BostonDMD

How long does it take for the average PCA DE Green driver to get to the Black level?

What is the natural progression in color promotion?

How do the instructors judge or differentiate a more talented driver from the average joe?

How does a student distinguish himself/herself enough in order for the instructor to notice and thus get quickly promoted?

I have only done 1 green PCA DE event; the instructor told me that after one more green session I will be promoted to yellow. Is that the norm?

Any input is greatly appreciated.

bobt993

Green to black:

Consistent driving. Awareness on the track at speed and courtesy. Drive in all conditions (wet/dry).
Know all the tracks you have access to, (that will help move you to solo).
Learn self correction/teaching. (that will help on new tracks and earn solo).
Average a year per group assumming 20 track days a year.
If you can put in 40 track days a year, this will go quicker.
Less , say 10 track days a year will be tough to refine your skills.
Timeline, as little as 2-1/2 years, as long as 5 years. If it takes longer either seek more instruction as a solo white group driver.

Remember, initial advancement is easier when still instructed, but to become a solo driver , I have to be certain your ready. You may never have another instructor in the car after that move. Final move to black requires higher entry speeds, excellent subconscious car control and complete track awareness.

kurt M

After you move to an uninstructed group the biggest mistake you can make is not to invite instructors (or fellow instructor when you get there) to ride along with you. Once a weekend at least invite an instructor to ride along with you. Discuss you goals for the run and what you want to work on or have the instructor look at. There is ALWAYS improvment in even in your best corner of the most loved track.

BostonDMD

Bob, first of all for your kind response.

Do I have to spend a year in the green group even if I were lapping several participants on my first DE event?

Do the instructors take into account of the students previous experience? (i.e. Skippy racing programs?)

BostonDMD

Kurt, is there any way of finding out which of the instructors on that particular DE event is the most experienced and thus gain from him as much as possible?

I told a couple of my instructors to be very critical of my driving techniques and lines because I want to learn as much as possible from them in that specific run.

RedlineMan

Hmmmmmpf;

Not trying to be a ***** or anything... There is a LOT to think about in this performance driving game. One thing I can think of that should have no place in your mind is advancement. If that is something that is seriously on your mind, you've got your priorities screwed up.

Thinking about driving a lot will speed your advancement... if you're any good. Thinking about advancement will impede your driving. When someone sees that you know what you need to know, then you advance. Some take a few events, some a lot longer, and it varies by region or club. Too many variables to put a time frame on it. Who cares anyway?

Go out, drive, learn, have fun. Advancement is a result of what you learn, and how well. That's where your focus should be. The rest will take care of itself in its own good time. That's as it should be.

...Just in case you are a Type A or something.

TREMPER

Well put John....With my National position , I am interested in how this thread progresses....
Pete

Veloce Raptor

I concur with Kurt & John on this one. Down here, we don't have Black. Rather, our order is Green/Blue/Blue Solo/Yellow/White/Red (instructors). But the concepts mentioned by Kurt & John are the same.

Bull

I think John covered it well. MANY variables. Some are even outside of your control, like is there room to advance those who have shown they are ready....you could have to wait an event or two in a crowded Region.

Get out there as often as possible, get as much seat time as possible with as many different Instructors as you can (their evaluation is very inportant), SHOW them that you have learned and can apply your learning consistently at multiple tracks, and you will have done most of what you can do.

In our Region, the progression is Green, Yellow, Blue, White, Black, Red. Green,Yellow and Blue are all Instructed groups, while White is solo.

Skip Wolfe

I totally agree with that - especially with instructors. I don't care how good you are, someone else can always find some bad habits, or suggest somehing new to try.

While I agree there are too many variables to really come out with a blanket benchmark for how long it will take to advance, I don't quite agree that you can't have advancement as a goal. There are some of us who are just competitive by nature and strive to excel and advance, and unfortunately we can't turn it off. I agree that beng obsessed with advancing to the exclusion of all else can be counter productive, but having the internal drive to advance and using run groups as a milestone to work towards can be healthly if kept in check.

With that said I agree with the others, that seat time and lots of it is the key. Also I agree with going to as many differnt tracks and working with different instructors.

Also in our group the progression is D, C, B, A, Instructor - much easier to figure out than all the colors.

BostonDMD

What gave you that impression?

I want to be in the adequate group for my skills, but I also DON'T want to be the fastest.... I like to have some competition....

Larry Herman

Everyone wants to advance. That is the nature of DEs. When there is a top level for something, everyone naturally has their sights set on that. To get there, the concept that you must totally embrace is that the foundations for driving, coupled with talent and practice are what will make you truly fast. There is no shortcut. Additionally, driving is almost a zen thing, as you can see in some of the videos out there where the drivers are pretty calm whilst they circulate at insane speeds. Super aggression and pressing hard will take you down dead end alleys of learning.

Willard Bridgham 3

This is the red mist......DE is not racing, it is not preparation for a race and etc......in short, it is not competitive.

I get students both in ski classes and at the track whose only object is to advance groups fast....they don't learn fast because of their obsession blinds them and they almost never have a lot of fun. They also keep the instructor from doing what he does best.

BostonDMD

Skip, you must have read my mind, I couldn't have said it better myself!

Mark in Baltimore

Enjoy the time in your current group and you'll advance quickly enough, if you have the courtesy, awareness and speed skills necessary for each run group. Sure, everyone wants to improve, but, dare I say it, many look askance at the student who is overly eager to progress to the next run group.

Be cool and you will be.