Geoffrey

If you run the MPSC, you need to understand when and how the tires perform best. If you use them on a cool day, they are slippery and give little warning when at the edge of adhesion. I don't recommend these tires for transitioning drivers and they are best left to the more experienced driver. I'd mention the Yoko 048 which is a nice transition tire for a DE guy.

911S3.6

I agree with Geoffrey- the MPSC's need heat to get them to stick, then they work great. But, if 1) you do not drive aggressively enough; 2) ambient air temps/track temps are cold; 3) the car is light-in my case 2280 lbs
they do not perform, and exhibit what Geoff said.
I tried the Yoko 048s this year and it was a noticeable improvement-2.5 seconds at HPT. Thinking about trying the RA-1 replacement 888 this coming season to compare to yokos.

slvr993

I was thinking more in terms of unsprung weight,not overallcar weight.

Jeff

Bull

When I used them on my 993, I never shaved them. Michelin claimed that it wasn't needed or beneficial.

Bull

In my experience, with a 993 that weighed almost 3200lbs before I got in it, there was no problem heating up the MPSCs. It generally took one lap on a warm day, and two on the coolest days, with serious driving.

mooty

google bob woodman tires or aim tires.

Veloce Raptor

I knew what you meant. respectfully, I still say that 16 pounds of unsprung weight in a 993 used for DE work is irrelevant.

Agree on NOT shaving the MPSC's.

RonCT

16 lbs unsprung is definitely relevant, especially in a lighter 993. What you have to define is relevant. Every pound adds up and 16 lbs unsprung is like 112 sprung. 112 lbs here and 112 lbs there (sung to the tune of Old MacDonald)... I think the point a few of us were making with respect to the weight of the RA1 is that it's heavier than other options and for an intermediate driver just getting into R-comps, it's fine, but when you are more advanced and looking for cutting lap times, then you look at everything related to weight (wheels, tires, rotors, yourself, exhaust, etc.).

Veloce Raptor

Ron, w/o starting a new debate here, it is not relevant for DE work in a relatively heavy car (as compared with, say, a Spec Miata), which is exactly what I said.

In racing? Yes, relevant to some extent depending on the car, although I know at least one top tier club racer in an M3 who was consistently faster on RA1's than on significantly lighter 05 series Hoosiers (the R6 Hoosiers changed that, however).

But for DE work? 112 lbs of sprung weight is a rounding error. It's the difference between carrying a female passenger weighing 110 lbs or a male passenger weighing 222 lbs on track. Who cares?

DaveM993

Actually, I care...when I am chasing that car that is 2/10's faster...

oops...its a DE, I guess I shouldn't say that....

bobt993

Jeff,

Knowing your car and where your at in the program, I would go with the MPSCs. Mike P can have your car setup to take advantage of these tires. MPSCs most certainly have a routine to follow for warm up and proper temps/pressure. I think learning this process will be part of the ongoing education in performance driving. I have never found MPSCs to be "evil". If it's too cold out, run your streets. If you want to learn further how to get them hot in bad conditions, have one of the instructors go out with you to teach this.

The issue of unsprung weight, added performance etc is not going to matter to you for the initial learning process. Once you can get say 90% out of the tires, then focus on the final tweeks. Also, you can learn to drive other R tires to better understand adapting your driving style to the car/setup/conditions.

38D

Me either, and I've run them in near freezing temps. As for shaving, they are faster when shaved, but you do lose longevity. I'd say they are approximately 1 sec faster when shaved down to 3/32 at a track like Watkins Glen, but the longevity is roughly 1/2 that of an unshaved tire

frayed

Vilven tire and appalachain (www.racetire.com) are also big toyo suppliers. Good tires, not as precise as MPSCs but more forgiving and far more tolerant of temperature and pressure ranges. But I fall into more of an 'arrive and drive' sorta guy.

bobt993

Collin, after you and Charlie gave me some solid information of setup of MPSCs, I ran my most consistent laps on them. I can get .5 to .8secs more on R6s, but not for 20laps running hard.

They understeer and slide like crap until hot, but remain predictable. Once hot, they really grip and give more gradually than R6s. Key is very predictable.

Marc Shaw

Thanks.

Marc