Cayenne S 958 - ATF Fluid change
07-01-2018, 09:32 PM
#46
Burning Brakes
I did an ATF fluid/filter service today on my 2011 CS with 103K miles. Other than being a bit messy it's not that hard to carry out. The biggest worry was getting the new filter in and seated but that went without a hitch. All told it cost under $260 sourcing parts from multiple locations. I used the Febi Bilsten 29934 fluid which I picked up from eBay for $10.22 / liter shipped.
The fluid that came out was dark red but was probably still serviceable. For refilling I opted for the garden sprayer method (search YouTube), which worked perfectly. I also ordered a VAS6262/2 off eBay and then realized it would be a long delivery time. Based on my research I bought a M10X1.0 to 9mm Hose Barb off eBay for $4 and it worked fine. Threads in just like the VAS6262/2 would and the tubing slips over the barbed end perfectly. Using the garden sprayer to pump in the new fluid was as easy as it could be.
Cleaning the pan and magnets showed no significant debris though there was some fine gray residue on all 4 of the magnets which smeared around on the pan a bit. Cleaned it all up and then installed the new gasket and put it into place. As noted, it's important to leave it loose while installing all the bolts to make sure they all get lined up properly so they done cross thread before tightening them down
I put in a bit over 6 liters and ran it up to temp. Didn't take much as with the hot weather the iCarScan said the fluid was already at 36 C. Once up to temp I pulled the tubing off the barbed end and let the excess drain. After it slowed I unscrewed the fitting and put in the drain plug. One point of interest was that when I originally removed the drain plug probably close to 1/2 liter fluid came out, which seemed odd. The rest drained as expected when I removed the fill tube using a 5mm allen wrench.
Based on my test drive it appears everything is working fine. Shifts may be a bit smoother but that may also just be wishful thinking as they were pretty good before as well.
I also did an oil change today and was going to change out the transfer case fluid too (it was changed out about 7K miles ago and it made a big difference in smoothness) but decided to wait until the next oil change in order to isolate any transmission differences and not confuse the situation.
The fluid that came out was dark red but was probably still serviceable. For refilling I opted for the garden sprayer method (search YouTube), which worked perfectly. I also ordered a VAS6262/2 off eBay and then realized it would be a long delivery time. Based on my research I bought a M10X1.0 to 9mm Hose Barb off eBay for $4 and it worked fine. Threads in just like the VAS6262/2 would and the tubing slips over the barbed end perfectly. Using the garden sprayer to pump in the new fluid was as easy as it could be.
Cleaning the pan and magnets showed no significant debris though there was some fine gray residue on all 4 of the magnets which smeared around on the pan a bit. Cleaned it all up and then installed the new gasket and put it into place. As noted, it's important to leave it loose while installing all the bolts to make sure they all get lined up properly so they done cross thread before tightening them down
I put in a bit over 6 liters and ran it up to temp. Didn't take much as with the hot weather the iCarScan said the fluid was already at 36 C. Once up to temp I pulled the tubing off the barbed end and let the excess drain. After it slowed I unscrewed the fitting and put in the drain plug. One point of interest was that when I originally removed the drain plug probably close to 1/2 liter fluid came out, which seemed odd. The rest drained as expected when I removed the fill tube using a 5mm allen wrench.
Based on my test drive it appears everything is working fine. Shifts may be a bit smoother but that may also just be wishful thinking as they were pretty good before as well.
I also did an oil change today and was going to change out the transfer case fluid too (it was changed out about 7K miles ago and it made a big difference in smoothness) but decided to wait until the next oil change in order to isolate any transmission differences and not confuse the situation.
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TXCOMT (05-17-2023)
07-04-2018, 10:48 AM
#47
Pro
I did basically the same job as Tom back in 2016 before I found this forum, only I didn't learn about the garden sprayer trick until after I'd done mine, so it was pretty messy. I used the Febi fluid and I drove my base Cayenne for two years after doing the change, so obviously it worked out fine.
11-09-2019, 03:47 PM
#48
I have a 2013 Cayenne S. I bought the transmission fluid change kit from Suncoast and took my car to Euromotors in Orlando, FL. They charge me $362 for the job (labor only). They only use 6 of the 9 quarts. At 73K, the mechanic said the fluid look fine and there were no debris on the magnets. I think it was worth it; way better than the Stealer. I also changed the rear differential and transfer case fluids; both looked clear and new. So I decided to forgo changing the front differential fluids.
