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Old 01-22-2010 | 05:34 PM
  #16  
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Originally Posted by CarGuy21
My main concern at a DE is my own personal safety as well as that of any one else who may be in my car with me and others around me. There are all kinds of war stories out there that others have shared such as the Carrera GT crash a few years ago and personal accounts by the owner of Sideline Sports Photography who travels the country taking photos at any number of DEs every year.
All the insurance in the world doesn't make it any safer!

Have you looked into whether a typical "umbrella" liability policy might help you in this situation?
Old 01-23-2010 | 12:10 PM
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Originally Posted by SundayDriver
Agree - And the real key aspect to the Cal Speedway incident is that it was settled. The waiver was NOT TESTED in court and those who claim it didn't stand up, do not understand that it was not tested.

Then, as pointed out, the driver appeared to have been warned of problems with the car. He even posted here, on Rennlist, that he was having brake issues and was uncertain as to whether the car was safe to take to that event (a post that quickly disappeared after the incident).
My point isn't that the waiver would or would not ultimately stand up in court. My point is that a person defending themselves against a lawsuit would have to spend money on legal counsel just to get to that point to find out. And that includes even getting to a summary judgement as was referred to in a previous post. It costs money just to defend against a lawsuit even to get to the preliminary judicial review level. And legal fees aren't cheap. So anyone who is thinking that if they are personally sued for an on track incident can just say, "You signed a waiver. Go away" is kidding themselves.

Now, these are worst case scenarios. For most of us, this will never happen.
Old 01-25-2010 | 09:43 AM
  #18  
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Originally Posted by RonCT
We do it all the time. We'll give students a ride to show them the line, a certain way to work the car, etc.
Sorry, my post was not clear. How does a student drive with a non instructor in the right seat?
Old 01-25-2010 | 10:40 AM
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Ahh, in our chapter that could never happen.
Old 01-25-2010 | 01:26 PM
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Originally Posted by Potomac-Greg
All the insurance in the world doesn't make it any safer!

Have you looked into whether a typical "umbrella" liability policy might help you in this situation?
I agree that insurance doesn't make it safer. A better choice of words would have been "well being."

We have an umbrella policy. I'll have to check with the carrier to see if it would be applicable to a DE.
Old 01-25-2010 | 01:28 PM
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Originally Posted by kurt M
Sorry, my post was not clear. How does a student drive with a non instructor in the right seat?
That doesn't happen at the DEs I've attended either.
Old 01-25-2010 | 02:29 PM
  #22  
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Originally Posted by kurt M
Sorry, my post was not clear. How does a student drive with a non instructor in the right seat?
I've been to NASA HPDE events where anyone in group 3 (similar to PCA "black" group) or group 4 (similar to PCA "red" group) were allowed to give ride-alongs to anyone who had signed the waiver (even non-drivers). The only stipulation was that if you went 4-off with a passenger, you were done for the day.
Old 01-25-2010 | 04:01 PM
  #23  
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Originally Posted by race911
And I just remembered there was similar, more recent, precedent: http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/articl...BAHN19OMPU.DTL
Are you sure that wasn't the "Onion" that ruling made way too much sense.
Old 01-25-2010 | 04:53 PM
  #24  
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Originally Posted by MUSSBERGER
Are you sure that wasn't the "Onion" that ruling made way too much sense.
Every decade or so something common sense comes out of one of our courts.......
Old 01-25-2010 | 06:01 PM
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Originally Posted by race911
Every decade or so something common sense comes out of one of our courts.......
That DID make sense.


Someone messed up.

I still wonder about the widow's lawsuit type of thing becoming a real issue to someone. He signs the waver for whatever value it carries but his estate did not.




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