911 hits 944 video
03-15-2005, 01:06 PM
#31
944/911 was a "gentleman's class" race, not a DE. No law that says a "gentleman" cannot also be an idiot. In all fairness, **** happens in racing. Everybody knows (or should know) that they are putting it on the line... doesn;t excuse bad judgement, but that is part of the deal.
I didn;t see the 944 go wide before the contact. Looked to me like he opened the door for the 911 and then lost it when he got whacked...but I decided to stop looking at it. I'm racing in a few weeks, and these videos are definately not benficial to my mental preparation.
Really a shame for that 944, cause that probably should have only been a fender bender... but once these suckers let go, anything can happen.
I didn;t see the 944 go wide before the contact. Looked to me like he opened the door for the 911 and then lost it when he got whacked...but I decided to stop looking at it. I'm racing in a few weeks, and these videos are definately not benficial to my mental preparation.
Really a shame for that 944, cause that probably should have only been a fender bender... but once these suckers let go, anything can happen.
03-15-2005, 02:22 PM
#32
Addict
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
Hmmm...
The 944 was clearly off line by at least 3-4 feet and out in the marbles near the track out. He didn't seem to set the car in decisively enough to me. Probably carrying more speed than he ever had. Likely was distracted by the fool in the 911 crawling up his butt. Just kinda drifted in... and drifted out!
I don't care WHAT kind of driving it is, collisions that can be avoided through simple means are the result of utter stupidity. The 944 never came back in or varied from his arc, wide as it may have been. The 911 driver did not allow him any room should he stay on track.
If that is racing, so be it, but not to my mind. The 911 driver would be swallowing teeth if that was MY 944. That's racing too, then.
The 944 was clearly off line by at least 3-4 feet and out in the marbles near the track out. He didn't seem to set the car in decisively enough to me. Probably carrying more speed than he ever had. Likely was distracted by the fool in the 911 crawling up his butt. Just kinda drifted in... and drifted out!
I don't care WHAT kind of driving it is, collisions that can be avoided through simple means are the result of utter stupidity. The 944 never came back in or varied from his arc, wide as it may have been. The 911 driver did not allow him any room should he stay on track.
If that is racing, so be it, but not to my mind. The 911 driver would be swallowing teeth if that was MY 944. That's racing too, then.
03-15-2005, 04:03 PM
#33
TRB0 GUY
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Daphne, AL
Posts: 3,769
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by Flat Top
In my book: If there is an incident between two cars the faster car's driver is always to blame.
I'd agree with you most of the time, but I think there are cases where the slower car is at fault. This is certainly not one of those cases, however! That 911 just smacked the poor waterpumper with his tail.
The second video is not of an Impreza, I think it is of an Honda Civic. It is from a Swedish track meet and the drivers who were out taking it easy waiting for the rain to stop.
03-16-2005, 07:18 AM
#34
Advanced
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Norway
Posts: 93
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Hi folks, just quickly in to give a little more background info on these two accidents. The 944 on the roll was a former colleague of mine, but I didn't know until we quit working together. I can't give much more info on this, besides that I believe it is obvious where the fault lies. The 944 seems to have come in too fast and to stay on the track he is off power. The 911 didn't pay attention and as someone else so elegantly said it - "claimed more space" than he should have.
The civic crash is really scary if you ask me. Here is a (somewhat poor) translation of some information provided by the president of the Ford Motorsport Club Sweden - Christian Lange, who is a friend of the driver crashing. Indented text is translated as good as I could do it.
Drive safely folks!
Best regards,
Ørjan Sandland
The civic crash is really scary if you ask me. Here is a (somewhat poor) translation of some information provided by the president of the Ford Motorsport Club Sweden - Christian Lange, who is a friend of the driver crashing. Indented text is translated as good as I could do it.
This movie shows what can happen to experienced drivers. He is one of the best drivers I know ( close friend) and he will stay so even after this incident.
What happens is that the car aquaplanes without no warning, even if the speed was the same on the previous lap. The only reason cars were still on the track, is because they were experienced drivers only and they were just lapping waiting for the rain to clear. The car in question was not even going at 70% of it's capabillities at this part of the track. The tires was very good and the car itself is one of the best cars that I know of when it comes to tracking a street car.