01-26-2020, 02:10 AM
#49
Apologies for quoting a post from almost 4 years ago and further apologies for quoting such a long section but I'm in the middle of this process and want to clarify two details of the instructions below:
- It reads to run the fluid up to 100*c and then let it cool to 35*c. The 40*c temperature is ubiquitous on the web but not mentioned here.
- Is it necessary to run the fluid up to 100*c (to open all the cooler thermostats) if you are only doing the pan and filter?
- When you drain the excess at the 40*c temperature, is the engine running or off?
From the manual - which is where that picture came from: (My comments in italics)
WM 370235 CHECKING AND TOPPING UP ATF (ALL MODELS) > INFORMATION >
TEST CONDITIONS AFTER OPENING COOLER LINES
ATF cooler lines were opened.
For example: when replacing the transmission, changing ATF, changing ATF lines, replacing ATF cooler, replacing ATF thermostat.
Warm up transmission in lower load range. Switch all transmission ranges several times while
doing so.
Read out the ATF sump temperature using the PIWIS Tester.
The ATF temperature must be 100 °C (cooling system open).
Let ATF cool down to approx. 35 °C.
Selector lever is in position P.
Press the brake pedal and shift the gear lever slowly through P-R-N-D three times. Hold the
selector lever in each position for 2 seconds.
Test and filling procedure at idle speed with air conditioning switched off.
Then it follows with:
WM 370235 CHECKING AND TOPPING UP ATF (ALL MODELS) > CHECKING ATF
1. Move selector lever to position P and start the engine.
Place oil collection pan underneath.
WARNING: Hot fluid
1. Danger of scalding
→ Let the fluid cool down.
→ Wear personal protective gear.
Information
For details of the next steps, read the test conditions specified under → INFORMATION -
section on "Information".
1. Information
A certain amount of oil will always be lost after unscrewing the oil inspection plug. The reason for this is that some oil remains on the plug in the lifting tube .
2. Unscrew oil inspection plug -1- .
3. The oil level is correct when ATF is dripping continuously from the lifting tube. If this is not the
case, add more ATF. → TOPPING UP ATF - section on "Topping up"
4. Screw in oil inspection plug -1- with a new seal. → Tightening Torque: 16 Nm (12 ft. lb.) +/-1
Nm (+/- 0.5 ft. lb.)
Fig 2: Identifying ATF Inspection Plug
And the image you have is shown..
And to finalize the confusion:
WM 370235 CHECKING AND TOPPING UP ATF (ALL MODELS) > TOPPING UP ATF
Information
For details of the next steps, read the test conditions specified under → INFORMATION - section
on "Information".
Information
A certain amount of oil will always be lost after unscrewing the oil inspection plug. The reason for
this is that some oil remains on the plug in the lifting tube.
1. Move selector lever to position P and start the engine.
2. Place oil collection pan underneath.
WARNING: Hot fluid
1. Danger of scalding
→ Let the fluid cool down.
→ Wear personal protective gear.
Information
For details of the next steps, read the test conditions specified under → INFORMATION
- section on "Information".
{Ya gotta love information that tells you to read "Information"..}
1. Information
A certain amount of oil will always be lost after unscrewing the oil inspection plug. The
reason for this is that some oil remains on the plug in the lifting tube .
1. Unscrew oil inspection plug -1- .
Fig 1: Identifying ATF Inspection Plug
(once again - the same damn image appears..)
3. Screw adapter for filling oil Adapter For Filling ATF Oil VAS 6262/2 WE 1390 into the ATF
pan hand-tight.
4. Connect adapter for filling oil Adapter For Filling Oil VAS 6262A WE 1389 to the rapid-action
coupling and fill in ATF.
5. Pull off adapter for filling oil Adapter For Filling Oil VAS 6262A WE 1389 at the rapid-action
coupling and check to see if ATF emerges.
6. There was no #6.. go figure..
7. If no ATF emerges, fill in ATF until a constant discharge is visible at the lifting tube -2- .
8. Allow the ATF to drain for as long as required until the ATF is still only dripping continuously.
Screw in oil inspection plug -1- with a new seal. → Tightening Torque: 16 Nm (12 ft. lb.) +/-1
Nm (+/- 0.5 ft. lb.)
Fig 2: Identifying ATF Inspection Plug
And of course the image you already have shown..
My thoughts on the "pipe" assembly. It appears that the inner part of the drain plug - the pipe (Part#2 - the gray part) - can be removed from the plug in order to actually drain the entire transmission. Otherwise it stays in the pan when the plug (yellow part) is removed. The manual somewhere makes mention of removing the filler tube using an allen wrench.
I'll point this thread out to someone who did change his fluid about a week ago and see if he has any comments. Apparently the fill is slightly different if you've disturbed hoses to the cooler.
