Has anyone else gone from 4Runner to Cayenne?
 

Being a longtime Porsche owner/driver (since 2009) I have of course come to love and appreciate the merits of high performance Porsche cars. My signature should tell you that alone.

However, on my 'workhorse' I've owned Toyota 4Runners since the early 2000s and have been extremely happy with their utility, build quality, and resale value. I do yearn for more performance with my 4Runner as mine is V6 equipped with about 240 hp to lug around roughly 4000 pounds. It only gets about 21 mpg on the highway in 2WD mode, so there isn't that much economy either. What there is in SPADES is reliability to go along with the lack of performance. These trucks are solid and relatively simple, something the 955/957 Cayenne is not. But, I'm left wanting more engine performance for passing, better handling, and much better braking than my poor 4Runner can manage. It seems over time that this only becomes more evident to me, meaning the overall lack of performance when I'm driving on road trips, etc.

I'm still tempted by them though, particularly when I saw a local GTS model available for roughly the same value as my 4Runner is worth...which truly shocked me. Could some actual owners who made the switch chime in and tell me just how different the life is with a Cayenne (particularly a V8, GTS, or Turbo) when compared to something as pedestrian as a Toyota 4Runner? Thanks in advance for any feedback! :cheers:

Thanks all!

From someone with early Pathfinder then FX45 experience.

If you are OK with DIY wrenching on a Cayenne, ownership can be fun. If not keep the 4Runner.

I like DIY stuff from time to time, but most of the essential repairs I've read through in FAQs for the 955/957 Cayenne seem a bit more than simple DIYs.

I'll be driving an early model Cayenne S tomorrow that my friend owns and will see how I enjoy the overall experience...and I'll continue my research from that point.

Went to our Cayenne Turbo S from an Infiniti QX56. IMO, there's not much maintenance difference from a S, GTS, or Turbo so it only makes sense to make the leap to m on re maintenence for a really high performing model. There is truly no comparison to the way the Cayenne drives to the Infinut. The QX had poor suspension, sluggish handling, but actually a pretty good motor, but still nothing like the motor in a Cayenne Turbo. I found a really low mileage example (28k miles when I bought it and 44kk now) and haven't done anything significant in the way of repairs, just mods and upgrades. Ours is tge family vacation car do it only sees probably 10 drives a year and 6k miles which will be mostly highway ones, so should stay very reliable for quite a few years as it will be 3 more years befure it even hits 60k miles.

I will never be able to go back to a more bland Japanese vehicle. If you need dead-nuts reliability and its a DD, you probably should stay with the Toyota.

I owned many 4-Runners and Hilux Toyotas. Forget the GTS.... get the Turbo 955/957 and take the Vault of Faith.

Excellent questions, Steve. If we weren't in the midst of a pandemic, I'd throw you the keys to my 2009 CTTS and have you take her out for a spin. I suspect you would have a blast. I can say with a lot of certainty that properly maintained Cayennes are very reliable. Having said that, when they are abused and not maintained properly, they can, not always, bite you in the behind and the resulting repair bills can be hard to swallow.

I have always done all my own wrenching on all my vehicles, including 5 past 911s over 30 years, and my assessment of the difficulty of working on a Cayenne (a 2008 CTT and my current 2009 CTTS) is that they are not really any more difficult to work on than a modern Toyota. In many respects, they can be easier to wrench on because so many of the components are very over-engineered. There are the usual frustrations, but not like when I work on my wife's Rav4 Limited, where it seems like everything that is made of plastic is brittle and breaks very easily. Many of the parts on the various Toyotas are one-and-done in my experience, that is, if you remove them, you better have a replacement handy to go in its place.

As for the driving experience, a Cayenne is pleasure to drive. With PDCC, the handing almost seems to defy the laws of physics. With twin turbos, factory 550HP (mine is 637HP, 635TQ with modifications) and massive brakes, the CTTS is a monster just waiting to be let off its leash.

They are thirsty and mileage is very hard to justify, but I am not commuting and use my Cayenne mostly for cross-state road trips over the various passes, including a lot of time the twisties of the North Cascades Highway going over to our place in Mazama.

Here is the bottom line- you clearly are 911 guy and no doubt get the magic and subtleties of the brand based on your signature. You will not be disappointed with a GTS or a Turbo and I suspect you will wonder why you didn't make the switch before.

Oh, and in the v8s, avoid the 2008 model year. They seem to have a higher percentage of bore scoring than the 2009 or 2010 models, and it may be because the cylinder honing process was changed for the 2009 model year.

My sincere thanks to all who have replied, as this is useful feedback indeed. My good friend loaned me his Cayenne S (V8) for the day and I'll be sure to post some impressions, and probably more questions, later tonight. I don't know what year it is, but it's a 955 generation to the best of my knowledge.

