I know of questionable source, but here is what they are saying...

http://www.imakenews.com/autospies/e...m3FHL,a1587k1d

 

OUCH!

 

Notice the FX salesman is using MSRP for the differential.

Additionally, he jumps to the clever example of 7K (includes tax & lic) + the Pepper.

I think we all recognize, that if we sold the car after 5 mo we would all take a bath, that's not newsworthy.

What's newsworthy, is that a fourth rate magazine that panders to their advertisers has a hard-on for the Pepper.

My .02

 

It appears the publication has committed a serious business breach of positioning itself as the antithesis of the Cayenne. Rather than objectively reporting what is occuring relative to the retail market of the vehicle, it seems to gloat at one person's tale of woe. One must ask if it would report an instance when a retail customer would pay 'M.S.R.P. +' to acquire the vehicle [and the publication would pass that event on to its readership]. Also, has the publication reported the re-sell value of the Cayenne relative to its peers? This data is available though the Kelly Blue Book and other sources.
The aforementioned points all relate to the maxim: "Trust But Verify"; be it a vehicle, a dealership, or a publication which is supposed to OBJECTIVELY report on both.

 

Autospies in the early days was mildly interesting. It has since become a complete joke. Most of their scoop pictures come from Autocar in the UK and are scanned...
Without mentionning the realtors ads you have to go through and the cheesy car salesmen, I most of the time have to try hard to find the subject on the page!
My view is that most of their insiders scoops are just pure speculation from individuals who get a kick to be published.
Whatever they say has little or no value, so I wouldn't break a sweat on the opinion of a Infiniti dealer on the Cayenne....
I mean do you think the FX 45 is holding well its value if you try to sell it few months after buying it

Cyril

 

Yeah! Autospies is going down with quality every day ....

 

http://www.imakenews.com/autospies/e...e000203508.cfm

One dealer quote and a few auctions on eBay is enough "evidence" for me....not! eBay is the last place you should look to for "proof!" eBay is a joke and so is Auto Spies...

 

Those are not even sale prices. Those are final bids on auctions where the reserve was not met. There are Ferrari that get no bids. Does that mean that it's free or worth nothing. Even saw an Infiniti FX 45 where the bidding stalled at $25K. That must be where the market is then.

Autospies - What a bunch of tools.

 

While eBay prices are usually better than dealerships, remember they are also usually more than trade-in values. Otherwise, no one would be selling on eBay.

 

elcou,

What you say would be correct IF (key word here is IF) it were a completed transaction. However, the items posted by Autospies were ones that did not meet reserve and thus were not sold. They were just low offers, not transaction prices.

I could find any number of vehicles that do not get any bids (almost half of the cars on ebay) and wait until there were 10 minutes left until the auction ends and bid $100. While I wouldn't win the vehicle, the bid is also not indicative of the current market value of that vehicle. It's just where the bidding stopped. Thus, you need to show completed transaction where there was an actual winner, not just auctions where the bidding is over but the reserve was not met, which is what Autospies has done.

 

Karl,

you too are correct, except consider that the bids stopped where they were b/c the value held by pre-owned sales managers may be exceeded - i.e. no one is going to bid higher than what the vehicle may be obtainable locally. The fleet guys from large second party sales floors (like Expo Motorcars in Houston) also scan eBay for potential acquisitions. If the eBay prices exceed what they can get for the vehicle at auctions such as Manheim, they don't bid. This usually holds true for most high end vehicle.

I am by no means an expert or in the industry, but I have purchased about a dozen new and used cars over the past 3 years and it is IMHO what I have deduced.

 

I do realize that, and that was exactly my point in the letter that I wrote to the editors of Autospies.

A quote from my letter to them as follows:

"How about some real Manheim Auction sales results for 2003 Cayennes:

08/27/2003 ATLANTA $ 47,600 3,073 miles GRAY 8G A SE
11/11/2003 FAAO $ 47,000 19,051 miles BLACK 8G A X SE
09/11/2003 MANHEIM $ 49,700 9,037 miles GREY 8G A X NE
08/21/2003 RIVRSIDE $ 49,000 918 miles DBLUE 8G A WC
09/18/2003 RIVRSIDE $ 48,000 5,064 miles DGREEN 8G A WC
10/29/2003 W PALM $ 49,000 4,196 miles BLACK 8G A X SE


As you can see (or maybe you can't, as your Infiniti colored glasses are
usually on), even a 19,000 mile 2003 Cayenne can not be bought for less than $47,000."

Yet, Autospies is claiming that the cars are worth around $42k-$45k. If you find me some Cayenne S for that price, I'll buy as many as you have at that price and I'll start my own dealership.

 

Those Manheim #s are better than what AS wants us to believe. Still, from $60ish invoice to $48 auction is a big hit for less than 1 year. My 97 M3 was at 85% at 36 months. MDX was 65% at 36 mos. Hopefully, the trend will reverse as the economy improves.

 

An acquaintance of mine recently had to trade in his Cayenne due to health problems, needing a lower height vehicle for easier access. He indeed took a much worse than expected bath on his trade-in. The info from the dealer he dealt with, who happens to also be a lifelong friend who historically provides better deals than available elsewhere because of the relationship, was that indeed the Cayenne is devalued/-ing more than the average vehicle or SUV in the current economy. It certainly wasn't a situation of "Wow, we're getting a Cayenne" - more of a reluctance, done as a favor, to take it in trade.

This is not a slam on the Cayenne, nothing more than another anecdotal report. One has to ask, however, whether the reactions to the Autospies report would be as vitriolic if this were not a Porsche Cayenne forum. I am a Porsche nut and am strongly considering getting a Cayenne. I also make most decisions from as close to a business perspective as I can. I believe that I personally will wait to see how the used market plays out in the next year or two. I believe the S's will have a tough time in the market, the Turbos less so if any tough time, given their radically different performance envelope and price bracket. As always, YMMV. Regards Al

 

First, the higher priced SUV's will depreciate at a higher rate than the norm. Additionally, Add ons always depreciate at a higher rate than the car. Since Pcars have so many add ons, they diminish the value of the entire car when using MSRP.

Does a P dealer want to take back a Pepper when he has 15 on his lot (he will if the price is right). The personal friend idea (is the dealer a social worker or a CAR SALESMAN -- c'mon...)

If you buy a used Pepper (with all the fluff out) within a yr old, you won't suffer any more deprec than anyone else buying a yr old car. A Pepper still has aura, so you may be able to resell it faster.