Might I ask why the cooler was replaced? Just curious..
WM 370235 CHECKING AND TOPPING UP ATF (ALL MODELS) > INFORMATION >
TEST CONDITIONS AFTER OPENING COOLER LINES
ATF cooler lines were opened.
For example: when replacing the transmission, changing ATF, changing ATF lines, replacing ATF cooler, replacing ATF thermostat.
Warm up transmission in lower load range. Switch all transmission ranges several times while
doing so.
Read out the ATF sump temperature using the PIWIS Tester.
The ATF temperature must be 100 °C (cooling system open).
Let ATF cool down to approx. 35 °C.
Selector lever is in position P.
Press the brake pedal and shift the gear lever slowly through P-R-N-D three times. Hold the
selector lever in each position for 2 seconds.
Test and filling procedure at idle speed with air conditioning switched off.
Then it follows with:
WM 370235 CHECKING AND TOPPING UP ATF (ALL MODELS) > CHECKING ATF
1. Move selector lever to position P and start the engine.
Place oil collection pan underneath.
WARNING: Hot fluid
1. Danger of scalding
→ Let the fluid cool down.
→ Wear personal protective gear.
Information
For details of the next steps, read the test conditions specified under → INFORMATION -
section on "Information".
1. Information
A certain amount of oil will always be lost after unscrewing the oil inspection plug. The reason for this is that some oil remains on the plug in the lifting tube .
2. Unscrew oil inspection plug -1- .
3. The oil level is correct when ATF is dripping continuously from the lifting tube. If this is not the
case, add more ATF. → TOPPING UP ATF - section on "Topping up"
4. Screw in oil inspection plug -1- with a new seal. → Tightening Torque: 16 Nm (12 ft. lb.) +/-1
Nm (+/- 0.5 ft. lb.)
Fig 2: Identifying ATF Inspection Plug
And the image you have is shown..
And to finalize the confusion:
WM 370235 CHECKING AND TOPPING UP ATF (ALL MODELS) > TOPPING UP ATF
Information
For details of the next steps, read the test conditions specified under → INFORMATION - section
on "Information".
Information
A certain amount of oil will always be lost after unscrewing the oil inspection plug. The reason for
this is that some oil remains on the plug in the lifting tube.
1. Move selector lever to position P and start the engine.
2. Place oil collection pan underneath.
WARNING: Hot fluid
1. Danger of scalding
→ Let the fluid cool down.
→ Wear personal protective gear.
Information
For details of the next steps, read the test conditions specified under → INFORMATION
- section on "Information".
{Ya gotta love information that tells you to read "Information"..}
1. Information
A certain amount of oil will always be lost after unscrewing the oil inspection plug. The
reason for this is that some oil remains on the plug in the lifting tube .
1. Unscrew oil inspection plug -1- .
Fig 1: Identifying ATF Inspection Plug
(once again - the same damn image appears..)
3. Screw adapter for filling oil Adapter For Filling ATF Oil VAS 6262/2 WE 1390 into the ATF
pan hand-tight.
4. Connect adapter for filling oil Adapter For Filling Oil VAS 6262A WE 1389 to the rapid-action
coupling and fill in ATF.
5. Pull off adapter for filling oil Adapter For Filling Oil VAS 6262A WE 1389 at the rapid-action
coupling and check to see if ATF emerges.
6. There was no #6.. go figure..
7. If no ATF emerges, fill in ATF until a constant discharge is visible at the lifting tube -2- .
8. Allow the ATF to drain for as long as required until the ATF is still only dripping continuously.
Screw in oil inspection plug -1- with a new seal. → Tightening Torque: 16 Nm (12 ft. lb.) +/-1
Nm (+/- 0.5 ft. lb.)
Fig 2: Identifying ATF Inspection Plug
And of course the image you already have shown..
My thoughts on the "pipe" assembly. It appears that the inner part of the drain plug - the pipe (Part#2 - the gray part) - can be removed from the plug in order to actually drain the entire transmission. Otherwise it stays in the pan when the plug (yellow part) is removed. The manual somewhere makes mention of removing the filler tube using an allen wrench.
I'll point this thread out to someone who did change his fluid about a week ago and see if he has any comments. Apparently the fill is slightly different if you've disturbed hoses to the cooler.
Might I ask why the cooler was replaced? Just curious..
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jtsmith18 (01-26-2020)
01-26-2020, 09:48 AM
#50
How much does the dealership usually charge? I noticed some service prices are pretty reasonable, like $200 for brake fluid flush, $225 for 4-wheel alignment....
