speed21

Hi Guys, I put a thread up a week or so back asking for thoughts and opinions on the TDI 6 and the new V8S Diesel. Anyway, I've since placed an order on a V8 Diesel primarily because of the reviews, plus being an S it has a lot of standard equipment Vs the TDI 6 which would need a fair bit of optioning up. And then there is that stump pulling 282kw and 850 nms vs the tdi 6....

The GTS came into the equation last week as a consequence of me seeing it and then driving it and now I just can't overlook the package it represents. So now Im completely torn between getting the GTS that's ready to go pretty well now vs's waiting around for the Diesel V8 due mid to late June.

The only thing making me think twice about the GTS is the fuel consumption which i'm told will knock it about quite savagely on resale (dealer admits this). Due to the general market trend preferring more economical SUV's it essentially places the GTS as a new car buyers type car and one the used market has only a very small audience for....hence the bad resale value. The diesel on the other hand gives very strong returns on the resale.

Anyway for all the talk on GTS's bad resale I'm really taken with the GTS's looks with its awesome looking front end, body kit and unique interior package. And then there is the way it drives and, sounds. I kinda wish i never saw this car least of all drove this car....and twice now.

The main detractor against the Diesel S is it just doesn't look nearly as good from the front plus it won't have the GTS's seductive V8 exhaust note amongst a few other trim features unique to GTS...although they say the diesel sounds like a V8 if not a quiet one (probably as quiet as the SV8 petrol). I'm also unsure of how the two will stack up in the performance department in real world driving and if whether the new diesel will have that much more power to make it all worth the wait or the sacrifice of GTS's interior and exterior aesthetics. Then there is the June delivery...

The zero to 100 and 80 to 130 performance figures are quoted as identical too so again i don't know how the V8 diesels power actually translates in real world driving terms vs the GTS's powerplant.

Unfortunately Australia doesn't have a new V8 diesel here yet to test drive so I'm hoping someone out there has gone through the exercise of comparing these 2 cars (GTS and V8 Diesel S) and is able to offer some driving impressions and why they selected one over the other.

Any thoughts, clues or advice appreciated etc....

500

In many ways the Diesel is the more sensible choice. Also, the S Diesel sounds like quite the machine by any standard.

That said, the GTS exudes more "Porsche-ness" and will appeal the the sports-car enthusiast driver.

We decided on a GTS (late April / early May delivery). In our case, we hang on to cars a long time so the re-sale issue is a little less of a concern. Our annual mileage is moderate, so the fuel economy, though still an issue, won't be a much of as concern as it may be for others.

Any Cayenne is not really practical or a "smart" buy in terms of cash outlay versus depreciation. It is a discretionary purchase for which a big portion of the "value" is enjoyment. That in a nutshell is why we chose the GTS.

speed21

I'm hearing you re the Porscheness of the GTS. It surprisingly touches on the emotions more than any other Cayenne i've driven to date and therein lays the problem....along with its look, sound etc.. It's an attractive package alright.

Like yourself gas mileage hasn't proven to be an issue. The cayenne won't be doing a lot of mileage anyway but we do appreciate a car that's connected whilst being comfortable and economical where possible. This car will be my wifes to replace her current Bimmer SUV which is ageing at nearly 8 years yet very low mileage at 47000K. Ive probably put more mileage on the car than she has lol. We intend keeping this car @4 years or even try to bail out prior to the next generation hitting the showrooms sometime late 16 early 17.

Having the opportunity of comparing the drive of these two cars is the only thing missing. If that V8 Diesel surfaces and drives infinitely better than the GTS in real world driving it will probably pain me. That 850nms has to be felt somewhere. Love to get that heads up.

sebis

Here is my 2 cents: if I could afford it I would get the GTS.

Only drove the V6 diesel and the S gasoline back to back. I was not impress by the S, it was indeed faster from a stop and you could feel there was little more power available but IMHO the Diesel is a much better package when comparing these two. Coming from the Mercedes ML 320, night and day...

