What's up with Chin?
#32
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Yes, he was perfectly OK with a check out ride and was planning on going, but when he told us he was in Novice Solo we all discouraged him. Again we don't know Chin, but it's pretty much 100% guaranteed at all the track day organizers in the West Coast that you will not move up more than one, maybe two groups by the end of the day. The plan was I was going to network here to straighten out his start group, but his towing plans changed and he cancelled.
Also, keep in mind that novice solo isn't the same as instructed novice. There's some amount of trust involved in placing a driver in any solo group if he's new to a track or hasn't been to a track in a long time.
Pace is also a consideration in run group placement. At a track like VIR, the average pace of Chin Red is quite fast, and even Blue is pretty fast.
#33
I have a point that no one else has made here. You can be a very good SRF driver and be a huge problem at a DE. If you were in chin Blue or Red at COTA (and I assume VIR is similar) you would be a huge hazard with differences in closing speeds, and I am sure there are nice polite SRF drivers out there, but my experience with them at DE's is that they like to race everyone and each other causing parades and they "cant" give point bys because they are wearing tethers. Maybe they have been burned by this kind of thing before.
Keep in mind, with some of the big iron that shows up to a COTA event, speed differential is a given almost no matter what you bring with the NASCAR Sprint Cup, F1, and Indycars that sometimes show up.
-Mike
#34
The Penguin King
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Yes he is, and no they are not ********. Good people who have a different outlook than you do. When you become THE person with the overriding responsibility for the safety of all the participants, the view changes. Don’t rush to judgement.
#35
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Originally Posted by mglobe
Yes he is, and no they are not ********. Good people who have a different outlook than you do. When you become THE person with the overriding responsibility for the safety of all the participants, the view changes. Don’t rush to judgement.
#36
Rennlist Member
Hahaha. I've very recently started to be a *tiny* bit involved on this side of the fence with one of the groups I run with and holy **** I wish I had a dollar for every "I'm an instructor" or "I'm super duper advanced" email that gets sent. 991 Cup Car here I come!
#37
-Mike
#38
Originally Posted by mglobe
Yes he is, and no they are not ********. Good people who have a different outlook than you do. When you become THE person with the overriding responsibility for the safety of all the participants, the view changes. Don’t rush to judgement.
I also like how they do the full course yellow for first 30 minutes. Makes it nice to learn a new track without so much pressure.
#39
#40
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Thread Starter
Again, Chin is different. They're set up to do checkouts promptly.
Also, keep in mind that novice solo isn't the same as instructed novice. There's some amount of trust involved in placing a driver in any solo group if he's new to a track or hasn't been to a track in a long time.
Pace is also a consideration in run group placement. At a track like VIR, the average pace of Chin Red is quite fast, and even Blue is pretty fast.
Also, keep in mind that novice solo isn't the same as instructed novice. There's some amount of trust involved in placing a driver in any solo group if he's new to a track or hasn't been to a track in a long time.
Pace is also a consideration in run group placement. At a track like VIR, the average pace of Chin Red is quite fast, and even Blue is pretty fast.
I dunno, I drove a SRF for the very first time at Chin at COTA in Red and it was not a problem at all. And, most assuredly, one can give point-bys while wearing the tethers. The only problem I see with an SRF is the attitude of the driver.
Keep in mind, with some of the big iron that shows up to a COTA event, speed differential is a given almost no matter what you bring with the NASCAR Sprint Cup, F1, and Indycars that sometimes show up.
-Mike
Keep in mind, with some of the big iron that shows up to a COTA event, speed differential is a given almost no matter what you bring with the NASCAR Sprint Cup, F1, and Indycars that sometimes show up.
-Mike
And again, he’s a Saint on track, too bad again the rules have look out for the track bullies and track devils, but I get it. Thanks for all the helpful comments everyone.
#41
The Penguin King
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A couple of years ago, I had an unknown student show up with a new, very fast BMW. I put one of our instructors, who I though well of, but who I didn't know as well as I should have in the car with him to check him out. I should have chosen a different instructor quite honestly, as the guy I chose was on the aggressive side of drivers himself. The student put his car head-on into a corner station on lap two of his check ride. Broke both of the instructor's legs, and the guys was in a wheel chair for a fair amount of time. My decisions may have contributed to the situation.
My point is that before you pass judgement on Chin (or any other very good organization like them), think about this story, and put on their hat for a minute.
My point is that before you pass judgement on Chin (or any other very good organization like them), think about this story, and put on their hat for a minute.
#42
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Montoya, I am not being a hardass. Just a realist. Like it or not, this is how Chin rolls. Bitching about it here isn't productive, and doesn't help your friend. He should simply go, do Novice Solo for a session with a lead follow check out, and allow the process to work.
#43
Yes, that also might be behind the logic- if the organizers only experience with SRF is our previous gen cars, then maybe he’s got a wrong idea of the speed of SRF3.
And again, he’s a Saint on track, too bad again the rules have look out for the track bullies and track devils, but I get it. Thanks for all the helpful comments everyone.
And again, he’s a Saint on track, too bad again the rules have look out for the track bullies and track devils, but I get it. Thanks for all the helpful comments everyone.
Recall also that Chin allows passing anywhere in the top run groups. In the top run group, they require prompt point-bys. They are quick to demote someone who can't abide by this. The car speed differential is entirely mute in their organization - red run group drivers are expected to have the skills to deal with it. With a skilled driver, the check ride is going to be short, as if a driver has a skilled resume that is accurate, it's going to be obvious after 1-2 hot laps.
The rules protect him as well as I'm sure he doesn't want some chuckle-head running out there with him who has boosted his resume. As been stated before, Chin is very good at sorting the proper run group for people new to them early Saturday morning. Add in the double-yellow first session and it makes it easy for an experienced, but new to the track person to get the flow of the place.
I can personally attest Chin has instructors who are there just for check rides as I've done it and didn't have a regular assigned student.
I like how Chin strives to treat everybody as an adult as most will rise to the occasion and I like the freedom of not being nanny'ed to death.
-Mike
#44
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There is nothing wrong with eating some humble pie and starting in a lower run group to establish yourself with a new organization like Chin. Just because you are a racer doesn't make you a good DE participant. Frankly, I'd be hesitant of any DE organizers that do not operate that way.
#45
Rennlist Member
It should be noted that Chin is just as particular about picking their instructors. They won't accept a new instructor without some sort of verified national credential. At least, that was the rule when I was a new instructor.