Porsche indy quoted me $350 for labor by the way
Porsche indy quoted me $350 for labor by the way
01-27-2020, 01:40 AM
#51
If you want to 'flush' your whole system, this DIY has a good technique. https://rennlist.com/forums/cayenne-...uid-flush.html
I chose to do a partial flush. I've heard of transmissions of other makes having issues with a complete flush (non-VAG) so I opted for the partial flush. I have no reason to believe our Aisin units would have any issues. That said, I plan to do the basic flush again in another 10k miles.
I chose to do a partial flush. I've heard of transmissions of other makes having issues with a complete flush (non-VAG) so I opted for the partial flush. I have no reason to believe our Aisin units would have any issues. That said, I plan to do the basic flush again in another 10k miles.
01-30-2020, 05:01 PM
#52
Apologies for quoting a post from almost 4 years ago and further apologies for quoting such a long section but I'm in the middle of this process and want to clarify two details of the instructions below:
- It reads to run the fluid up to 100*c and then let it cool to 35*c. The 40*c temperature is ubiquitous on the web but not mentioned here.
- Is it necessary to run the fluid up to 100*c (to open all the cooler thermostats) if you are only doing the pan and filter?
- When you drain the excess at the 40*c temperature, is the engine running or off?
1. Turn engine on, get to 100C (for thermostat to prompt circulation)
2. Let it cool to 35C
3. Then open the drain plug (which I guess is also the fill plug as well?) and let up to 4L come out (still confused on how it flows out over the green oil tube)
4. After awhile, take the pan off and install filter, etc. Re-install
5. Fill 4L plus whatever came off the pan into the drain plug (aka fill plug)? I'm confused about how in the heck to know when you have overfilled/underfilled. I see the pics of the oil tube at the start of this thread, so does that oil tube come out with the drain/fill plug? Otherwise how would it drain?
6. Heat up tranny to 100C again and let it cool to 35C then see if it overflows through the reinstalled oil tube? Confusing to me...
7. Fill more as needed I gather.....
01-30-2020, 08:14 PM
#53
Burning Brakes
For step 3 you also unscrew the green tube to finish draining the pan. I bought a spare to have on hand if anything went wrong there as without one to put back in you SOL if it breaks.
Be aware that there's still quite a bit of ATF fluid in the pan when you go to drop it so have a very large pan of something else to catch it as it's going to get very messy otherwise.
For the refill process you screw in the green tube again. Then you screw in the fill adapter/tube so you can attach whatever your going to use to refill things. Once you've got what you think is the right amount and the temps are correct (and you've run through the gears, etc.) you remove whatever is attached to the fill adapter/tube to let it drain to the proper level. Once that's done then you remove the fill adapter and button it back up.
Be sure to verify the old gasket from the filter is removed as mine was stuck inside. Makes it tough to put the new filter/gasket in place otherwise.
I strongly suggest you subscribe to AllDataDIY.com if you don't already have one as it's got all the info you'll need for this any most other tasks a DIYer would do.
Be aware that there's still quite a bit of ATF fluid in the pan when you go to drop it so have a very large pan of something else to catch it as it's going to get very messy otherwise.
For the refill process you screw in the green tube again. Then you screw in the fill adapter/tube so you can attach whatever your going to use to refill things. Once you've got what you think is the right amount and the temps are correct (and you've run through the gears, etc.) you remove whatever is attached to the fill adapter/tube to let it drain to the proper level. Once that's done then you remove the fill adapter and button it back up.
Be sure to verify the old gasket from the filter is removed as mine was stuck inside. Makes it tough to put the new filter/gasket in place otherwise.
I strongly suggest you subscribe to AllDataDIY.com if you don't already have one as it's got all the info you'll need for this any most other tasks a DIYer would do.
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Cibeibcab (01-30-2020)
01-30-2020, 09:02 PM
#54
Steps 1 and 2 aren't really necessary, as you would likely get both of those out of a normal drive and park... You just need it to be cooled down enough to work on. Those temps need to be reached later for the fill-up procedure, but you don't have to worry about them before you drain.
I let mine sit all night, and started the process the next morning so I didn't have to lay under a hot *** vehicle...
I let mine sit all night, and started the process the next morning so I didn't have to lay under a hot *** vehicle...
01-30-2020, 10:27 PM
#56
01-31-2020, 01:01 AM
#58
EDIT: You are basically overfilling it just a little bit, and then letting that extra run out, then you close it up. I'm pretty sure it needs to be running and at (or within a few degree of) the specified temperature to make sure the fill level is correct.
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mr_hyde (01-31-2020)
01-31-2020, 11:00 PM
#60
