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Heel & Toe common error

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Old 04-06-2009, 09:52 PM
  #16  
Streak
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Originally Posted by Veloce Raptor
IMO this is the key take-away in this thread. Many, many folks try to shift WAY too fast. That fact is, most of us aren't Leh Keen when it comes to downshifting, and shouldn't try to be.

Slow it down, get it right, and you'll end up faster overall.






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That was going to be my question. All these videos that show some incredible footwork don't portray reality in my car. So what's reasonable? I'm slow to let out the clutch. I certainly have much to learn and refine but a 25 year old 915 tranny that I won't rebuild at the end of every race weekend can't (or I can't make it) handle those stabbing clutch movements.

Am I aspiring to engage and disengage the clutch in fractions of a second or does the car really drive the speed of the footwork?
Old 04-06-2009, 10:03 PM
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Originally Posted by Streak
That was going to be my question. All these videos that show some incredible footwork don't portray reality in my car. So what's reasonable? I'm slow to let out the clutch. I certainly have much to learn and refine but a 25 year old 915 tranny that I won't rebuild at the end of every race weekend can't (or I can't make it) handle those stabbing clutch movements.

Am I aspiring to engage and disengage the clutch in fractions of a second or does the car really drive the speed of the footwork?
IMO it drives the speed of the footwork, with one caveat: a 915 requires slow HANDS. If you use slower hands, your feet can be fast---that is, you can be on & off the clutch pedal quickly.







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Old 04-06-2009, 10:22 PM
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I'll give it a shot. Don't worry, I'll have video running
Old 04-06-2009, 10:39 PM
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Originally Posted by Veloce Raptor
IMO this is the key take-away in this thread. Many, many folks try to shift WAY too fast. That fact is, most of us aren't Leh Keen when it comes to downshifting, and shouldn't try to be.

Slow it down, get it right, and you'll end up faster overall.



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You mean like in this video..... I have watched this video probably 50 times and I'm still amazed how the shifting is lightning fast and to my knowledge, extremely perfect.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zyM-egecTlw
Old 04-06-2009, 10:45 PM
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Originally Posted by CWay27
You mean like in this video..... I have watched this video probably 50 times and I'm still amazed how the shifting is lightning fast and to my knowledge, extremely perfect.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zyM-egecTlw
Yup.

And there is another one at Road Atlanta with IIRC a bunch of 6-5-4-3-2 downshifts into 10a.







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Old 04-06-2009, 10:48 PM
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Originally Posted by CWay27
You mean like in this video..... I have watched this video probably 50 times and I'm still amazed how the shifting is lightning fast and to my knowledge, extremely perfect.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zyM-egecTlw
Incredible! How frequently and how quickly he shifts...
Old 04-06-2009, 10:51 PM
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I was just watching them.... Again, and it's truly amazing. Who needs sequential gearbox when you shift like King Leh!!
Old 04-06-2009, 10:52 PM
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No footcam video - but you can get a good idea from this. This is just after the install of a G96 Cup car tranny and tilton clutch which shifts infinitely better than my old G50.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...39788208&hl=en
Old 04-06-2009, 10:58 PM
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Originally Posted by claykos
No footcam video - but you can get a good idea from this. This is just after the install of a G96 Cup car tranny and tilton clutch which shifts infinitely better than my old G50.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...39788208&hl=en


Nicely done. The key to downshifting quickly IMO (besides having equipment that allows it...), especially on serious track/race cars with lightened flywheels and/or high compression, is blipping as you go into the next lower gear, rather than as you pass thru neutral on the way to that gear. Doing the former will sound like the above posted videos, and will yield a very stable car under braking. Doing the latter will yield a lot of rear tire chirping & revs increasing each time the cluch is fully released.







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Old 04-06-2009, 11:39 PM
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Originally Posted by Veloce Raptor
The key to downshifting quickly IMO ....... is blipping as you go into the next lower gear, rather than as you pass thru neutral on the way to that gear.
EXCELLENT POINT! One that I try to remind myself every time I go out. If only I could remember and execute this every time.
Old 04-07-2009, 12:17 AM
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Originally Posted by Veloce Raptor
Nicely done. The key to downshifting quickly IMO (besides having equipment that allows it...), especially on serious track/race cars with lightened flywheels and/or high compression, is blipping as you go into the next lower gear, rather than as you pass thru neutral on the way to that gear.
Unless of course your double clutching.
Old 04-07-2009, 12:23 AM
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Originally Posted by MTosi
Unless of course your double clutching.
Beat me too it. I still downshift that way. What a lot of guys may not realize is that the Cup Cars that you see have very low inertia motors (light cranks, pistons, rods, flywheel and very tiny clutches) and can make those lightning shifts. Most "normal" race motors/trans's cannot be shifted that quickly.
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Old 04-07-2009, 12:55 AM
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Originally Posted by Larry Herman
Beat me too it. I still downshift that way. What a lot of guys may not realize is that the Cup Cars that you see have very low inertia motors (light cranks, pistons, rods, flywheel and very tiny clutches) and can make those lightning shifts. Most "normal" race motors/trans's cannot be shifted that quickly.
Yup, my shifting in the GT3 is markedly slower than in the Cup Car. When I first got the cup, I tried to shift it the way I normally did, but the engine would spin down on the up shifts if I wasn't fast, never mind the downshifts. You have to drive the hardware you've got, the real key is smooth, smooth, smooth.
Old 04-07-2009, 04:39 AM
  #29  
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Why bother with a clutch lol.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=azpqTZ6WeJk
Old 04-07-2009, 05:06 AM
  #30  
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here is another one of Leh Keen at sebring. note, he goes from 6th to 1st for one of the corners... lightning fast! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=73Mvm...om=PL&index=16


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