Need the Rennlist love
12-20-2012, 09:27 PM
#1
Racer
Thread Starter
Need the Rennlist love
Hello all,
I am selling my 10 BMW M5 and looking at the Panamera 4S or Turbo (10 or 11). Wish I could afford a new one - but I think a highly optioned Turbo a few years old would be the ticket - letting the original owner take the hit.
Okay - now the issue. A few weeks ago while in Miami, my wife and I, test drove the Tesla Model S (performance). First impressions were very good. Instant acceleration because of the electric motors. Also no differentials, transmissions or gearing of any kind. In a 1/4 mile test it bet the M5 (the typical american way of testing how fast a car is). Interior is minimal but nice - not the best leather quality. It is the first 4-door model and it is missing alot of the options that we take for granted in a car that costs $95K. The console is a 17" touch screen - very cool - but the newness will wear out like that of the touch phones.
Anyway, we put down the $5K fully refundable deposit on one (prices go up by $5K - Jan 1). Signed into the forums on their website and asked a few questions. Mostly comparing a $95K Tesla to the rest of the world in the same price category, and how the Tesla, even though it will get there, is not there yet. Stated that you don't drive in the real world stop light to stop light and that the true test of a car, calling itself the performance model, are the curves and corners of the world.
Holy crap - you would of thought that I called out their moms or sisters on this. Talk about thin skinned - these people were absolutely rude!!!!! I got slam danced more than drunk hooker at a frat party. WTF? One guy wrote back some comments and he was one of the extremely small and few that actually got what I was trying ti discuss.
Well, this got so bad that I thought - "if this is what the typical owners will be like, I don't want anything to do with them", or the car. The Tesla is just a different type of car that will give you a different way of driving and owning a 100% electric car with a range of 300 miles.
My wife and I thought it would be nice for one of us not to have to fuel up so often. Her car is a Cayenne S Hybrid and you couldn't bribe her out of that car, and I agreed, it is an incredible great driving car. We thought that it would be less expensive than the 4S or Turbo and no fuel, even though some of the nicer options were not present. One blaring example is no temp or fan controls for the rear seats and no rear heated seats - these are almost necessary in winter climates.
So there is my brief experience into the all electric car world. Nice to post to the good people of Rennlist. I am usually on the 930 or GT3 RS forums. So looking forward to being part of this one.
Thanks for listening,
Mark
I am selling my 10 BMW M5 and looking at the Panamera 4S or Turbo (10 or 11). Wish I could afford a new one - but I think a highly optioned Turbo a few years old would be the ticket - letting the original owner take the hit.
Okay - now the issue. A few weeks ago while in Miami, my wife and I, test drove the Tesla Model S (performance). First impressions were very good. Instant acceleration because of the electric motors. Also no differentials, transmissions or gearing of any kind. In a 1/4 mile test it bet the M5 (the typical american way of testing how fast a car is). Interior is minimal but nice - not the best leather quality. It is the first 4-door model and it is missing alot of the options that we take for granted in a car that costs $95K. The console is a 17" touch screen - very cool - but the newness will wear out like that of the touch phones.
Anyway, we put down the $5K fully refundable deposit on one (prices go up by $5K - Jan 1). Signed into the forums on their website and asked a few questions. Mostly comparing a $95K Tesla to the rest of the world in the same price category, and how the Tesla, even though it will get there, is not there yet. Stated that you don't drive in the real world stop light to stop light and that the true test of a car, calling itself the performance model, are the curves and corners of the world.
Holy crap - you would of thought that I called out their moms or sisters on this. Talk about thin skinned - these people were absolutely rude!!!!! I got slam danced more than drunk hooker at a frat party. WTF? One guy wrote back some comments and he was one of the extremely small and few that actually got what I was trying ti discuss.
Well, this got so bad that I thought - "if this is what the typical owners will be like, I don't want anything to do with them", or the car. The Tesla is just a different type of car that will give you a different way of driving and owning a 100% electric car with a range of 300 miles.
My wife and I thought it would be nice for one of us not to have to fuel up so often. Her car is a Cayenne S Hybrid and you couldn't bribe her out of that car, and I agreed, it is an incredible great driving car. We thought that it would be less expensive than the 4S or Turbo and no fuel, even though some of the nicer options were not present. One blaring example is no temp or fan controls for the rear seats and no rear heated seats - these are almost necessary in winter climates.
So there is my brief experience into the all electric car world. Nice to post to the good people of Rennlist. I am usually on the 930 or GT3 RS forums. So looking forward to being part of this one.
Thanks for listening,
Mark
12-21-2012, 02:35 AM
#2
Hey Mark, welcome to the Panamera forums! I echo your thoughts on the Tesla as well. It needs a few more iterations before it can really start to feel comfortable in its own skin. It certainly ticks all the check boxes, but at that price range, people cross-shopping it are forced to look at more established / respected makes.
I strongly considered the Model S, A7, and XF before finally purchasing a Panamera S. I'm no fanboy of the Panamera; I know its limitations. But I came to terms with all its faults -- both real and perceived -- before the purchase and it has made me a happy man.
I suspect the target market for the Model S are affluent technophiles with kids. While I somewhat fall into this category (technophile with kids, not necessarily affluent), I don't believe that a touch screen is the answer for every interior control. It seems to me that it was done 1) to cut expenses 2) because they could.
