Do people race base model Porsches?
04-19-2019, 09:47 AM
#1
Track Day
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2019
Posts: 20
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Do people race base model Porsches?
Porsche puts so much effort and engineering into all their cars and a higher level into the sports car lines, I wonder if anyone that owns a base model races them? When I say race I am referring to closed track racing. It seems with a lower amount of horsepower and such, some different driving skills could be necessary.
The base models do not contain many of the racing attributes which may cause it to handle in a less than desired manner on a track. This would cause a driver of a high performance Porsche to rethink track strategy. Possibly?
I think of it like running donkeys at an equestrian event. They can do it, but the rider needs to understand the capabilities of the horse. No disrespect to donkeys or base model Porsches!
The base models do not contain many of the racing attributes which may cause it to handle in a less than desired manner on a track. This would cause a driver of a high performance Porsche to rethink track strategy. Possibly?
I think of it like running donkeys at an equestrian event. They can do it, but the rider needs to understand the capabilities of the horse. No disrespect to donkeys or base model Porsches!
04-19-2019, 09:52 AM
#2
Perfect Angel
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
Spec Boxster is one of if not the largest class in PCA Club Racing and is restricted to the base model Boxster 1997-1999
SP2 is another based on the base model 944 (and some variants)
SP2 is another based on the base model 944 (and some variants)
04-19-2019, 09:57 AM
#3
Rennlist Member
04-19-2019, 10:10 AM
#4
Banned
I don’t think OP’s “racing” means what we think it means. Probably refering to DE/track days which 95% of “normal” people call “racing” — speaking from experience. Could be wrong.
04-19-2019, 10:12 AM
#5
Rennlist
Basic Site Sponsor
Basic Site Sponsor
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Durham, NC and Virginia International Raceway
Posts: 18,672
Received 2,827 Likes
on
1,667 Posts
Porsche puts so much effort and engineering into all their cars and a higher level into the sports car lines, I wonder if anyone that owns a base model races them? When I say race I am referring to closed track racing. It seems with a lower amount of horsepower and such, some different driving skills could be necessary.
The base models do not contain many of the racing attributes which may cause it to handle in a less than desired manner on a track. This would cause a driver of a high performance Porsche to rethink track strategy. Possibly?
I think of it like running donkeys at an equestrian event. They can do it, but the rider needs to understand the capabilities of the horse. No disrespect to donkeys or base model Porsches!
The base models do not contain many of the racing attributes which may cause it to handle in a less than desired manner on a track. This would cause a driver of a high performance Porsche to rethink track strategy. Possibly?
I think of it like running donkeys at an equestrian event. They can do it, but the rider needs to understand the capabilities of the horse. No disrespect to donkeys or base model Porsches!
Often, drivers in more restricted (base model) classes such as SPB and SPC exhibit better execution of fundamental skills.
The laws of physics doesn’t know the difference between a well driven SPB, SPC or SP2 car and a GTA2 car, but because the modifications you point to as a supposed superiority over base models are so varied in GTA2 compared to the more restricted classes, we’ll never know how good, in fact, the GTA2 driver is using all the capability of the car.
In the Spec classes and more restricted classes, we DO know. It’s all there on the time sheet...
04-19-2019, 10:16 AM
#6
Rennlist
Basic Site Sponsor
Basic Site Sponsor
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Durham, NC and Virginia International Raceway
Posts: 18,672
Received 2,827 Likes
on
1,667 Posts
If you run donkeys against donkeys, and thoroughbreds against thoroughbreds, it’s likely to be a good race. They are not competing against each other, even though they may be combined on track at the same time.
04-19-2019, 10:31 AM
#7
Race Car
I’ll add that this question shows a fundamental lack of understanding of organized wheel to wheel competition.
If you run donkeys against donkeys, and thoroughbreds against thoroughbreds, it’s likely to be a good race. They are not competing against each other, even though they may be combined on track at the same time.
If you run donkeys against donkeys, and thoroughbreds against thoroughbreds, it’s likely to be a good race. They are not competing against each other, even though they may be combined on track at the same time.
"1st in each sprint and won the enduro, set new track record"
After a few days of race vids appearing around the web, next time they see me, they almost call me a liar because 2 997 Cups cross the finish in a video of an enduro ahead of my son's SP2 car...
