ben in lj

"As you can see, Porsche is either undercharging USA customers, or did a reasonably good job of hedging the $/Euro exchange rate."

yep, porsche learned their lesson and now has production hedged to 2007.

Mark GT2

Labcars:

We went to Rosens and got there at 2:10 and we missed seeing your car.

If you get out to West Chester with it let me know - we'd love to go for a spin. Perhaps we could trade you for a track ride/drive in either our 2001 Turbo or 2002 GT2

Have fun with it.

Mark Reynolds
610-738-7115 (in case you ever get out this way.....)

Les Quam

Carrera GT and Mike,
If you are not going to speak english (pertinacious and impervious) I am going back to my viper board, where I can understand what they are talking about!

W8MM

Hi Les,

Frankly, I don't get what Carrera GT thought was pertinacious about my comments. I don't think I had been tediously repeating my currency observations, ad infinitum. But, I decided to let that small point go in the interest of staying on point.

Nick

Labcar, the reason why I asked about Phil is because I lived there for 6 months and worked in the area for over 15 years. My recollection was the roads were in terrible condition except possibly for the toll roads roads which were frequented by law enforcement.

The main line area is the one area where I would live in Phil. Beautiful place.

Regarding comments from Carlos and CF, neither one can tolerate any remarks which can be construed as negative about Porsche. I acknowledge that after being a Porsche fan and owner I have become disenchanted with the company direction. As a result I have migrated to Ferrari ( 360 Spider) though I also own a Cayenne. I also take the opportunity when appropriate to question the dogma surrounding Porsche.

As for La Jolla and the surrounding area, Ben is to get his CGT in NOv. He and I will experience some of the roads first hand. If your ever in the area please let me know. There are some places to have fun.

Carlos from Spain

Whatever Nick/nberry, I just wanted to warn Les of your hidden game, its always the same, you start with a hypocritical shallow nice comment to lower the guard and hide your intentions and then you use sarcasm to discredit and put-down Porsche, the CGT and their owners with a smiley at the end, if you are replied too you then play victim and go on and on, and thats what seems to constitute the mayority of your contributions in the Porsche forums. And the reason you really asked Les "where in Phil. were you able to even remotely put the car to any kind of performance test" was because you repeatedly defend that buying a CGT is stupid because you will never be able to use its performance in any street, wont dare to take it to any track, non-pro drivers can't drive it and they are just bought for show and no one will be really honest about the CGT. Thats where that innocent question of a unbiased curious poster like yourself was really comming from. So, since he was unaware and I was afraid he might of innocently bite into it and may have turned into another locked thread like I seen you causing before in other threads. Anyone can do a search and see for themselves what your obcession is, here is just a "few" examples:

http://www.rennteam.com/showflat.php...fpart=all&vc=1
http://www.rennteam.com/showflat.php...rev=#Post24173
http://www.rennteam.com/showflat.php...fpart=all&vc=1
http://www.rennteam.com/showflat.php...fpart=all&vc=1
https://rennlist.com/forums/showthre...hreadid=110180

A real sportcar enthusiast will purchase a car for pleasure of the sporty-driving experience it yields and would admire the CGT and be glad for the fortunate few who will enjoy them, a poseur will purchase a car and use it only for showing off and will turn green with envy if the neighboor's car is more attention grabbing than his.

Carrera GT

Can't I play with long words around here?

If we all want to talk about cars few of us will ever drive, much less own, then I feel I have a right to dig a little into my vocabulary from time to time ...

And by pertinacious, I meant adhering to an opinion despite relevant facts; I did not mean being repetitive and I should have just said "ignoring the facts."

Cheers,

Carrera GT

Wow. When you call someone out, you do the homework. This would be a good time for Nick to realise he's just been tarred and feathered.

