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Was curious if anyone here has ever gotten to the track, loosened the top 3 strut nuts and sent both sides as negative as they can go at a track event? Then returning them to a "marked" position on the way home?
Unless you have a portable alignment system available to make the settings precise IMHO you wold be doing way more harm than good.
A good alignment with ample negative camber can set so it works well on track and on the street.
Yea I'm just gonna leave well enough alone I think it's my best bet. I've read in passing that some guys just mark the nuts on the top of the struts, bury them negative at the track then just return them to the position they were in.
Yea I'm just gonna leave well enough alone I think it's my best bet. I've read in passing that some guys just mark the nuts on the top of the struts, bury them negative at the track then just return them to the position they were in.
Any adjustment you make to the camber also affects the toe which can potentially make your car feel weird on track. I and many others have adjustable camber plates but I never adjust mine.
IF you know what the adjustment does... go for it.
Camber changes are very likely to effect the toe as well. Sometimes that is not a disadvantage. BMWs typically move toward toe out with an increase in negative camber. Those are also strut-type front ends.
Professional recommendation, after doing 1000+ alignments:
Find a good alignment shop (one that speaks 'performance'), and is willing to indulge you a little bit. There may be some extra charge...
Establish a good street baseline. I normally use -1.5* F camber for a reasonable performance/street compromise, along with a smidge of toe in. Avoid toe out on the street, and your tires will thank you.
You can let your alignment tech decide what a smidge is...
Once you have that, carefully mark where the holes are, then max the negative camber and see where it winds up. Depending on the tires, etc, somewhere around -3* might be a good starting point for the track. Odds are, you won't get that much...
With the camber maxed negative, look to see what the toe does. A smidge of toe out can help with the turn in. If it's too much, mark the tie rod carefully and adjust until you're where you want to be. Mark that too...
Easy breezy to go back and forth, although no matter how precise you try to be, it'll never go back exactly to where you started. Don't sweat that, it'll be close enough.
If you want to have it set once, as a compromise:
Tires are alot more forgiving of too much negative camber on the street than they are of toe out. Combine the two, and you'll watch the inner edges of your tires turn to dust.
Tires are much more forgiving of toe out than they are of not enough negative camber on the track.
I try for around -2.5 F camber, with a smidge of toe in for a dual purpose car. It's a little too negative for the street, but tire wear usually isn't horrible. If you track regularly, the outer edges will probably suffer more.
Last edited by Nowanker; 06-13-2024 at 03:55 PM.
Reason: Additional recommendation!
Was curious if anyone here has ever gotten to the track, loosened the top 3 strut nuts and sent both sides as negative as they can go at a track event? Then returning them to a "marked" position on the way home?
I replied to your tire pressure comment in the 981 forum.
Your OE top mounts have very little camber adjustment. Just get a Firestone shop to put max camber on it and leave it for street and track. I run -1.5 year round (up from stock -0.5).
When you go to GT3 LCAs, then you’ll need a performance shop for a real alignment.
Toe out helps with the initial turn in. but once the direction change and weight transfer have occurred, it's pretty much of a moot point.
There may still be some scrubbing action from the inside tire not pointing 'the right way', but with the body roll, that tire is pretty lightly loaded in the corner anyway.
From personal experience, running toe out on the track is of minor benefit on the track, but causes maximum pain on the street.
Rear toe out is a different ball game entirely... It can make even a boring car interesting.
The Camaro ZL1 1LE package had top camber plates that had preset machined holes, one set fixed for street and one set fixed for track. With the idea that you could flip back and forth somewhat easily and maintain the same camber. But it still ends up impacting toe. I never had a Z1 1LE, so I don't know how hard it is in practice. But I know when I was researching and considering one I thought it was a pretty cool idea.
In this photo the top mount is endboard so it's adding camber.
The point about toe changing with camber change is important. You can't avoid the need to do that. I don't see an easy way to set camber at the track and change it back again for a dual purpose car.
If the primary aspect of dual purpose is getting to and from the track, as suggested above, go ahead and set camber aggressively and perhaps be a little more conservative on the toe to avoid chewing up tires on the street.
This is one of many reasons people get trailers
On the E36 and E46 M3s, there wasn't really enough camber adjustment range to make it worthwhile.
But f you added camber plates, you could swap back and forth pretty readily.
I've forgotten the exact numbers, but the toe switched neatly with the camber.
Moving a moderate street camber/toe-in setting to something for the track yielded an appropriate amount of toe out to go with it.
I installed quite a few sets of camber plates to facilitate trackside adjustment...
But I think everysingle customer just wound up with compromise settings and left it there.
On the E36 and E46 M3s, there wasn't really enough camber adjustment range to make it worthwhile.
But f you added camber plates, you could swap back and forth pretty readily.
I've forgotten the exact numbers, but the toe switched neatly with the camber.
Moving a moderate street camber/toe-in setting to something for the track yielded an appropriate amount of toe out to go with it.
I installed quite a few sets of camber plates to facilitate trackside adjustment... But I think every single customer just wound up with compromise settings and left it there.
Toe out helps with the initial turn in. but once the direction change and weight transfer have occurred, it's pretty much of a moot point.
There may still be some scrubbing action from the inside tire not pointing 'the right way', but with the body roll, that tire is pretty lightly loaded in the corner anyway.
From personal experience, running toe out on the track is of minor benefit on the track, but causes maximum pain on the street.
Rear toe out is a different ball game entirely... It can make even a boring car interesting.
06-13-2024, 02:29 PM
Setting Camber at the Track