Now ... when I started the engine on a GTS, I got a grin from ear to ear only from the sound of the exhaust! I told the saleslady I don't want to drive it, I don't want to know what I am missing .

speed21

This is where i made the mistake, driving the thing. After that it got me thinking about my standing Sv8 Diesel order so i went back again and back to back drove the 3 cars (TDI V6, S V8 petrol and GTS) in that order to clear a few things up in my head. Each was driven immediately after the other and on the same course twice each so i got an accurate handle on the real differences between the cars. After the exercise it was crystal clear that the GTS was the better drive, the best looking with the best interior. The GTS i'm now seriously considering buying is black/black with 18 way seats. Panaramic roof, sports chrono, comfort lighting, comfort access, and has all the usual trim features inc full leather, nav, etc etc etc.
As nice as the sports steering wheel is i'd still change it out to the multifunction and I'd have the wheels swapped for the GTS turbo 2 five spokers which apparently isn't a problem.

I will say if my choice was between the S V8 petrol and the TDI 6 i'd personally take the diesel 6 and option the car up all day long. I just felt the drive of the petrol V8 wasnt significantly better enough to warrant the higher running costs of the petrol engine needless to say the resale values of the diesel are historically far superior.

The GTS drives substantially better than the S V8 petrol... It's only the V8 diesel that could draw me away from the GTS now but, without driving it......hmmm. It's a dilemma...

Joseph O'Reilly

Happy to share my thoughts with you after I test-drive the diesel V8 in two weeks. It seems another fellow in Sweden on this forum has driven the V6 and V8 diesels back-to-back already and commented that the difference is huge. Regarding GTS vs V8 diesel, is the GTS under consideration for you equipped with PDCC? Then it really should out-handle the diesel S by a good margin.
In the German market, if you option an S Diesel as identically as possible to a base GTS (face looks different, and PDCC not available in diesel), the S diesel ends up costing a couple percent more, although it starts with a base price of 77.5k vs 91k. Yes, the GTS has that many more standard features (most of which are nice or useful to have) that are optional on the S...but I gather in Oz, the Diesel S comes with a bunch of this "GTS" kit standard. Different markets. So I am not sure why in your market you see such a big difference in how the two models are equipped.
I see the choice much the way you do. GTS looks and handles better, the S is faster in daily use and will hold its value way better. In the end, you can't really go wrong. These are clearly IMHO the best two of the range, and not coincidentally, the newest (excluding from this discussion the very pricey Turbo S). After owning two performance diesels at the same time as a 996 turbo, i'm just a big believer in diesel giving better real world acceleration and so I look at the V8 diesel as the "Turbo" vs the GTS in this case, and thus the better bargain, power and acceleration-wise, over the term of ownership. Both handle well, better than other SUVs, and neither will handle like a boxster. If my wife could have waited for the facelift and the timing had been different with our leased sedan, facelifted model would have been the only real other option for us. Would have stuck with the Diesel S in the end.

speed21

I'd love to get your impression on the new diesel S and even more if you were able to compare it against the GTS. I don't know if i'm going to have the luxury of time because my S diesel order is now only a week or two from closing off for making any changes or, cancelling. Then i have that GTS which is here now and may not be in a week or two. They seem to be selling like hot cakes more or less as and when they arrive and the supply is not ongoing, this one being the last one of 2 from the 4 that just came through. It is true the diesel S is well optioned standard here. The options/features Diesel S misses out on which the GTS has is the alcantara roof lining and other alcantara accents, the silver dash trim, full leather, chrono clock, sports bolstered seats (Diesel S has the 14 ways with memory package as standard) the full body kit, active PL bi xenons with special black inside casings (S just has the base xenons) tinted rear tail lights, red callipers, 21 " rims, different front bar with special LED daytime lights, sports exhaust and tailpipes. Both cars have full Nav with blue tooth and usb/ipod connectivity, front and rear park with camera, auto dimming mirrors and the list goes on. Our Diesel S is priced at 155K + on roads so its easy to get to 200k drive away by adding some options, which is where i am now with both cars..

I did read the swedish guys account where he said the V8D was a huge step on from the 6D which sounds good. But whether that means it's also a huge step on from the GTS which has a distinctly better engine than the conventional petrol 8 is another thing i'd really like/need to know before ditching out of the V8 D order and getting the GTS instead.

I agree the v8D and GTS are the pick of the crop but out here the petrols don't share any where near the same resale attractions and values as the diesel. So my thinking is if the diesel 8 drove that much better than the GTS in a real world driving performance sense then i'd forego the aesthetics of the GTS in favour of the better resale values and work a bit more on the option list for the v8S.

