todinlaw

Ok I am a gluten for punishment by posting, but I am interested in ideas and comments. Let me give you the background. I have been working with various Zone 4 Regions to put together an advanced instructor training program, that is supposed to be the next step beyond the National Training program. This will to focus on improving the instructors driving skills. So the programs design is 80% driving skill and 20% communication.

This has been a joint effort with PCA, Pete Tremper, Mid-Ohio School and zone 4 CDI's and other interested parties.
The date, time and place is fixed at this point the content on class room discussion in the 3 classes is not. As the attachment point out this is a one day course with 6 professional instructors working with PCA instructors. The afternoon sessions are an opportunity to get some one-on-one time with a professional.

The cost is $200.00 for the day. If you were to take a similar class with MO it would be 800 to 1000 for the day.
If this bird fly's, it may turn in to a nationally sanctioned program what would go from region to region to be put on at different tracks. (While I do not yet have approval for this) I envision that you would walk away with a credential of "Nationally trained at Mid-Ohio" for example, on your resume.

Thoughts, comments, complaints?

bsztanko

The idea of more training is good. The idea of one more title is ridiculous. I'm a National instructor now, and whenever I go to a new region I have to get a checkout ride regardless of credentials. One more title is not going to change anything and is completely unnecessary.

SundayDriver

Great idea. The MO staff and techniques are the best I have seen. I have pretty much been through this program - they have done instructor day for different groups and I have done the classes and multiple times through their competition school.

Participants will get the best feedback imaginable. For those who feel a coach/instructor must be in the car for advanced training, you will be shocked at what these guys see and feedback to you.

Whether one cares about the title or not, the experience, at that price, should not be missed.

KOAN

I echo Mark's praise for the Mid Ohio School Instructors. In fact, I think I met Mark there first many years ago. Todd, that would be a great price, and thanks for working on it.

SundayDriver

Yes. As I recall, it was my first event after moving to Ohio. You gave me a check-out ride to see if I was OK for the assigned group. I think that after 2 laps you said I was good to go and did I want to work on anything. Being fairly new to Mid Ohio, with rain in the forecast, I had you show me the rain line - which I have used for quite a few laps over the years.

RonCT

Have you run this through legal? The theoretical problem I see is that now you will have 2 classes of instructors in your chapter. Normal ones and Advanced ones. Let's say a student goes out and has an incident in their car and their instructor had not gone through the advanced program. I have a funny feeling that could come back to bite you. As it stands now, everyone instructing for PCA has gone through the PCA National Program, right? A consistent standard. I love the idea of additional instructor training, but wonder if it could be handled as an optional "workshop" so that those that would like additional information / training can sign up. I think as soon as you attach a title or some other differentiation from the national program, you might be opening yourself up for possible issues later.

Geoffrey

That is not correct.

Lemming

This is certainly not true with the PCA clubs that I instruct with!

KOAN

Mark,

Did you have a silver 993 turbo then? I seem to remember a few fast laps!

RonCT

I learn something new every day... I'd still be concerned about having two different levels of standard for instruction in my chapter. Either you are or are not a qualified instructor.

Bull

No, not true by a long way.

Leigh2

I think it's a great idea.
I've been the CDI in our region for more than a decade and within the 60+ instructors in the region there are clear gradients of skills and experience levels. The instructor schools, including our own, are inevitably geared towards the beginning instructor and after a few of those the curriculum is the same old stuff being regurgitated. The PCA has done an excellent job of standardizing this initial training material and taking it across North America but I've always felt that another step was needed.
The current PCA course is treated by us and I'm sure most regions as an introductory course and is the only way to get a nationally recognized credential. It is very common and a good idea to have rank beginner instructors who are at the very bottom of their learning curve take the course and they pass without an issue. But I will still only assign them to beginner students until they gain enough experience to handle someone in a fast car taking their 10th school. I have had several CDIs from adjoining regions call me to get the real scoop on how good a visiting instructor is. They are wondering at what level they can use the instructor at or whether they should use that person at all. I know that I won't use a visiting PCA instructor without a call to their CDI to have that same chat.
To give an example I attended a couple of track days last year at a brand new track in Oregon (Oregon Raceway Park or ORP for short). The event was a school for PCA instructors to familiarize themselves with the new track before having to instruct there and was by invitation only. Nobody attending had driven the track before and it was VERY apparent by the end of the first day that there was a vast difference in the driving abilities of those that attended....and they were all instructors. The CDI for the event even commented that many of his own instructors were obviously "one track wonders".
Now I'm sure that many of the instructors having a tough time that day were excellent instructors at their home track. They knew their home track well and could communicate effectively but they clearly didn't understand the theory well enough to apply it to their own driving on an unfamiliar track. The event really demonstrated that a lot of the instructors needed to upgrade their driving knowledge and skills. Hence I think a course for experienced instructors that focuses on driving skills is an excellent idea. I think that there should be stringent entrance requirements to that course so that the graduates can be relied upon everywhere as truly knowing their stuff.

FTS

I don't know if my opinion counts on this as I am only a instructor candidate at this time. However, I think it may be important to rate instructors similar to how students are fragmented into groups to ensure proper care is given to newbies. Even though I am a NASA instructor after a single clinic with them, I haven't yet had the guts to sign up as a instructor as I don't feel I am quite ready and need to attend additional clinics. Also, I know I cannot instruct on tracks that I have driven yet.

The attached document seems to me as a very interesting suplement and something I would love to attend to further my instructing skills.

986

Great idea. I would be very interested. Having done the Mid-Ohio School I agree with others above that the instruction and instructors are first rate. A course with them also eliminates many "what's the fast line through Madness" type guesswork/misconception.

I also agree that an extra title is unnecessary / not helpful. All it says is the person has attended an extra class. Nothing more nothing less.

todinlaw

No we have not ran it through Legal, If I could amend my original post it should say "IT MAY LEAD TO A NATIONAL PROGRAM" This is in its infancy stages, if it goes well it is something of interest to PCA. but at this point it is our program we worked out with Mid Ohio.

As to you your point, I do not see any legal issue becuase Not everyone is Nationally Trained. So if its a problem its a problem we already have currently and this program is not going to change that. However the effort to make instructors better drivers can only improve our performance as instructors, in my view.