin with. They are notorious for eating brakes too because of this weight, and many others will believe it was "the car" that was quicker and not the drover.

The future issue is.. as all slide down the slipperly slope, is a tow vehichle and a trailer. So you already need "storage space" but don't realize it. Don't forget this hobby is an incredible sinkhole for your money.

I agree with those who have mentioned renting a spot (maybe not cloise, maybe near an independant PCar shop etc) to store the track car. Then get a "workable" size SUV to DD and tow the car. Maybe even ditch the 996, find a sorted 944 "spec/cup" car and work on the droving.

Ubermensch

Thanks for all of the advice that's come forward during this thread. You've definitely given me a few things to think about. I was hoping to get a quick answer one way or the other, but I think I've got even more options to consider now!

Maxhouse, can you shoot me a pm with information on the woburn parking?

Steepsnow, does the PSS10 setup allow you go all the way from stock height to gt3 height? Getting an alignment and adjusting the height once a year each way is an interesting compromise. I was under the impression that the PSS10 setup didn't have sufficient suspension travel to allow that range of adjustment.

PPo's advice: "but the time you can work all of them to the limit a few times, most likely your life will have changed enough that your boundaries for making the decision to buy another car will have changed..." has really got me thinking. It's possible that in the next few years my life will change enough that a decision I make at that point might be quite different from today. I might try to stretch the 996 with a few modifications (suspension+ track tires) and make that hold me over for a few years.

The one question that hasn't really been addressed is whether is there is any reliability concern with the NA engine relative to the TT engine for track work. I'm thinking an accusump setup would make me a little more confident. Is it necessary? Anything else I should consider if I kept tracking the NA?

Thanks, Shawn

racer

The inherant issues to the NA m96 motors is well reported... the worst being catastrophic failure.

Ubermensch

Yes, I'm familiar with them. I'm not familiar with the TT engine and the improvements over the NA engine. Does the TT engine obviate all of the concerns of the NA engine or are there still failures points that are common between the two?

jumper5836

Just keep the C4 and learn to drive it well. Only way to hang with the GT3 is to run the same tires and upgrade the suspension they still have the acceleration power us and not much you can do about that except drop the weight and remove the DD component out of the car.
There are a lot of poorly driver TT's and GT3's out at DE and having the lower HP car is a lot of fun, specially when your passing them or passing newer 997's and if your passed by them then you always have the excuse that they have the faster car.

The main reason to keep the C4 and not upgrade is there is much more cars to play around with at this level. Once your using in a top dog level car there isn't much around to play with and the speeds to play at that level and not be one of the poorly driven cars above are really really high. You'll get much more satisfaction I think being the underdog then giving a pass to a slower but better driven car.