As usual timing is never on ones side in these decision making processes.

blazing928

My feeling is the diesel will be better 90% or more of the time. The times you will miss the responsiveness of the GTS or a petrol car is when you engage the sport button and head for the twisties.
In our CD, i find the V6 diesels while fast lacks the ease of adjustability a great NA engine has. Maybe its my lack of turbo experience, let alone diesel turbo, but it is quite disconnected from the driving experience. I find there is little engine breaking and in the V6D's case a flat spot in 3rd gear where the electronics can't decide what you want. Sport button does change that a lot, but I havent yet got to try that out, on my own, on a twisty road without fear of plod giving me a ticket :-0

On hols a mate who has a X5 diesel drove it for quite a bit and was most impressed, so maybe its a TD attribute, the Cayenne is light an easy to drive long distances, it makes our old X5 4.4 feel very old, as good as the X5 is.

So if you want ultimate Sunday scratching then the GTS is the way to go, it will throtttle adjust, be easier to feather the throttle to suit and would be more engaging on a winding drive, ala Alpine Way.
I tip the CSD wouldn't be much slower, and that torque would be most addictive in every day driving, where the GTS would want to be wound out to the redline, which in Oz is not a reality with our roads and cops.

tough decisions!!

Joseph O'Reilly

speed21, here is another crazy thought to consider- wait to buy the diesel S, and then trade it straight-up in 1.5-3 years later for a better equipped GTS (if you still hanker for the GTS then)? GTS would have cost more than the diesel S when both were new, this way you save money and get to own BOTH?

other than full leather, none of the extras that are standard spec in Oz look like must-haves to me. here, gts has the following included standard vs diesel S (and I may be leavings some stuff out): Black xenons vs halogens, PASM vs nada, full leather vs plastic dash and door inserts, 8 way sport seats vs 6 way comfort seats, body kit vs none, blacked out tail lights vs normal, 4 pipe sport exhaust vs regular cayenne two exhaust pipes, alcantara headliner vs cloth, different front face, alu vs black interior trim, 20in RS wheels with red calipers vs 18in cayenne S wheels with silver ones...try to spec a diesel S here like the base GTS and it'll cost more than the GTS. but a 281kw/850NM diesel is just too alluring.

speed21

Thanks for the comments guys. I've got a lot to chew over here. Just wish i had a V8D to drive. That'd clear a lot of things up.

Slow Guy

Was talking to a guy with PCNA a couple of weeks ago who said the V8 diesel will not be coming to the US market due to emissions issues. I wonder if it has something to do with the quality of US diesel fuel?

madzone

So your dealership will not have a V8D in the showroom any time soon? The dealerships here in sweden got thier demo cars about a month go or so.

Galion

I have a GTS and I would go with the Diesel S with the SportDesign exterior package, same looks but more enjoyable to drive with tons of torque to spare, it will feel much faster too.
IMO Both handle the same under normal driving conditions, you have to track the GTS to take advantage of the firmer or "Harsher" suspension set up, but who takes an SUV to the track anyways?

speed21

My money would be on you USA guys will getting it at one point not too far away. I truly think it's just a matter of time. They said you'd never get the TDI 6 either didn't they?

Latest word is there will be demo available sometime late Feb or into March. Not sure i can wait till then to decide.

You make a good point Galion although i can't see the value in the body kit at the money they want for that. Without that sexy GTS front end the Kit looks a bit incomplete too and then there is the ride height that may not match the kit in the same way it does for the GTS. I'd say your right about the performance of the V8DS though although it won't have that lovely note the GTS petrol 8 has.

From what i understand you aren't too fussed with your GTS? Is it the latest one?

Galion

Yes Speed21, mine is a 2013, and no, my GTS is great, its just that I am so exited about the new Diesel S which isnt avaliable in our market yet.
I wasnt that much into diesel engines until I got my wife a 13' BMW X3 3.5D, very boring BMW looks but ridiculously powerful, very fast from 0 - 150km/h where It really beats the crap out of my GTS with all its "Porscheness", great fuel economy, doesnt clatter like most diesels, etc. I cant imagine what the V8 Diesel Cayenne S will be capable of.