Originally Posted by Only1Buck

Sure ... when they took the image of the 911 in to photoshop and stretched it to much in the front they ran out of room in the back and had to move it to the front...

My initial comment was made very much in jest and related to critiques I have read regarding the overall lack of originality in the design of the car and some comments where it was viewed as simply a stretched 911...hence my comment

Originally Posted by Ron_H

I started my association with Porsche as a 356 owner after coming in contact with them as a friend of a Speedster racer. I can remember how enamored I was with them then, and how I was so shocked by the original 911. How could Porsche do such a thing? Then 6 months later I drove out of the Porsche dealer with one of the first 911s. I loved that car and drove it into the ground and it was so much better than a 356 I couldn't believe it. Everything worked better on it than my old 356 coupe. My next cars included a 356 Speedster, and a 911-E; I was still on the right track I thought. The 914s came out and I thought to myself: " Those are toy cars. How could Porsche do such a thing?". Guess what? My next car was a 914/6 which I still have today. A toy? Wrong. A Porsche? More than I could have imagined. Fun. Quick. Nimble. Maybe I'll be fortunate enough to keep it forever. Unfortunately, my six got hit and I suffered a knee injury that prompted my surgeon to advise me to give up stick shift transmissions and clutches. I needed an automatic at least long enough for my knee to repair itself. I called a Porsche dealer friend of mine who could have any car on the lot to drive and always drove 911 Turbos (or so I thought). I explained my situation and asked his suggestions and what he was currently driving. He told me he drove a 928. I laughed and said: "How could Porsche do such a thing as a 928? That isn't a real Porsche; the engine is in the wrong place, it is too big and heavy and the engine is too large to be efficient." He told me to go drive one and try to repeat my criticism. I did. I loved it the first time I drove one, and then bought one, and have since put over 100,000 miles on it in less than seven years. I will keep this one forever if possible for it seems like it will never break. Is the 928 a real Porsche? Drive one and decide. But take your checkbook with you if you do. I love my 928 better than any car or Porsche I have ever had, except maybe my 356 Speedsteer which is the essence of Porsche.

So I have learned to withhold my negative first reactions to new Porsche models. I don't like the Panamera. I share the same criticisms expressed in this thread so far. But until I actually spend a few hundred miles in one, I shall refrain from forming a definite opinion. And when the expected two door version (a new 928?) is released, I will be there to try it out, despite my belief that this Panamera is fugly. My 928 has taught me that Porsches are so well designed that it takes driving one a considerable distance to appreciate the detailed thought that went into creating one. The ergonomics, which are almost perfect on the 928. The seating position which allows hours of pain free high speed driving. The vision out of them. The enormous versatility of luggage capacity which is so improved over the older models. Every model gets better and better. After four hours at triple digit speeds is when it becomes possible to appreciate a Porsche. I suspect that this Panamera will be understood and the body shape will be understood as well. And people's opinion of it's shape will cease to be so important. But I am still wondering: "How could Porsche do such a thing as this Panamera?"

Originally Posted by Ron_H

I started my association with Porsche as a 356 owner after coming in contact with them as a friend of a Speedster racer. I can remember how enamored I was with them then, and how I was so shocked by the original 911. How could Porsche do such a thing? Then 6 months later I drove out of the Porsche dealer with one of the first 911s. I loved that car and drove it into the ground and it was so much better than a 356 I couldn't believe it. Everything worked better on it than my old 356 coupe. My next cars included a 356 Speedster, and a 911-E; I was still on the right track I thought. The 914s came out and I thought to myself: " Those are toy cars. How could Porsche do such a thing?". Guess what? My next car was a 914/6 which I still have today. A toy? Wrong. A Porsche? More than I could have imagined. Fun. Quick. Nimble. Maybe I'll be fortunate enough to keep it forever. Unfortunately, my six got hit and I suffered a knee injury that prompted my surgeon to advise me to give up stick shift transmissions and clutches. I needed an automatic at least long enough for my knee to repair itself. I called a Porsche dealer friend of mine who could have any car on the lot to drive and always drove 911 Turbos (or so I thought). I explained my situation and asked his suggestions and what he was currently driving. He told me he drove a 928. I laughed and said: "How could Porsche do such a thing as a 928? That isn't a real Porsche; the engine is in the wrong place, it is too big and heavy and the engine is too large to be efficient." He told me to go drive one and try to repeat my criticism. I did. I loved it the first time I drove one, and then bought one, and have since put over 100,000 miles on it in less than seven years. I will keep this one forever if possible for it seems like it will never break. Is the 928 a real Porsche? Drive one and decide. But take your checkbook with you if you do. I love my 928 better than any car or Porsche I have ever had, except maybe my 356 Speedsteer which is the essence of Porsche.

