MJR911

Are there guys that basically have a "quick in and out" interior? I was thinking the same thing for sometime down the road... as a car that fits in Grand Am Cup (like a 997) fits in stock class too but in GAC the interior is removed and in stock class it is needed. Same with '44 cup and I/H PCA.

M758

TD... I run my car in GT4S when I run with PCA. I have only gotten first or second in class in each of my races.

Then again I never seen more than 1 properly prepared true GT4S car at any race I have been to. I have beaten a few oths 944 spec cars running in GT4S.

Seriously...
... My 944 spec does not meet PCA I-stock rules since it is too light. PCA I-stock requires interior and weight at 2779 without driver. Without driver my car is about 2400 lbs. Way to light and I am not looking to add 379lbs to my car. There are a few other detail differences but that is major one.

I have consided fiberglass as that would be legal for GT4. However it is NOT legal for 944 spec and since that is were the best racing is in my part of the country I have not done that.


I would not expect fiberglass to compromse safety since you are just replaceing sheet metal.

For you however it would be smart to keep the car legal for 944 cup since in that area the best place to race a 944 NA is in 944 Cup. This gives you the option of either racing or selling the car for more money.

Plus pulling 250-300 lbs from the will require a corner balance to get it right and possibly changes to springs and aligment settingst to get the proper balance back. Better to learn on what you have as it sounds quite competant.

With respect to the hood.

There are 3 choices. 1) Fix it, 2) Replace it with one from a junk yard or local rennlister parting stuff, 3) let it be, it is a track car after all and will sell all kinds of cosmetic abuse. Here in Az track rash is bid deal. One of the nice things about a track car is there is no need to worry about rock chips and scratches. Most heavily used track cars look great from 50 ft. Get up close and you see the war they have been through.

M758

Oh.. with respect o GT4...
.. I did submit my rules change proposal that bascly moves the 2.5 NA 944 to GT5 and 3.0L NA 944 adn 968 to GT4.

That should help made the 944 more competitive in the the GT classes.

Now.. we shall see what PCA says about them.

Al P.

Geo

Another $0.02...

Your car is IT legal now. You will need to get a copy of the SCCA GCR and Category Specs (available in pdf format on-line). Lexan and fiberglass are decided not legal. I know you already said no to these items, but wanted to point this out anyway since nobody addressed the class your car is built for.

As for your question of safety, I think there is a trade-off. On one hand, deforming metal will more likley absorb more energy than breaking fiberglass. However, less mass means less energy to dissipate.

Al P.

SCCA has much more specific rules than either PCA or '44Cup, as Geo says you really need a copy of the ITS Specs and General Competition Rules (GCR's) to make sure your car is still ITS legal. Changes that are allowed in PCA (ie. the ever controversial front A-arms) are not allowed in ITS to the best of my knowledge.

Matt Marks

FYI - ITS cages are allowed to attach to the suspension mount points (i.e. the shock/strut towers) in that the this will add additional chassis stiffness. If your cage does attach there, your call will not be stock class eligible - it will be GT only regardless of the interior.

We look forward to seeing you in the 944 cup. ;-)

aeshultz

TD - there are indeed a number of people who replace the interior to run PCA Stock classes (ususally "I") and pull it to run NASA or 44Cup. Once you start spending all of your weekends hanging out in paddocks <G> you'll meet a lot of good examples. Just keep introducing yourself and asking questions.
Another option, since the car is/ should be ITS legal, is to try the SCCA route when you feel ready. Upside: lots of events, a little lower costs. Downside: be prepared to stay out of people's way (read: watch your mirrors) - 944s aren't real competitive unless they're prepped really well ($$). You'll hear a lot of negatives about SCCA from PCA people, but on the whole I find the SCCA racers to be serious, fast, and a good group.
Alan

TD in DC

All,

Thank you very much for the advice. It is a little daunting jumping into this and trying to keep the various classes/potential racing venues straight. I will be going to Skip Barber later this year to get my license. If I get my license and feel comfortable enough with my progression, I plan to join the 44 cup next year.

I have heard very conflicting advice about when it is good to start racing. Some say you need to have years of DEs under your belt and you need to be in black/red run group and be squarely in the "subconciously competent group." Others say there is no better way to learn to be a good driver than to jump right in (let's say that you are consciously competent but not that experienced), particularly in a "friendly" group like the 44 cup. I don't want to start if I am not ready, but I also don't want to wait if I am just being overly cautious.

Any thoughts on this?

TD in DC

Matt Marks

TD - lots of answers will be forthcoming on how long should you do DE, etc. before starting racing. As usual, the answers will vary.

My recommendation - sign up for the NASA supercomp school at summit point. They're offered either on 9/24-9/25 and/or 10/15-10/16.

This will be the single best experience you will have on the track. Not only will you learn about your limits as well as the cars limits a "controlled" racing situation, but you will also learn Summit like you've never seen it before.

Lots of great exercises such as driving the whole track offline and driving side by side around the track with a partner, but they'll have lots of classroom on racing tactics, passing, rules, etc.

I think the cost is about $350 or so, and if the instructors think that you're ready, you're ready. They'll give you a rookie license and then it's up to you to choose when you want to try an actual race.

Assuming you have the basic car control skills and a reasonable amount of speed, you'll be fine. There'sd really no other way to learn to race other than to do it.

Then, assuming that there is a school on 9/24, you can come race with us on 10/15-10/16. ;-)

Geo

Do it whenever you feel ready, and that does not mean necessarily good or great. That means when you are ready to deal with the steep learning curve of racing.

I am of the group that feels the whole "you've got to do so many DE days or be in such and such a group" is pure poop. What, does PCA issue a DE superlicence or something? Some people try to make it out to be more than it is. When you're ready to enter the fray, do it. If you're ready, but don't want to be in the middle of everything at first, request to start from the rear of the field. The race director or clerk of the course or whatever the head cheese is called in whatever group will probably respect you for that.

Racing can only be learned by racing. There are people with buttloads of DE experience that get in their first race and are just as clueless as someone with little to none. It's a different environment. And there are people with little to no experience who get in their first race and you'd think they had been doing it for years. Enter the fray on your own schedule, when you feel comfortable and don't listen to all the other hogwash.

I will also further say that I have ridden with DE veterans that I'd rather not feel comfortable racing with and there have been newbies I'd race with anytime.

From all that you have written I have little doubt that when you feel ready to try it, you will be ready to do it.

Interestingly there is a thread on Bimmerforums about racing etiquette and in the talk of leaving racing room someone posted a photo of himself leaving about 3 car widths room. I told him it was DE syndrome. Leave a car width in DE and you'll get your butt scolded (or should) and rightly so. But in racing that is all you need to leave. (well and a little extra, but not necessarily a lot).

Racing is racing and DE is DE. Not to kill a dead horse, but do it when you feel ready. Just jump right in.

M758

my feeling is that you need to be comfortable on track in traffic and off line.

When you are racing the basics of driving are not first thing in you mind. I don't feel it takes x number of DE's to race, but to me the key is to feel comforable in traffic. Racing is all about dealing with cars around you.