Ritter v4.0

I was advised that in learning a sequential box in a Cup car, a sinking fund for a new trans. is a good idea if not a necessity. True?

Veloce Raptor

Boy, I dunno. I didn't think it was that hard, especially if you start out slowly & gently.






Professional Racing and Driving Coach

smlporsche

We're not making love here....

Veloce Raptor

Hahahaha!

Well.....actually, in all seriousness, you are. You need to figure out how to make love to these cars, in order to (a) get the most out of them, and (b) not rebuild transmissions and motors every 20 hours.






Professional Racing and Driving Coach

Ritter v4.0

I guess it was meant as warning (and a $16k one at that).

Larry Herman

Some of these techniques are a lot easier to do when you can bring it back to the pits and tell the crew to throw in the spare trans while you go get a cold drink & look at the data.

Jeff Lamb

Patrick, thanks for sharing the video, however, this definitely looks like a sequential transmission . . . wait a minute . . . strike that.

All I can say is this looks like a "dog ring" transmission. I cannot determine whether it is an H pattern or a sequential pattern.

Jeff

claykos

It's not - check out this video go to around 30 seconds in.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WWFHg...eature=related

Aussie V8 super cars run H-pattern dog ring boxes.

Bryan Watts

How can you tell? As far as I've seen in the video, it never shows the shift lever. Impossible to tell whether it's a sequential or H-pattern from looking at his feet alone. Your foot technique would be the same given a proper race box, no matter whether the gears are chosen sequentially or via a H-pattern.

Actually, according to Wikipedia, V8 supercars have only been allowed to use a sequential Hollinger instead of the H-pattern Hollinger since 2008. The transmission is a "spec" part for the cars and was definitely an H-pattern when this video was shot in 2006:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/V8_Supe...mon_components

Jeff Lamb

Yes. Now that you clarified the details about the box, I think you are right. Although, I generally lump together an H pattern dog ring gear box together with sequential boxes because they both use dog rings and you can shift them both generally the same (i.e. without the clutch and using well timed throttle blips).

In my mind, there are two main transmissions types:

1. The standard synchromesh transmission that requires the use of the clutch (for the most part).

2. Dog ring boxes (sequential or H pattern) that do not require use of the clutch once you are moving.

Jeff

333pg333

Correct Brian.

Jeff Lamb

My mistake. I guess I thought when Patrick said the car in the video was running a standard NON sequential box that he was saying the guy was running a standard H pattern synchromesh transmission like you find in pretty much every street car (whether high performance or not). All I know is there is no way that Aussie V8 supercar is running a synchromesh box.

In my reply, when I wrote "sequential" box, I actually meant "dog ring" box. I apologize for the confusion on my part . . . <insert Homer Simpson "DOH!!!" here>

Jeff

Bryan Watts

Agreed with your two categories, but sequential is a very distinct sub category in #2. Distinct enough that many racing classes/orgs have made, and continue to make a distinction between the two. There's only a small performance difference between the two, but the transmissions are very, very different mechanically.

Jeff Lamb

Well said and agreed on all counts!!

Jeff Lamb

Now that we have clarified that the transmission in the Aussie V8 Supercar is a "dog ring" box (still not sure if it is an H pattern or a sequential pattern), I watched the video a couple more times to try to learn something. The interesting thing that I noticed about Greg Murphy's upshifts down the straight beginning at 0:59 is that it looks like he is not lifting off the accelerator at all while using the clutch lightly to make the upshifts. Am I seeing this right? If so, what is providing the momentary ignition (or fuel) cut to release the tension off the driveline to enable the upshift to happen?

Let me give you some additional background -> I do understand that sequentially shifted dog ring boxes can relatively easily use an electronic sensor to sense when the shift lever is pulled towards the rear of the car to make upshifts and correspondingly cut the ignition and/or fuel. However, it would seem that such and electronic sensor would be difficult to implement on an H pattern dog ring box. So I guess my real question is this -> How do you electronically cut the ignition and/or fuel to enable you to shift an H pattern dog ring box without lifting your foot off the accelerator pedal?

Jeff