OK, so I had a great day driving around in both the 955 Cayenne S and later my 997.1 GT2, so it was a proper day to be driving Porsche's for sure!

Regarding the Cayenne experience in general, I think it was definitely what I was hoping for the most part. The DNA was unmistakably Porsche, and that was very endearing to me.

PROS
- Steering feel is very impressive
- Acceleration (even for 340 hp it moved along very well, much more so than my own SUV)
- Braking (on a completely different level)
- Handling was equally impressive
- Beautiful fender view from inside that is reminiscent of a 911
- More amenities than I'm used to (folding mirrors, dual zone climate control, etc.)

CONS
- Smaller (noticeably so than my 4Runner), both inside and out
- All leather interior is not to my liking, meaning I'd prefer cloth like I have in my own SUV
- Fuel economy is noticably worse, and largely because it's always in 4WD I suppose (whereas I can run mine in 2WD)
- Minor details appear fragile/fickle, and I'm talking about small buttons, knobs, and switch gear. This is not a definitive statement but my impression
- Tiny cup holders. Odd that they did this for a vehicle that sells so well in the USA, but it is what it is
- External styling is subjective. I dislike the front end styling and really like the rear. In contrast I like my 4Runner's styling (4th generation model) from all angles
- The vehicle seems overly complex when I look at all the features, meaning it gives me pause to consider how many things might break or cause me grief (it's not nearly as simple)

From a purely dynamic point of view, there is absolutely no comparison and the Cayenne is vastly superior as a driver, and I truly enjoyed the drive. I feel it only starts to fall down when you start looking at the bigger picture, and some of those things are quite easy to forgive. I suppose this isn't surprising as the Japanese SUVs are known for their reliability overall, and not so much for their dynamic features.

I think I'm going to keep reading up on Cayenne's as my wife says she would really like a GTS model...so that is probably where I'd choose to go. This was a wonderful first experience though, and gave me a lot of hope that I could make the move to have another Porsche in my family.

Thanks all!

I don't own a 4R, but own an older land crusher and V6 Rav 4. They're way different in so many ways. If you want performance, luxury, oh what a feeling when you mash the pedal, the Cayenne is it. If you want daily driver reliability and no flashing dashboard lights, go to 200k without much drama, then the Toyota wins.

I read somewhere that someone said life is too short to drive a boring car..lol...:roflmao:

Have both, the 4oreskinr is G3 V6
Forest service stream beds in Chiricahuas, lock and go ...no problem ...Cayenne no way
Two very different vehicles

Great observations Steve- I think that most of us would completely agree with you on nearly all of them. I for one, cannot reconcile that Porsche chose to go the cheap/easy route on minor details like the knobs, etc... particularly on a vehicle like mine which had a nearly $140K invoice in 2008.

Pete's comment about the 2008 V8s is spot on. While the evidence is mostly anecdotal, it appears that the 2008 V8s had a lot more scoring problems than others. I should know, my 2008 CTT developed scoring at 94k. Fortunately, or unfortunately, a young woman in a 3 series BMW decided to hit me head on on a rainy day, ending my need to find a new engine or do a full rebuild.

If you are interested in a GTS, the 2009s and rarer 2010s are really a sweet spot in terms of performance and build. Also, we all forgot to mention PDCC- It is a must-have for myself and many here on the board. It is harder to find on a GTS than a Turbo, but they can be found. Drive a Cayenne with PDCC and you will never go back again.

TomF thank you for your kind words and suggestions my friend. I think at this point I'll just continue to save my pennies and continue my research, as my elusive Cayenne GTS will have to be built in a fairly hard to come by spec:

- PDCC
- PCCB
- Leather/Alcantara
- non panoramic sunroof (standard sunroof OK)
- not black in exterior color
- black interior color
- service records
- 2009 to 2010 model with PCM v3.0

Well, at least it gives me an aspirational spec to look for as I learn more about these awesome vehicles. I've sort of noticed that Turbos are even harder to find in the trim I'd like, but the GTS does seem possible if I'm patient.

Thanks again to everyone who helped me with my baseline research here.

Here are a few photos taken from my time spent with my friend's low mileage 955S.

https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/rennlis...509a65d5df.jpg
https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/rennlis...686fbdc62f.jpg
https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/rennlis...3fae1afcd9.jpg
https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/rennlis...bdd521ed07.jpg

Boat analogy if you are into boating:

4Runner = large aluminum boat w/ outboard (There is something rewarding about being able to just throw gear into it, let it sit out in the elements, and retain crazy good reliability with very little maintenance effort)
Cayenne GTS = v8 inboard wakeboat (It is going to be a lot more effort/money to keep nice and reliable, it will burn gas at an alarming rate if you use all the power, but every day you take it out you and your passengers will enjoy the extra comfort, safety, performance, and style of not riding around in a tin can with no soul)

You don't even have to choose your poison. Just get both.