Les Quam

I have read most of the threads quoted by Carlos regarding Nick. My thoughts are that he has bought a cayenne so he is a Porsche buyer and has put his money where is mouth is so to speak. I don't get the impression from reading the threads that he is intentionally here to bash Porsche. He just has strong feelings about the CGT. As do I. While I don't agree with much of what he has posted I didn't find it to be malicious or inflamatory. Just his opinions.

In one thread Ben calls his 360 a piece of junk. That car may be many things to many people but it is not a piece of junk. It's a handbuilt fantastic car and although different from a porsche I believe it's a well built car. Far from junk in my opinion. I can't imagine any objective person finding that 360 to be junk.

I tend to think some of us with large deposits are a little apprehensive about a car we can't drive, or see. then we start figuring sales tax, insurance and registration and we have well over half a million in this car. And objectively in the quarter mile it's only 2 tenths slower than a Ford GT. Porsche is building a large volume relatively speaking amount of cars so long term value is a concern. A further concern is that the world wide HP wars are just starting and who knows if in 3 to 4 years a mustang Cobra will have 600 plus HP. So I don't find Nick's comments to be inflammatory.

I think most of you guys should be flagged 15 yards for piling on or unnecessary roughness. In my pertinacious opinion.

W8MM

Hey, long words are fine with me, please continue. I guess I was a bit confused by the alternate meaning you intended because I thought I was the one who had the FACTS on my side.

I was initially quite shocked when the official $US pricing was announced just prior to the Geneva introduction. There was plenty of disgruntled muttering going around the show between customers who were there to see the unveiling of the production CGT. I was commiserating by doing some of the muttering. It was only after thinking about the exchange rates, and being reminded that the estimated price was always "a bit less than 400K Euros", that I realised what had happened to the pricing.

Every price change that goes against a potential buyer's expectations need not be attributed to bad faith on the part of the seller. After doing some research in grad school, I found that the traditional game of "Blame the Seller" has some pretty strong parallels to Marx's story in Das Kapital about the owner of the pea coat factory.

ben in lj

"In one thread Ben calls his 360 a piece of junk."

i don't remember it that way. perhaps you could provide a link to the thread to back that up. while i do remember vaguely the thread to which you are referring. i'm thinking you may be boneing up on the skills needed to be a potential bush family or media member when it comes to contextual distortion (unintentional or otherwise) of facts.

Carlos from Spain

Somehow that doesn't surprise me, but then again you are too new around the boards to know the whole story.

Les Quam

Carlos,
I acknowledge I am new and may not know the whole story. My concern after watching the disaster on the GT2 and GT3 board is that this may get just as ugly which I hope does not happen. I think a half million dollar car is bound to evoke strong opinions which is fine with me. I spend time here to learn,relax and talk about cars and I enjoy the time I spend here. So I try to remain open regarding different ways of looking at the same car.

Ben,
I found the quote on one of Carlo's links. I don't know how to bring it back here. I got the impression you were just razzing Nick and expressing your personal opinion of Ferrari's history of unreliability which in my opinion existed through the 355 series but was greatly improved with the 360 series. Prior to the 360 series I found Ferrari's to have some serious quality control issue's including their top model's. However those same issue's exist in the musclecars I own so I look at the design and find almost all Ferrari's to have an art to them much like a musclecar. Even though sometimes they leave you stranded on the side of the road. Like Tim Allen found his CGT.

Carlos from Spain

Les Quam,
I share your concern thats why I wanted to uncover Nick before it happened here, if you look at some of the threads I listed, some were locked cause of it, so if you know were he is comming from you will respond differently or just not at all as many people are doing as you may notice. Anyway, now that its done, lets get back to the CGT

Les Quam

Carlos,
I have not failed to notice the difficult nature of some of those threads. And I understand why you raised the issue here. I also have observed some of his threads on other forums.

In regard to the CGT if the post on rennteam.com is correct and the 997 turbo will be 575 HP with a powerkit and with the apparent advance in 997 suspension that does not in my opinion bode well for the value of the CGT.