Rules from this year on does not allow cars to be on the track during these conditions.
Those of you who believe you are good drivers, I hope you think this over and perhaps get a little more respect for what can happen even the best - because that just happened.
I would also add a little about what happened:
The driver passed out for about 30 seconds after the car came to a stop. You can see a little of that in the movie. When the car hit the 1.4 meter tall AMCO rail, the side window disappeared. The helmet hit the rail because of the about 60G the driver was exposed to in a couple of tenths of seconds. Thanks to an SBF approved lightweight helmet and a proper racingseat the driver made it with aches in the entire body and some serious bruises "size large" due to the seat. The seat was twisted so much that it's not possible to sit in it anymore. The seat even destroyed the metal door of the car. Thanks to a very well executed rescue action with immediately fixing drivers head to the seat and very skilled rescue personell, everything was handled professionally after the accident.
What could have happened: cracked scull, broken neck, serious damage to left side of body, massive internal bleedings, partially or entirely invalid (sp?) for life or possibly death.
Perhaps you now understand why we have so strict rules when it comes to trackdays, why you aren't allowed to drift, why we don't want passengers in the cars. There was several incidents on swedish tracks the last year - this was only one of them.
Best regards C, who is happy that my friend had an angelwatch. The worst that can happen is to see a friend sitting in a totally trashed car, fixated (sp?) - waiting for paramedics. And you know you can loose him this exact moment.
Later in the thread Christian elaborates a little on the exact conditions of the car. Pictures are not posted du to the protection of the accidental driver. What happens is that the car aquaplanes without no warning, even if the speed was the same on the previous lap. The only reason cars were still on the track, is because they were experienced drivers only and they were just lapping waiting for the rain to clear. The car in question was not even going at 70% of it's capabillities at this part of the track. The tires was very good and the car itself is one of the best cars that I know of when it comes to tracking a street car.
Rules from this year on does not allow cars to be on the track during these conditions.
Those of you who believe you are good drivers, I hope you think this over and perhaps get a little more respect for what can happen even the best - because that just happened.
I would also add a little about what happened:
The driver passed out for about 30 seconds after the car came to a stop. You can see a little of that in the movie. When the car hit the 1.4 meter tall AMCO rail, the side window disappeared. The helmet hit the rail because of the about 60G the driver was exposed to in a couple of tenths of seconds. Thanks to an SBF approved lightweight helmet and a proper racingseat the driver made it with aches in the entire body and some serious bruises "size large" due to the seat. The seat was twisted so much that it's not possible to sit in it anymore. The seat even destroyed the metal door of the car. Thanks to a very well executed rescue action with immediately fixing drivers head to the seat and very skilled rescue personell, everything was handled professionally after the accident.
What could have happened: cracked scull, broken neck, serious damage to left side of body, massive internal bleedings, partially or entirely invalid (sp?) for life or possibly death.
Perhaps you now understand why we have so strict rules when it comes to trackdays, why you aren't allowed to drift, why we don't want passengers in the cars. There was several incidents on swedish tracks the last year - this was only one of them.
Best regards C, who is happy that my friend had an angelwatch. The worst that can happen is to see a friend sitting in a totally trashed car, fixated (sp?) - waiting for paramedics. And you know you can loose him this exact moment.
I would just add that this driver is one of the most experienced I know.
Pictures will not be uploaded due to the anonymity of the driver but I can give some more details:
In the crash the front left hits the rails 2-5 cm before the rear left of the car. Thats when side window pieces come flying, the rim is ripped off in all spokes, tire is torn, brake disc is split and the gearbox is parted into several pieces.
The car itself became 15cm lower, and 15cm taller on the left side than the right side. About 20-30cm narrower. In other words, entirely flat on the right side. When the rear wheel hit and damaged the rim, the rear window was thrown 6 meters along the rails. Both front and rear wheel suspension on the left hand side was damaged. The entire car is so deformed that the bodyshell rear right and all A, B and C posts are bent.
Calculations shows that the driver was exposed to more than 60G in 0,3-0,5 seconds with the angle the car had against the rails - deformation zones included.
I hope it's somewhat readable... translations from two second languages ain't my specialty. Pictures will not be uploaded due to the anonymity of the driver but I can give some more details:
In the crash the front left hits the rails 2-5 cm before the rear left of the car. Thats when side window pieces come flying, the rim is ripped off in all spokes, tire is torn, brake disc is split and the gearbox is parted into several pieces.