I strongly considered the Model S, A7, and XF before finally purchasing a Panamera S. I'm no fanboy of the Panamera; I know its limitations. But I came to terms with all its faults -- both real and perceived -- before the purchase and it has made me a happy man.
I suspect the target market for the Model S are affluent technophiles with kids. While I somewhat fall into this category (technophile with kids, not necessarily affluent), I don't believe that a touch screen is the answer for every interior control. It seems to me that it was done 1) to cut expenses 2) because they could.
12-22-2012, 05:27 PM
#3
Racer
Thread Starter
I posted a question on the Tesla forum, secretly looking for facts - I asked "what cars did you own before you bought the Telsa?" Almost all of them had the typical "mass market" cars. The american, japanese and south korean dealerships where it resembles shopping for large lots at Walmart. No selection of any kind of personalization, what's on the shelf is it, and no - why would we special order this car when we have a 100 sitting here.
So these opinions are based upon what their own personal experiences. All relative to what they have owned and what we have owned previously. Fast and great handling to one, may not quite cut the grade to some of us. Not trying to be a snob or "hey look at me I drove a Porsche". That is not why I drive these cars - great design and engineering. Form following function was always the Porsche way - so just my relative opinion base on my past experiences.
To each their own. I do like the Tesla - but it needs more time to develop. Even my wife had second thoughts about it - "just not there", she said. I will still look at their site from time to time and see what's being developed and what isn't working.
Right now - it looks like alot of computer upgrades and some cars not being delivered complete. Some small items missing - nothing serious, but not on a $95K car. Not close to being acceptable to me.
Just my $.02
So these opinions are based upon what their own personal experiences. All relative to what they have owned and what we have owned previously. Fast and great handling to one, may not quite cut the grade to some of us. Not trying to be a snob or "hey look at me I drove a Porsche". That is not why I drive these cars - great design and engineering. Form following function was always the Porsche way - so just my relative opinion base on my past experiences.
To each their own. I do like the Tesla - but it needs more time to develop. Even my wife had second thoughts about it - "just not there", she said. I will still look at their site from time to time and see what's being developed and what isn't working.
Right now - it looks like alot of computer upgrades and some cars not being delivered complete. Some small items missing - nothing serious, but not on a $95K car. Not close to being acceptable to me.
Just my $.02
12-23-2012, 09:53 AM
#4
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Electric cars are still a thing of the future, sadly. Waiting for the diesel plugin hybrid from VW group and hope it is in the new q7 when it arrives. If you are interested in aPanamera like hybrid, check out the fisker karma. That car is fastandcomfortable, but stalls after 100km/h.
12-27-2012, 08:21 AM
#5
Drifting
I test drove and considered the Fisker. It is a gorgeous car and it has some very neat features, not the least of which is all that electric torque! With my commute and lifestyle, a short-range electric like that or the Tesla would work just fine. I can rent something for long trips (or buy a 911 
). But the Fisker had a lot going against it too, small dealer network, lousy build quality, bad reputation, and most importantly, a murky future. Who wants to buy a car that won't be made (or supported) in a few years?
Now, Tesla I think will be around, so that's not a concern. I still have no local dealer though, so I couldn't easily go check one out.
I'm with MPac though - I love my Panamera S. It has faults, few as they are, but the car is so phenomenal otherwise that I can overlook the PDK's shortcomings. MRM, I think you'll really like it. I'm a BMW guy as well, have had 3 M5s and a bunch of others (including most recently an F10 535) and I've very happy where I am in my fourth Porsche.
The only problem you'll have is finding a nice used one. Seems like most of the used Panos out there are the V6 version, which is why I bought a new one.
). But the Fisker had a lot going against it too, small dealer network, lousy build quality, bad reputation, and most importantly, a murky future. Who wants to buy a car that won't be made (or supported) in a few years? Now, Tesla I think will be around, so that's not a concern. I still have no local dealer though, so I couldn't easily go check one out.
I'm with MPac though - I love my Panamera S. It has faults, few as they are, but the car is so phenomenal otherwise that I can overlook the PDK's shortcomings. MRM, I think you'll really like it. I'm a BMW guy as well, have had 3 M5s and a bunch of others (including most recently an F10 535) and I've very happy where I am in my fourth Porsche.
The only problem you'll have is finding a nice used one. Seems like most of the used Panos out there are the V6 version, which is why I bought a new one.
12-28-2012, 05:24 AM
#6
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I get you on the other counts, but where did you get bad build quality? They are built by Uusikaupunki in Finland and when building Porsche Boxters and Caymans, they were selected the third best quality factory in Europe by J.D. quality survay. I think you are wrong with that. They just started building Fiskers in 2011.
12-28-2012, 04:38 PM
#7
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I'm with MPac though - I love my Panamera S. It has faults, few as they are, but the car is so phenomenal otherwise that I can overlook the PDK's shortcomings. MRM, I think you'll really like it. I'm a BMW guy as well, have had 3 M5s and a bunch of others (including most recently an F10 535) and I've very happy where I am in my fourth Porsche.
I just purchased a panamera S for my wife, and we both love the thing - far exceeded our expectations (which was going to be what I found to be the really beautiful and fun F10 535). As a newbie, I'm interested to know what you think the PDK's shortcomings are? I have some observations, but I haven't driven it enough to solidify them, nor have I driven enough performance automatic transmissions to compare it to anything. Also, I've read far more complementary reviews of the PDK than critical.
Enjoying the ride