T
Trending Topics
04-19-2019, 10:31 AM
#8
Porsche Club of America (PCA) has a great Club Racing Program where many of the cars are base models with minimal allowed upgrades.
https://pcaclubracing.org/
PCA also has lots of High Performance Drivers Education (HPDE/DE) events where drivers take their base model Porsche to the track to improve driver skills and have a blast learning and improving.
https://www.pca.org/drivers-education
https://pcaclubracing.org/
PCA also has lots of High Performance Drivers Education (HPDE/DE) events where drivers take their base model Porsche to the track to improve driver skills and have a blast learning and improving.
https://www.pca.org/drivers-education
04-19-2019, 10:35 AM
#9
WRONGLY ACCUSED!
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Connecticut Valley Region
Posts: 14,464
Received 3,272 Likes
on
1,584 Posts
The vast majority of PCA club race cars are "base model" cars. The tweaks to the engine and suspension are relatively minor in comparison to a "real race car".
Even a GTB1 class car, like I have, is not so heavily modified as to make it an entirely different creature from where its life started.
Even a GTB1 class car, like I have, is not so heavily modified as to make it an entirely different creature from where its life started.
04-19-2019, 10:37 AM
#10
Rennlist Member
I go back to one of my favorite quotes, I think from someone here on Rennlist. "with the right rules a cement mixer would be competitive"
If you are talking PCA letter class racing where the allowed modifications are fixed, the classes are pretty narrow and model specific variations are factored in, "I" class for instance includes 981 boxster S and 991.2 Carreras.
If you are talking scca or imsa, where the allowed modifications are variable,, then you get into balance of performance formulas. If I brought my cement mixer to an imsa race I might be allowed to remove the drum and add rocket boosters, and my competitors would need to run bicycle tires.
It's all in the rules.
If you are talking PCA letter class racing where the allowed modifications are fixed, the classes are pretty narrow and model specific variations are factored in, "I" class for instance includes 981 boxster S and 991.2 Carreras.
If you are talking scca or imsa, where the allowed modifications are variable,, then you get into balance of performance formulas. If I brought my cement mixer to an imsa race I might be allowed to remove the drum and add rocket boosters, and my competitors would need to run bicycle tires.
It's all in the rules.
Last edited by jscott82; 04-19-2019 at 12:06 PM.
04-19-2019, 11:02 AM
#11
Drifting
Many people (myself included) prior to getting involved in the sport are under a mis-conception that you need a very fast and powerful car to be able to drive it on the track and race it. I learned that is NOT the case, in fact the opposite is true especially when starting your track career. I learned that lesson and got into a SPB which I am still learning how to drive fast.
04-19-2019, 11:20 AM
#12
WRONGLY ACCUSED!
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Connecticut Valley Region
Posts: 14,464
Received 3,272 Likes
on
1,584 Posts
Many people (myself included) prior to getting involved in the sport are under a mis-conception that you need a very fast and powerful car to be able to drive it on the track and race it. I learned that is NOT the case, in fact the opposite is true especially when starting your track career. I learned that lesson and got into a SPB which I am still learning how to drive fast.
I learned in a 944T with minimal mods and absolutely no nannies. I think starting out with a car without nannies helps prevent you from developing bad habits.
04-19-2019, 12:33 PM
#14
Rennlist Member
The vast majority of PCA club race cars are "base model" cars. The tweaks to the engine and suspension are relatively minor in comparison to a "real race car".
Even a GTB1 class car, like I have, is not so heavily modified as to make it an entirely different creature from where its life started.
Even a GTB1 class car, like I have, is not so heavily modified as to make it an entirely different creature from where its life started.
Our home-bred 1975 Monza with Warren Agor as owner-driver turned a 56 sec lap time at Lime Rock when the track surface in turns 1 and 2 were rough.
To me any car modified for competitive racing with no "nannies" is the "Real Race Car," the driver controls the full results and must have excellent car control to be competitive.
On the 1975 Memorial Day weekend, the 56 sec lap time was fourth on the grid.
04-19-2019, 02:23 PM
#15
Addict
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
Just how "base" model are you thinking? 