911racer

I figure this is probably an old question, but I could not find a good post already out there on this, so I am going to ask again anyway.

What needs to happen to a 6 cup to make it compliant for SCCA GT2.

Does it need to have a motorsport sealed motor (someone had said that once) if it does, where does it say that in the gcr.

What other gotchas are there and what changes (if any) can be made.

Thanks

Ed

Phokaioglaukos

A PCA GTC3 car requires straps on the rear window, partial straps on the windscreen and a left side window net (cannot run with windows). No other changes required, or permitted (as far as I can tell).

analogmike

HI,

you need (in addition to a stock original car):

windshield clips
rear window straps
maybe remove door windows and add nets (I did it but can't remember if it was required).
something else that I forget...

A sealed motor will help, then you don't have to tear it apart to prove compliance if you podium.

bgiere

So are we going SCCA racing next year then?

Surfbum

Are they putting restrictors in 997 cups to also run SCCA GT2?

boothkc

Above are correct for 6-7 Cup (sealed motor [likely only checked at run offs], no side windows, left net, front window clips, rear window supports). We also have a regional only class that allows them to be run as delivered "PC" class, but other regions may not have it. Cups should dominate GT2 now. No fuel cell needed.

7 Cup needs the restrictor plate too. We found this is good for about -20hp.

7 Cup has to weigh 2900 and 6 Cup 2700, I recall.

Slight advantage still to 7 Cups IMHO, but I guess we will see next week at the run offs how things shake out.

see this thread re restrictor plates:

https://rennlist.com/forums/porsche-...ate-specs.html

cheers,
Kevin

TwentySix

Here's a link to the SCCA rulebook (page GCR - 358) and I've pulled out the section on GT3 Cup Cars... good luck out there!

http://scca.cdn.racersites.com/prod/...dSeptember.pdf

SCCA GT2 Cars - PORSCHE - 996/997 GT3 Cup

Model Years 996:98-05 | 997:06-09

Body Style 2dr

Driveline RWD

Wheelbase (in) 996: 92.5 | 997: 92.7

Notes: Cars must be prepared in accordance with the appropriate model/year Porsche factory 911 GT3
Cup parts catalog/service manual. Cars may not be altered in any way except as authorized below.
Drivers must have the correct year manuals as they apply to their specific car in their possession.
Safety, drivers comfort, driver control and instrumentation items may be modified per the GCR.
Original factory installed Matter/IMV roll cages are allowed. The stock unmodified fuel tank is
allowed. Side door windows must be removed and windshield clips must be installed per GCR
9.3 Windshield Clips/Rear Window Straps. All other SCCA safety standards apply. The following
additional modifications are authorized: Alternate hood provided it is a facsimile of the stock part.
Any wheel, including 5 bolt (and the required 5 bolt modification to the hubs) provided they do not
exceed 18x9 F and 18x11 R. Tires per GCR. Battery size and location is unrestricted. Shocks are
unrestricted but they shall be installed in the stock locations with the stock, unmodified pick up
points. Any suspension settings are allowed provided they are achieved without modifications. Machining
of suspension components and pick up points to achieve caster/camber/toe is not allowed.
Lubricants, consumable fluids (brake fluid, coolant etc.) and oil filters are open free. Modifications
listed in Grand Am, IMSA Cup, World Challenge or any other rules, except those listed above, are
specifically not allowed. No updating or backdating permitted between 996 and 997 cars. 996 required
gear ratios: Crown wheel and pinion 8/32; 1st gear 13/41, 2nd gear 20/40, 3rd gear 25/39,
4th gear 29/36 or 26/34, 5th gear 32/33 or 32/35, 6th gear 35/30 or 34/31; 997 required gear
ratios: Crown wheel and pinion 8/32; 1st gear 12/38, 2nd gear 15/32, 3rd gear 18/31, 4th gear
20/28, 5th gear 23/26, 6th gear 29/27


Engine

Type DOHC

Bore x Stroke (mm) 100.0 x 76.4

Disp. (cc) 3598

Head Type Alum, Crossflow

Valves/Cyl. 4

Fuel Induction OEM fuel injection w/ stock, unmodified throttle body

Weight (lbs) 996: 2730 | 997: 2900


Notes: 996 and 997 Porsche Cup cars only. 997 Porsche
Cup car must use 62mm (max) ID X 90mm OD X
.060” +-.005”, mounted flush against throttle body
intake flange and retained by stock bellows. See
Appendix F. Flat Plate Intake Restrictor, except last
bullet.

