Another HANS datapoint
07-15-2005, 09:38 PM
#46
Rennlist Member
Schroth suggests the HANS-specific 2" shoulder belt. That's what I got for my GT3 seats. The passenger seat has the 3" shoulder belts. Both have the Schroth-suggested 2" lap belts, the Hybrid variety six-point. Tried it out at Watkins Glen over the last three days and they were quite comfortable.
07-15-2005, 09:58 PM
#47
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Originally Posted by Geo
Would it? I don't know as I accept that. I'm not trying to be argumentative here, but this is my thinking: As long as the head is stopped before any real stress is placed upon the neck, the results would (should) be minor. It's only when you start exceeding some level (don't ask me what that level is, I'm just a monkey here) of extension that you really put any significant strain on the neck.
That said, I imagine there are forces on the head itself, especially within, that could be significantly affected. About 20 years ago there was a big problem in CART with driver's brains sloshing around in their skulls in certain incidents that cause closed head injuries (but not basal skull fracture). I would think this sort of potential injury would be mitigated by the dampers vs. straps.
This was not meant to be part of a HANS vs Isaac argument, rather just a discussion of what is/may be going on.
That said, I imagine there are forces on the head itself, especially within, that could be significantly affected. About 20 years ago there was a big problem in CART with driver's brains sloshing around in their skulls in certain incidents that cause closed head injuries (but not basal skull fracture). I would think this sort of potential injury would be mitigated by the dampers vs. straps.
This was not meant to be part of a HANS vs Isaac argument, rather just a discussion of what is/may be going on.
In the strictest sense, you are right. I was speaking rather generally on a topic from whence comes much trouble! As long as neck stretch is kept to a surviveable level, that is probably all you need in that regard. It is the contents of the noggin (and all other delicate internals) that benefit greatly from the shortening of the time frame of motion. Even if the neck is not stressed beyond the point where dependant assemblies fly off, the contents of said dependancies benefit greatly from a reduction in KE, which is a factor of the amount of time they are allowed to move unrestrained.
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I've said it before, but I will say again that I am mightily appreciative of Mr. Baker's contributions to these forums. Taking the time to discuss such enigmatic stuff with us plebes is above and beyond in my book. You are either in serious need of a life, or are a seriously savvy grassroots marketeer.
Whichever, I salute you!
Last edited by RedlineMan; 07-16-2005 at 08:18 AM.
07-16-2005, 03:30 AM
#48
Originally Posted by gbaker
I was chatting with John Melvin at the Delphi lab a couple of months ago and he told me that they were able to get tension numbers under 1,000N on that 70G sled by using the 4-belt Schroth system with the HANS. That's a kick butt number. Of course, if the lower portion of the HANS yoke meets the section where the belts merge, the compression/shear load spikes up. Classic example of tuning for one measure
Yes this goes with what I posted before: Dr. H would personally use a 4belt . Also, Like before we can test for just about any result we want if we try hard enough. FIA/HANS has a solution for the belt merge issue. It is yet another very specific HANS mounting issue! The tail of the HANS yoke needs to be 180mm - (the distance of the rear of your helmet to the front surface of the HANS collar). That is from the FIA and that solves the problem.
Last edited by fatbillybob; 07-16-2005 at 03:32 AM. Reason: error
07-16-2005, 08:22 AM
#49
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Rennlist Member
Originally Posted by fatbillybob
FIA/HANS has a solution for the belt merge issue. It is yet another very specific HANS mounting issue! The tail of the HANS yoke needs to be 180mm - (the distance of the rear of your helmet to the front surface of the HANS collar). That is from the FIA and that solves the problem.
07-16-2005, 10:51 AM
#50
John,
FIA doc 5/1/05 re: HANS install says: Driver seated and strapped in leans head forward i.e. try to look at belly button. The straight hortizontal measure from rearmost tangent point of the hemlet plastic to the front part of the verticle upright of the HANS collar = "A" The measure of the merge point of the belts toward the cam and the lower front tip of the HANS yoke = "B". The minimum allowable measure "B" = 180mm - A.
I have the free download acrobat program so I cannot cut and paste FIA exact words and pictures from the PDF file. I also do not know how to upload that file to Rennlist but the link for it was provided by someone on rennlist. If someone can show me how to get it out of my computer I will upload the entire FIA HANS guide. This would be helpful since the 4 belt shoulder HANS has additional specific requirements since both belts are NOT anchored in the exact same place like the typical 3" single shoulder belt for HANS.
FIA doc 5/1/05 re: HANS install says: Driver seated and strapped in leans head forward i.e. try to look at belly button. The straight hortizontal measure from rearmost tangent point of the hemlet plastic to the front part of the verticle upright of the HANS collar = "A" The measure of the merge point of the belts toward the cam and the lower front tip of the HANS yoke = "B". The minimum allowable measure "B" = 180mm - A.
I have the free download acrobat program so I cannot cut and paste FIA exact words and pictures from the PDF file. I also do not know how to upload that file to Rennlist but the link for it was provided by someone on rennlist. If someone can show me how to get it out of my computer I will upload the entire FIA HANS guide. This would be helpful since the 4 belt shoulder HANS has additional specific requirements since both belts are NOT anchored in the exact same place like the typical 3" single shoulder belt for HANS.
07-16-2005, 02:38 PM
#51
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