So I have learned to withhold my negative first reactions to new Porsche models. I don't like the Panamera. I share the same criticisms expressed in this thread so far. But until I actually spend a few hundred miles in one, I shall refrain from forming a definite opinion. And when the expected two door version (a new 928?) is released, I will be there to try it out, despite my belief that this Panamera is fugly. My 928 has taught me that Porsches are so well designed that it takes driving one a considerable distance to appreciate the detailed thought that went into creating one. The ergonomics, which are almost perfect on the 928. The seating position which allows hours of pain free high speed driving. The vision out of them. The enormous versatility of luggage capacity which is so improved over the older models. Every model gets better and better. After four hours at triple digit speeds is when it becomes possible to appreciate a Porsche. I suspect that this Panamera will be understood and the body shape will be understood as well. And people's opinion of it's shape will cease to be so important. But I am still wondering: "How could Porsche do such a thing as this Panamera?"

Originally Posted by MTHEORY

Also, thought you guys might find this interesting:

http://www.autoblog.com/photos/porsc...enter/1508513/

Originally Posted by Ron_H

I started my association with Porsche as a 356 owner after coming in contact with them as a friend of a Speedster racer. I can remember how enamored I was with them then, and how I was so shocked by the original 911. How could Porsche do such a thing? Then 6 months later I drove out of the Porsche dealer with one of the first 911s. I loved that car and drove it into the ground and it was so much better than a 356 I couldn't believe it. Everything worked better on it than my old 356 coupe. My next cars included a 356 Speedster, and a 911-E; I was still on the right track I thought. The 914s came out and I thought to myself: " Those are toy cars. How could Porsche do such a thing?". Guess what? My next car was a 914/6 which I still have today. A toy? Wrong. A Porsche? More than I could have imagined. Fun. Quick. Nimble. Maybe I'll be fortunate enough to keep it forever. Unfortunately, my six got hit and I suffered a knee injury that prompted my surgeon to advise me to give up stick shift transmissions and clutches. I needed an automatic at least long enough for my knee to repair itself. I called a Porsche dealer friend of mine who could have any car on the lot to drive and always drove 911 Turbos (or so I thought). I explained my situation and asked his suggestions and what he was currently driving. He told me he drove a 928. I laughed and said: "How could Porsche do such a thing as a 928? That isn't a real Porsche; the engine is in the wrong place, it is too big and heavy and the engine is too large to be efficient." He told me to go drive one and try to repeat my criticism. I did. I loved it the first time I drove one, and then bought one, and have since put over 100,000 miles on it in less than seven years. I will keep this one forever if possible for it seems like it will never break. Is the 928 a real Porsche? Drive one and decide. But take your checkbook with you if you do. I love my 928 better than any car or Porsche I have ever had, except maybe my 356 Speedsteer which is the essence of Porsche.

So I have learned to withhold my negative first reactions to new Porsche models. I don't like the Panamera. I share the same criticisms expressed in this thread so far. But until I actually spend a few hundred miles in one, I shall refrain from forming a definite opinion. And when the expected two door version (a new 928?) is released, I will be there to try it out, despite my belief that this Panamera is fugly. My 928 has taught me that Porsches are so well designed that it takes driving one a considerable distance to appreciate the detailed thought that went into creating one. The ergonomics, which are almost perfect on the 928. The seating position which allows hours of pain free high speed driving. The vision out of them. The enormous versatility of luggage capacity which is so improved over the older models. Every model gets better and better. After four hours at triple digit speeds is when it becomes possible to appreciate a Porsche. I suspect that this Panamera will be understood and the body shape will be understood as well. And people's opinion of it's shape will cease to be so important. But I am still wondering: "How could Porsche do such a thing as this Panamera?"

Originally Posted by Carrera GT

That's a nicely written post. I enjoyed the read. I think you and I will never agree on cars like the 928 (and you have the only one with good ergnomics and it has somehow not failed you in the electrics, timing belt, transaxle, driveshaft, rear suspension ...) I've driven and worked on more 928's than I care to admit. Over the years, I did find one that was so much better than all the others -- the owner said he was on a mission to find "a good one" and it took him two years. Even so, the 928 has some engineering weaknesses throughout the model years. For that matter, so does the Cayenne and I have no doubt so will the Panacrapper.

I see a connection between the 928 and the Panamucca -- both cars are the result of some misguided Porsche execs trying to change what Porsche owners will want to buy as they try to expand their markets. The 928 was a mistake (yes, even though it did sell for years and undergo several significant improvements up to the GTS and it received some good reviews and it was from decades ago.) I see the Panablunda as, well, a blunder, but I still hope it makes enough money to finance building future 911's. Maybe they'll sell boat loads of the thing in China and the Middle East and that's fine.

I wouldn't be putting the Boxster or the 914 in the same conversation as the 911 or as the Pana928. Very different threads in the history of Porsche.