Buckfever

"Your describing wine in terms of asparagus is downright funny, but if I ever catch myself describing wine or cheese that way, I might have to contemplate suicide "

I'm still wiping the tears.

Buckfever

https://rennlist.com/forums/991/7308...pressions.html

Great thread.

rpilot

I had forgotten I said that . Yikes



Ah.. Black.. it's not a color. It's a hobby in itself. And one I gave up long ago. If you go with the plain.. it will look delicious when freshly waxed and that feeling will last all of about 10 miles / 10 minutes whichever comes first. The Metallic on the other hand is notorious like the Agate grey for changing color. The black metallic will look black to blue to purple depending on the light it is in. My opinion FWIW, is that the plain black looks great on roadsters like the boxster and such. On the Macan, which is a modern looking stylish vehicle, the metallic black is probably a better choice. Since I am getting lazier and lazier cleaning my car as the years go by, silver that always looks good and clean, is a safe choice for me although I may change my mind to the Dark Blue. Agate is a good color, but changes from bluish-grey(which I like) to brownish-grey (which I hate), regardless a grey color car always looks depressing to me

Buckfever

Looked at the dark blue twice wasn't nearly dark enough for me. I like both the black metallic and agate chameleon effects. I think it is a good point that certain colors work better on certain vehicles. Blown away by the agate on a 911 not so much on the Pan. Prefer to avoid the black but got to see it in person. I am in awe of those who are locked down sight unseen. Greater courage than I.

rpilot

I hope you weren't referrring to me when you said sight unseen. I have seen these colors many times on the dealers lot many times if not on the Macan yet. The dark blue metallic in particular is a shade of blue I really like and I think it would look good with the red brake calipers of the Turbo on silver wheels, whether I go with the 19 Turbos or 20 Classic. . I also think that the agate on the spyder wheels will contrast nicely with dark blue, it's the pattern of the spokes, I don't much like. When I was shopping for my 991, I saw a C2S on the dealers lot with the Dark blue metallic and the Carrera classic wheels for the 991 which are also painted the same color scheme (ie: grey on the inside and machined silver on the outside) and they looked very nice with the Dark blue. But knowing me, the logical side of me (ie: silver is easy to take care of) will probably win in the end.

I have always thought that the agate is a very sophisticated color. Have your SA park an agate side by side with the black if possible and the two blacks you are interested in side by side in broad daylight and then come back after dark (harder in summer, I know.. but you can maybe get him to park the cars along the edge of the lot and then drive by later) and try to see them in lot lighting at night. It will make your decision easier, I think. And a cayenne is an ok substitute to judge color if the macan inventory is low. Like you've already figured out, the 991 and Panny are not.

Buckfever

Not at all.

Buckfever

As far as TCO given the differential the opportunity cost is small, the terminal value of the options approximating zero and given the prevailing low interest rates the discounting of the terminal residual values being rather small I can't argue with you. But you got to have the pockets.

I have noticed this analysis floating around but I think it's mostly visceral by those looking to justify the turbo.

And at this point I need serious moderation for how far off topic I've taken this discussion. From wheel well gap to net present value calculations. LOL

rpilot

If you think you need moderation.. check this epic thread out when you have some time....

https://rennlist.com/forums/991/7300...the-991-a.html

Buckfever

Okay I take it back.

Buckfever

Actually I don't suspect this thread was all that off topic. I suspect that rpilot was simply gracious in using this as a venue to elucidate. And there are clearly some things I need to parse further. I really appreciate it.

rpilot

YVW. Although sometimes I should keep my thoughts to myself. I think I need to take a break from this forum for a while until I actually decide to pull the trigger on the macan purchase.

Buckfever

Well if you're still around talk to me about the PTV+. Who needs it?

Larry Cable

its a good question for an SUV ... I guess if you care about optimal handling, you would want it, otherwise ... meh

rpilot

I know it is a subjective opinion, but I do recommend it .. for handling purposes... PTV+ gives you an electronic diff lock gizmo (I am not really sure if it is a true limited slip diff on the Macan or not), regardless... it brakes the inside wheel on a turn.

To help understand this better, PSM (porsche stability management.. not to be confused with PASM) is also capable of braking a single wheel, but does so when it already senses the slip to regain traction. PTV+ is capable of doing this proactively because the electronic differential allows it to induce to difference in torque delivery to maintain full traction at all times.

Unlike what some journalists have said in their reviews, PTV does not assert itself only at the limit, it asserts itself based on a variety of calculations but it is seamless and inobtrusive. Basically if the road is wet or whatever reason it senses that there might be a traction loss based on your speed or rate of change of direction, it will gently brake the inside wheel inducing a yaw. Similar to how a rudder behaves in an airplane. You could always turn in an airplane without the rudder, but you would be at a 45 degree angle. By inducing a yaw, it also reduces lean in and body roll through a turn. You will never know it's there but if it were taken away you just might miss it. The last statement assumes that you are going to drive the Macan in a spirited way from time to time. If you really are never going to have any fun with it, then no.. you could leave the PTV out and be fine... but then, I would question the raison d 'etre of a Macan , besides the fact that your wife might think it looks kinda cute...

Not every manufactures torque vectoring behaves this way, BTW. Some only brake at the limit, like ford or acura with their RT 4WD system. On the other hand there are also many more advanced torque vectoring systems like acura's SH-AWD which actively distribute power left to right, similar to how PTM (Porsche traction management.. which is included with the macan, btw), distributes power front to back.

I do not have it my 991, but that is because on this car it requires PASM as a pre requisite that I did not go for at the time, reasons for which I have explained elsewhere.

On the Macan, because of the taller stature and intended use by most, I would highly recommend both PASM (included with turbo) and PTV+. As I have said before and you are already aware of my position on the AS systems in general. I will reserve judgement on the AS until I drive the Macan for myself both with and without it hopefully with similar size wheel setup.

Hope that helps.

sebis

^^Very well said, I have PTV+ on my order .