Various Series Cup Car differences
#46
Rennlist Member
Where are you guys getting this requirement for sealed boxes? The rules are clear that the engine must have PMNA seals, however there is NO requirement for sealed gearboxes in Pirelli cup. The rules require a stock box but do permit some updating and backdating of ratios. I'm going through this on my car right now.
Getting a motor resealed is a pain in the *** as it is and in an older car brings up a whole pile of issues, the car is down a month while the motor goes to Porsche for inspection/dyno/seal and reinstall, all this is $2-3K IF there are no issues. To have an early box torn down inspected and sealed would be cost prohibitive.
I thought it was cool that they had the exhibition class so you could run out of spec cars, WC, GTRs etc...no longer. Without that you have to go through the PMNA gauntlet. To bad for those only running a few races a year.
Getting a motor resealed is a pain in the *** as it is and in an older car brings up a whole pile of issues, the car is down a month while the motor goes to Porsche for inspection/dyno/seal and reinstall, all this is $2-3K IF there are no issues. To have an early box torn down inspected and sealed would be cost prohibitive.
I thought it was cool that they had the exhibition class so you could run out of spec cars, WC, GTRs etc...no longer. Without that you have to go through the PMNA gauntlet. To bad for those only running a few races a year.
#47
Nordschleife Master
Where are you guys getting this requirement for sealed boxes? The rules are clear that the engine must have PMNA seals, however there is NO requirement for sealed gearboxes in Pirelli cup. The rules require a stock box but do permit some updating and backdating of ratios. I'm going through this on my car right now.
#48
I misspoke if I said sealed gearboxes are required in Pirelli GT3 Cup. They did check my engine and gearbox seals, perhaps as part of the scrutineer training. If seal is intact and scans ok, I assume they consider it a compliant gearbox and don't feel the need to do any further checking.
The rules do allow some specific updating/backdating of ratios for Gold and Platinum cars, but do not currently allow non-stock parts.
The rules do allow some specific updating/backdating of ratios for Gold and Platinum cars, but do not currently allow non-stock parts.
#49
Here is the email from Greg - sealed engines, not gearboxes:
Drivers:
As our one make series evolves and we move forward to focus on the determining variable in your race craft and your racing is the DRIVER. To assist us in this area we are with PMNA's assistance looking to seal your engines beginning in 2012.
Please see the attached memo with directions on how to get this completed prior to the beginning of our race season at Miller.
If your engine is already sealed, then you do not need to have it resealed. If your engine was not rebuild by PMNA (ex. 996 GT3 Cup engines) you need to have it sealed. PMNA is verifying the range of horsepower and ECU mapping. We are receiving a discounted price for this process from PMNA as a Series Partner; their are only two series in the United Sates (IMSA and Pirelli GT3 Cup Trophy USA West) that have this standard.
This step will allow you to know that we do have a level playing field for you to compete on.
Also, if your engine has been sealed for IMSA GT3 Cup than you do not need to have it resealed. PMNA has the information on that engine already.
Thank you for your timely response and action,
Let's get on the track and go racing,
Gregory Franz
President
Competent Motorsport LLC
Pirelli GT3 Cup Trophy USA West
www.competentms.com
www.facebook.com/CompetentMotorsport
Drivers:
As our one make series evolves and we move forward to focus on the determining variable in your race craft and your racing is the DRIVER. To assist us in this area we are with PMNA's assistance looking to seal your engines beginning in 2012.
Please see the attached memo with directions on how to get this completed prior to the beginning of our race season at Miller.
If your engine is already sealed, then you do not need to have it resealed. If your engine was not rebuild by PMNA (ex. 996 GT3 Cup engines) you need to have it sealed. PMNA is verifying the range of horsepower and ECU mapping. We are receiving a discounted price for this process from PMNA as a Series Partner; their are only two series in the United Sates (IMSA and Pirelli GT3 Cup Trophy USA West) that have this standard.
This step will allow you to know that we do have a level playing field for you to compete on.
Also, if your engine has been sealed for IMSA GT3 Cup than you do not need to have it resealed. PMNA has the information on that engine already.
Thank you for your timely response and action,
Let's get on the track and go racing,
Gregory Franz
President
Competent Motorsport LLC
Pirelli GT3 Cup Trophy USA West
www.competentms.com
www.facebook.com/CompetentMotorsport
#51
Nordschleife Master
Hello,
I had a nice long phone conversation with Greg on Friday. While PMNA did express an interest in running the series with sealed gearboxes, Greg felt that both sealing the engines and the gearboxes would be too cost prohibitive, especially in an amateur series like his, and PMNA agreed to compromise and just seal the engines in the series. However, he said he didn't know how things might change in following years as the series grew over time and that in coming years the rules could change to require sealed gearboxes in at least the newest vehicles in the series. However, I doubt that they would ever require a 996 Cup to be sealed and suspect that if the rules do ever change it will only be the newest 2-3 years of cars that would be "platinum" class type cars at the front end of the field.
Furthermore, Greg reiterated to me that our parts are considered 100% compliant as long as they are the proper ratios. As long as somone isn't cheating by using ratios other than the ones clearly spelled out in the rules, GT components are considered direct replacement parts for OEM parts, as they have been in the past.
Kind Regards,
Matt Monson
Guard Transmission llc
I had a nice long phone conversation with Greg on Friday. While PMNA did express an interest in running the series with sealed gearboxes, Greg felt that both sealing the engines and the gearboxes would be too cost prohibitive, especially in an amateur series like his, and PMNA agreed to compromise and just seal the engines in the series. However, he said he didn't know how things might change in following years as the series grew over time and that in coming years the rules could change to require sealed gearboxes in at least the newest vehicles in the series. However, I doubt that they would ever require a 996 Cup to be sealed and suspect that if the rules do ever change it will only be the newest 2-3 years of cars that would be "platinum" class type cars at the front end of the field.
Furthermore, Greg reiterated to me that our parts are considered 100% compliant as long as they are the proper ratios. As long as somone isn't cheating by using ratios other than the ones clearly spelled out in the rules, GT components are considered direct replacement parts for OEM parts, as they have been in the past.
Kind Regards,
Matt Monson
Guard Transmission llc
#52
GTC:
Shocks/springs are free
Alignment settings are free (limited to -4 camber in imsa challenge)
Endurance brake cooling kit
Battery re-location to passenger foot well
Restrictor (unsure what size, but it was intended to keep the GTC cars from being so close to the GT2 and LMPC cars at the end of the straights so it would be easier to pass for the faster class cars)
Brake pads and rotors are free
Stock Calipers are allowed modified Ti pistons
Rear axles : Pankle or Metalor
Radiators: open
Shocks/springs are free
Alignment settings are free (limited to -4 camber in imsa challenge)
Endurance brake cooling kit
Battery re-location to passenger foot well
Restrictor (unsure what size, but it was intended to keep the GTC cars from being so close to the GT2 and LMPC cars at the end of the straights so it would be easier to pass for the faster class cars)
Brake pads and rotors are free
Stock Calipers are allowed modified Ti pistons
Rear axles : Pankle or Metalor
Radiators: open