The car itself became 15cm lower, and 15cm taller on the left side than the right side. About 20-30cm narrower. In other words, entirely flat on the right side. When the rear wheel hit and damaged the rim, the rear window was thrown 6 meters along the rails. Both front and rear wheel suspension on the left hand side was damaged. The entire car is so deformed that the bodyshell rear right and all A, B and C posts are bent.
Calculations shows that the driver was exposed to more than 60G in 0,3-0,5 seconds with the angle the car had against the rails - deformation zones included.
Drive safely folks!
Best regards,
Ørjan Sandland
Last edited by Orjan; 03-16-2005 at 07:22 AM. Reason: Removed confusing editorial comment..
03-16-2005, 10:59 AM
#36
Advanced
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Damascus, MD
Posts: 54
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Interesting how he leaned away from the collision prior to impact. I've been taught that the opposite is what you should do. But it certainly goes against instincts.
03-16-2005, 11:32 AM
#37
3rd Gear
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 3
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I am the driver of the 944 :-)
First of all - thank you for all comments - at least the positive ones 
! Really liked RedlineMan`s input
I have also posted this on the 944 thread
This is an old video - 4 years at least - and this happend on a Sunday. I drove my very first race the day before.
The class is called Roadsport and is a class were regular road cars are prepared for racing ie roll-bar, el-cut-off, race chair etc. There are 3 classes - A,B and C and I drove in the C-class for the slowest cars. We drive 12 laps and this happend in lap 10 and the 911 was overtaking me after a S-turn and in the beginning of a stright part.
Some facts :-) :
I was not going fast
I pretty much held my track and was were was I was suppost to be going out of the turn
2 cars from the A class came out of the turn after me - competeing for the 1 prize. I saw them in the mirror and basicly tried not to be creative and just stay were I was supposed to.
There were no understeering or problems of any sort. An experienced driver would have gone much faster then I did.
Despite the fact that the 911 driver had at least another 600 feet to pass me, brake and make the new turn to the right he chose to pass and cut me of short.
Things happend fast and after the car had turned over and landed on its wheels again (engine running) I was not quite sure what happend..until I saw the tape at home. At this time the driver of the 911 claimed I turned into him :-).
The car was fixed, upgraded and I drove it for another 3 years before upgrading to a 911.
The drive of the 911 did not get his teeth kicked out , but I had dreams about it. We still disagree about the incident but are friends. Thats racing and I knew the risks.
The roll bar probably saved my neck and did not bulge an inch. Everything else did...
I did not get injured, but the camera died. The tape survived for you to enjoy!!
Rgds from Norway
! Really liked RedlineMan`s inputI have also posted this on the 944 thread
This is an old video - 4 years at least - and this happend on a Sunday. I drove my very first race the day before.
The class is called Roadsport and is a class were regular road cars are prepared for racing ie roll-bar, el-cut-off, race chair etc. There are 3 classes - A,B and C and I drove in the C-class for the slowest cars. We drive 12 laps and this happend in lap 10 and the 911 was overtaking me after a S-turn and in the beginning of a stright part.
Some facts :-) :
I was not going fast
I pretty much held my track and was were was I was suppost to be going out of the turn
2 cars from the A class came out of the turn after me - competeing for the 1 prize. I saw them in the mirror and basicly tried not to be creative and just stay were I was supposed to.
There were no understeering or problems of any sort. An experienced driver would have gone much faster then I did.
Despite the fact that the 911 driver had at least another 600 feet to pass me, brake and make the new turn to the right he chose to pass and cut me of short.
Things happend fast and after the car had turned over and landed on its wheels again (engine running) I was not quite sure what happend..until I saw the tape at home. At this time the driver of the 911 claimed I turned into him :-).
The car was fixed, upgraded and I drove it for another 3 years before upgrading to a 911.
The drive of the 911 did not get his teeth kicked out , but I had dreams about it. We still disagree about the incident but are friends. Thats racing and I knew the risks.
The roll bar probably saved my neck and did not bulge an inch. Everything else did...
I did not get injured, but the camera died. The tape survived for you to enjoy!!
Rgds from Norway
