isugoo

I was thinking of Fabspeed tunes with handheld unit and it would fix my concern I have (getting it to 300 hp would be plenty power for street duty) since I'm not handy enough o install/remove JB4 every year for oil change, etc.

BMinSFL

Make sure you know that S+ is not a power adder but a transmission tune. It can be effective to keep you in a gear longer to extract the most of what's available but it won't be any quicker than if you use the paddle shifters to stay in gear longer. The transmission does shift more quickly compared to the other modes. The base engine is pretty weak above 75mph which is why I would recommend a tune for highway driving at higher speeds.

BMinSFL

That's fine too but I recommended the JB4 to have a chance at retaining the drivetrain warranty should you have a claim. If you install a flash tune, you will immediately and irreversably void your drivetrain warranty no matter if you remove it or not before a claim visit.

isugoo

Thanks. This is great info to know. I thought installing/removing tune via handheld unit would be safer in terms of keeping 4 year warranty in safe place but it looks like JB4 would be better option without touching the actual software installed from the factory.

BMinSFL

Correct, flashes are permanently recorded and you don't want to be reflashing all the time if not necessary since there is some risk should there be a voltage variance during the process.

I like the JB4 for exactly that and that I can switch maps with my phone, even while on a trip. I have switched based on the weather to avoid potential issues and sometimes its nice to drive on the stock map to see the difference or for valet mode etc..

boyce89976

Have you ever owned a Porsche? I never had, but I worked for a Porsche dealership in college (long ago) and have a few friends with 911's or Cayman's or Cayenne's, so I've driven quite a few.

Reason I ask, is nothing with a 4 cylinder is going to approach the performance and ownership experience of a 6 cylinder Porsche. If you've never experienced a Porsche with the flat 6, V8 or current turbo 6's, you might as well get a Q5 2.0 if you're looking at a 4 cylinder Porsche as your first Porsche. Just my $.02. Additionally, IMO the Macan S is the best value in the Macan range.

BMinSFL

They have a 991.2 GTS. You can make the same argument to get an SQ5 instead of a Macan S but there is much more than the Audi offers, for a hefty price though. Steering, suspension, brakes, wheels, exhaust, and especially the PDK make the car a Porsche over the Audi. The PDK shifts in S+ alone are worth the difference over the auto in the Q5/SQ5. The engine is a minor detail that can be addressed and offers the benefit of a lighter front end over the V6.

boyce89976

Ah, I missed that they have a 991. I agree with you, it's more than just the engine, but my point is if it's your first Porsche, don't make the mistake of getting the "practical" one thinking the performance will be similar, get one with proper Porsche performance. That's what I did ('23 Macan S) because I knew I'd never be able to convince myself that <300hp was the performance level I was used to from other Porsche's and BMW M's. I feel like my Macan S is as quick as the X5M I had, at a MUCH better value.

BMinSFL

I agree but performance has different meanings to everyone. I enjoy stopping and turning just as much as going fast. I've spent way too much money in the past on high power cars just to realize I'm wasting gas and have no ability to actually use that power where I drive. Also, our modern SUVs are faster than high performance Porsches of the past, so there's that aspect that's constantly changing as well.

My approach was different with with the Macan purchase. I bought used and I think that's where the 4 cylinder models make the most sense for the greatest value. I placed a bet that there is tons of untapped potential in the engine and suspension and while not everyone is into modding, I think that some light mods on the 4cly models can really make it fun. Lighter weight and easier maintenance are other innate benefits of the base engine.

Comparing value to an X5 is a tough sell. The backseat in the Macan is nearly unusable compared to a larger midsize SUV. I view it as a coupe that can sometimes be used as a family car but does not have the same value of a larger vehicle for that purpose.

Paul125

On the configurator the base price for the T is only $6k < the S - if you confiigure both to your liking, what's the price delta?
My first Macan was a base model which I moved to from an Audi S5. I thought the Macan 2.0T would be adequate for daily use, but on the 100 mile drive home from the dealership after picking it up, I immediately was having second thoughts, which ended up being a costly lesson:
https://www.macanforum.com/threads/s.../#post-2620704

isugoo

Yeah, MSRP vs MSRP is not too bad between T and S but T comes with quite a few attractive options (Sport Chrono + PSMS, striped 8 way sport seats). Once I add some must-have (for me) options, it came out about 10k difference. Is that better to just get an S for 10k more (by doing this, I get PDLS+, 18 way sport seats from 8 way along with v6 engine upgrade but losing pretty seat inserts I'm sure I can get over it).

NickS

Here's why I got rid of my Macan T after only 1200 miles.
1) underpowered when entering the frwy and overtaking on the frwy
2) Wife's Q5 with the same powertrain was more enjoyable to drive around town. Tuning on the Q5 was simply better around town. Way more torque and actually more enjoyable to drive vs having to rev out the Macan T. Throttle response in the Q5 was also better than the Macan T.
3) Macan T for me really needed the PASM and air suspension to allow me to get the ride and look I wanted.
4) Macan T was built by the dealer and optioned it with the leather interior and 14 way seats. I hated the seats and REALLY wanted the default cloth interior the Macan T offered.

I thought about just ordering a Macan T the way I wanted but it was damn near the same price for a Macan S. My desire was to have another Macan GTS so I wouldn't have pulled the trigger on an S when it was $10k less than the Macan GTS I ordered and recently took delivery of. Macan T + $10k = Macan S, Macan S + $10k = Macan GTS.... and I'm THRILLED with my GTS. I've said "holy $h1t" numerous times already at WOT in the GTS and the brakes and handling are so, SO GOOD.

boyce89976

For sure, that's why the Miata and Honda S2000 were (are) so desirable. Handling and comfort are certainly part of it, and Porsche is known for striking that balance between power, handling and comfort in their "consumer" products, but they also have a history of creating pure racing machines disguised as supermarket-ankle biter-haulers. 640HP 4 door sedan... "check"! Even a poor handling car can be fun with enough power (Mustang 5.0, for example). But a great handling car that's underpowered, has to be "pushed" to take full advantage of the handling capabilities. Where can you drift a car through an apex on modern roads? But you can open it up for a couple seconds merging on the interstate.

After owning BMW's for a decade+ I bought an Acura RDX A-spec. While it checked the comfort, reliability and looks boxes, it fails in the power department. And, with a 4 cylinder turbo engine, actually get's worse gas mileage than my Macan S.

It's a great time to be alive, and there is something out there for everyone!

BMinSFL

I don't think the 4 cyl models are terminally likened to an underpowered Miata or S2000 philosophy. They have a good amount grunt with over 300hp when tuned, and based on my testing, are equivalent to the 3.0 S models below 80mph due to their lighter weight. Not sure about the 2.9 engine but thats good enough after a simple tune.

Agree to disagree on the power vs handling from experience with bad-handling muscle cars. Handling and braking are 100% of the time whereas power can rarely be used safely and almost never legally in modern form. I am not thinking of drifting but rather simple acts such as changing lanes, quick decelerations and taking corners, turns or onramps. My Macan needed mods too for the handling, which also would been have needed on an S spec that shares the same setup.

There's potential if explored and the owner is willing but I can fully appreciate from a quick drive that one can be dissapointed; which is why I try to share any mods that truly were transformative on mine. I was thinking exactly what I needed to do with the car during my test drive and all it takes is a few days here and there, DIY or at a shop, and its forever improved.

isugoo

Main.. you're making me debate alot more. I was almost set on T and waiting my local dealer to receive the delivery then I'm really thinking of building S. It's alot hard to replace my 2015 Mini Cooper S...