911racer

Yes, get your car.

911racer

Nice, but not mandatory for the motorsport motor. Good to know.

Thanks

Ed

cstreit

What?

Skypalace

Sealed motor used to be required, I ran Runoffs twice in my 996 cup, 2nd and 5th. However the SCCA techs, even at Runoffs, were not terribly consistent on understanding rules for ANY of the GT cars that are line items, and run per spec of some other rulebook. The 996 Cup used to run per Michelin Cup rules, which included sealed motors, gearboxes, and ECU's but SCCA wasn't able to check the seals (no scan tool).

Even that said, I saw clearly noncompliant cars on the podium with me. Noncompliant in a way that I could see on the TV, other aspects you actually had to be within 15 feet of the car to see.

I no longer run SCCA Nationally, and now run a series (Porsche Pirelli GT3 Cup) where PMNA is at some races and have trained the inspectors, and they tech and verify each car at every event. I personally prefer running on a level playing field, not everyone shares that philisophy.

There are of course other reasons I chose a different series.

boothkc

This year at the runoffs they went through Tom's winning 997 Cup pretty thoroughly.....

It spent about 3h in tech where among other things they pulled a valve cover off the PMNA sealed motor to check cam lift (ugh), checked gear ratios in the sealed trans, and pulled the diff from the trans to insect it. The usual safety checks were done too. So in effect they broke the seals in the engine and trans which is a bit of a PIA to get it re-sealed. Seems they felt "anyone can buy these seals on Ebay...." and had to double check stuff. I don't believe they were able to check the ECU which was stock and sealed for PC.

Kevin

Skypalace

When I was on the podium in 2005 (all three were 996 Cup cars) they did not touch any of our engines, other than verifying intake diameter. I had PMNA seals but am not sure what was checked on the other cars.

It would be nice if they invited PMNA to bring or lend them a scanner, so they could scan the seals (which are RFID tagged and stored in a PMNA database) and not have to break them, and a Bosch tool would allow them to verify ECU programming. But as a non-PMNA sanctioned series, I can imagine that PMNA might not be terribly excited about being involved for one race a year to verify compliance on one make of car in the paddock, while not having input into any competitors.

I haven't run Runoffs since 2007 so perhaps compliance in other areas has improved, but the issues I noticed during my visits were not engine-related (I had no visibility into engines).

I'm guessing that part of the issue is likely well-intentioned tech inspectors that don't know the cars well, running in a class where mos things are open (other than engine displacement, weight, and track) for other GT cars.

I was at multiple national events where the tech inspectors had clearly never read the Cup Car line item in the GT2 section. If I had a dollar for each time a tech inspector wanted to drill my cage to verify wall thickness, or wanted to deny me a tech sticker because my roll cage diameter was 'non-compliant'... I quickly started bringing a copy of the GCR's with me, with factory documentation of my cage, and still had to 'hold out' for another official to actually read the GCR and override the tech inspector with the drill...

ballzout

It needs a turbo... did you catch the runoffs results??? you won't find any 996's there any more, thanks to some clever bloke who decided to punt his way into to GCR as being "ok" to run with the 996's in GT2 as long as he has a few more pounds and a slightly smaller intake opening!!!!!!!!! I've seen seemingly compliant 997's running FASTER than GT1's and SP cars on faster tracks, let alone tight ones !
It's true some guys can drive the wheels off a datsun 510 and keep up with an AS car, but at a club level SCCA is far from being in a perfect world! Run what ya brung, and I hope we can have some close wheel to wheel action, even in 3rd place (;

Skypalace

You must see some awfully slow GT1 and SP cars.

None of the GT2 cars, nor the 997.2, are anywhere close to GT1 cars.

Look at this year's Runoff results. http://www.mylaps.com/results/showevent.jsp?id=839665

The fastest GT2 car is multiple seconds slower than the SLOWEST of the 14 GT1 cars. The faster GT1 cars are over 10 seconds a lap quicker.

Remember that a Porsche won because the first-place tubeframe car went off-track.