acey81

Same here. People seem to think it is perfectly reasonable that Porsche should keep an outdated engine in production for a couple of thousand cars in 3 years time.

CAlexio

Would Porsche accept that a NA 718 gt4 could potentially be slower than its Turbo 718 counterpart?

Would they keep the NA 9a1 3.8 around or give it the 4.0?

Even as a betting man, I can't wrap my brain around how they're going to align and explain their future product lineup in this area. Very interesting to see what they do with the product strategy, turbo and it's torquey power throws a lot of curve ***** into the price/performance matrix.

Scorponok

I suspect the GT4 will be used as the lowercase t turbo GT-car poster child; "this is what can be gained by going turbo!"

(Capital T Turbo being the GT2)

Vintage72

k997 - you read my mind!!!

My gut tells me the .2 GT4 will be Porsche's opportunity to show the world how great turbos can be since the P lineup going forward will be ALL turbos in the very near future. I think they almost have to do it if they want to sell the new models. I look forward to finding out either way in a year or two.

GrantG

I am not in a place where I can get to my gear chart of the GT4, but found the gear ratios of the 718 (manual and PDK):

GrantG

I did find the GT4 gears (Identical to 718 Manual. No way to improve gearing of an NA 718 GT4 by tweaking Final Drive, without lowering top speed or raising redline). BTW, when you multiply gear ratio by final drive you see that the 2nd gear in PDK is about 9% lower than Manual (pretty big difference). The 911R (and Manual GT3 if uses same box) has 20% lower gearing than GT4 in 2nd...

electronspeeder

Agreed. I think there's no way the .2 GT4 will be NA. It will be Turbo, and it will be fast.

jphughan

Well redline on an NA engine would be somewhat higher (I think the turbo 4 redlines at 7600?), so that would help. Tire size could also affect things a bit. I'd have to see what the top speeds are in each gear on the 718 with that info plus tire size, but I'm not in front of a real computer at the moment either.

CAlexio

you guys are saying that 991.2 gt3 will be last NA Porsche...? could be..

PCarOMFS

This is exactly what my local GM and SA have told me. It makes the most sense. That being said, it's total speculation at this point.

konaforever

But will it be as fun?

loungin

Recapping Porsche's marketing and operations challenges:

Can the GT4 model have a lower 0-60 time than the S or even GTS model?

Can the next GT4 model have a lower top speed than the current model?

Can Porsche keep tooling for an old engine just for one niche model?Porsche's factory is extremely space limited.

Would the new Carrera S engine fit in the 718 chassis?


To me it seems like what would differentiate the next GT4 is tuned turbo 4, PDK, GT steering and suspension, and all the GT options, weight loss, etc. Tough decisions but I can't see how else they would get the specs to fit in the line up and 0-60, top speed specs do matter to marketing even if enthusiasts don't care. People have probably observed this before in the forums, but the line up would make more sense that way. Want a fast, entry level GT car? Get the 718 GT4. Want manual and NA? Get the 991.2 GT3.

GrantG

The 718 redlines at 7,500 but I was referring to raising the redline of the GT4 beyond its current 7,800 rpm (where rev limiting occurs). I think you are confusing too many variables here. It's not that complicated.

1. 718 Manual Gearing is same as GT4 gearing
2. The above gearing is optimized for top speed of 183 mph (7,400 rpm in 6th where max power is made)
3. If the 718 GT4 uses the same NA motor (with or without X51), then there is no point in changing the gearing (neither by smaller tire diameter nor R&P nor stack), because improving acceleration will come with reduced top speed (and the car will almost certainly have the potential to have a higher top speed with a power bump - if any gearing change is made, it'll probably be even taller to achieve its max potential top speed - but I'm not predicting this).
4. No chance to improve NA GT4 6M gearing without going to a version of the high-revving GT3 motor. Doing this seems unlikely without encroaching on GT3's pricing and marketing position.

Adding PDK-S option would address gearing (likely) as would adding a 7spd Manual with performance gearing (unlikely).

Jimmy-D

-If there is a 718 GT4 and it is Turbo no interest even if faster ect. It will never sound like my car does now and I am sure it will have a slight lag - Plus - the values on the NA GT4 will go up so why trade.

- If the 718 GT4 is NA with more power there may be some interest but I would like to see 425 hp because the 991.2 GT3 probably moving to 500 hp so no need to protect it.

- Shorter gearing would be fine but not a deal breaker for me. I have no problem with the current gearing. I find 2nd and 3rd which is mostly used on the street a lot of fun and I like playing in the 5500-7500 range. With the new headers on I think I am finding it revving a littler quicker and it is pulling harder so the gearing is about right. I also do not need to change gears more often because I am not revving her up to 7000 all day because I would be in jail so get plenty of shifting on the street in the 5000-6000 rpm

GrantG

I bet a 425hp GT4 with PDK-S would give a 500hp GT3 with 6spd Manual a good run for its money (not faster, but not much slower)...

Lots of interesting marketing challenges with so many models that perform quite closely...