I have too many vehicles as it is (meaning more than I can comfortably store, maintain, and insure)...so there is no having my cake and eating it too by having both! :surr:

Ha, I like the boat analogy.

Cayenne Turbo S a,nd true to the analogy, the 400HP, 23'wakeboard boat, not the aluminum runabout.

https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/rennlis...e61d5bd177.jpg

I pulled my Mastercraft 205 on a tandem trailer a bit with my Cayenne. It was much better at towing than my F150 King Ranch edition which has an 11500lb towing capacity. It was way more comfortable and much more power too! Here is a pic of the setup on the ferry to the Olympic Peninsula when I delivered it to the new owner last year.

https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/rennlis...232441174.jpeg

Our CTT pulls the heavy wake boat like a champion as well. It is about the same as the 6.0 GMC. It does way, way better than the GMC when it suffers "reduced engine power" from a seemingly unsolvable electronic throttle body system issue that no indy mechanic or GM dealer seems to be able to solve.

I have said that before too. Just get more garages. When all your stuff is spread out between multiple locations it makes it much harder for your wife to take inventory of the toys! :icon107:
I say all this tongue in cheek while having no less than 4 or 5 vehicles/toys I have been intending to thin from the herd for a couple years myself. Definitely ditch the 4Runner then.

Steve, you already know where this comment is going.
Several locals have recently gotten a Cayenne diesel and seem pleased. Ask some for their impressions. We have driven ours from the hot Chihuahuan desert up to the frozen Arctic Ocean these past eight years and 108,000 miles. Driven rally, both won our class in AutoX, and lots of multi week off-road trips. Last trip prior to COVID was a 5,120 mile (one way) rally up to Tuktoyaktuk, temps got down to -40F with 60mph winds and a blizzard. Otis never dropped off pace!
It will never drive like our RSA but we would not want it to. It will never be a rock climber or mud holer but neither of these interest us. It did very well driving ~200 miles in thick Jello Pudding mud, just ask Roger Jobs what it looked like prior to their courtesy wash!
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@RS-America why do I somehow get the idea that you may have nearly jeopardized the entire concept of 'courtesy wash' for all future customers by the way you told that story? :roflmao:

Thanks for the great story...much appreciated!

Went from an anemic 92 Range Rover to a 2004 CayenneS with air suspension for a winter beater. It was worth every Penny to not have to make plans to pass other vehicles on the highwayl!
Both the heater and a/c worked much better on the Cayenne as well.

Nothing better than a visual.
Not sure why but some of these photos got out of focus during PCAs publication.
https://ww2.pca.org/news/oh-no-canada
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I went from a manual 2002 Xterra to a Cayenne Turbo. I still miss the Xterra but I value my experience with the Cayenne. And that's what it is. A different experience. This might be the time in your life's history you rolled around in a Cayenne.

Haha, I could not have said it any better. 'Making plans to pass' is definitely a low light of the current ownership experience on 2 lane roads! :)

If you go with a Turbo, not only don't you have to make plans to pass, but you can pass 3 or 4 cars or a couple tractor trailers in one shot!

^^^THIS^^^ Car and Driver clocked the 2009 CTTS at 4.0 seconds from 0-60. Pete has more HP than I and I can tell you that I am quite confident that mine with 600+HP and Torque confirms and probably beats the C+D number. It love to see the look on the face of the idiots who try to floor it to keep me from passing- it is simply priceless when I go by them with my fully loaded rig and dog, uphill, like they were standing still. There is simply nothing like it... :rockon:

I drove 5 hours home from TN yesterday mostly on interstate and some guy in a BMW convertible who didn't move out of the left lane for me took offense when I went to pass him on the right and sped up and up and up so I pulled back in behind him. After following him through a few lane changes staying on his bumper, he finally gave up at 107, moved over to the right and waved as I went by at about 120.

That sure sounds nice. I think Toyota engineers and test drivers would be fairly impressed with what I've been able to accomplish (with enough planning and room) with my meager 240 hp and 4000 pound vehicle. True story but when we came home from 4th of July earlier this year I completed a pass so hardcore that my '4 Low' light illuminated on my dashboard. I won't self incriminate about how fast I was able to go, but it was an effort for the ages and my little 4Runner had no business at that speed whatsoever. I was staring at the dash afterwards thinking WTF but after I turned the truck off and on again the light went off.

Not directly but I had a 2001 4runner lifted on 35s, snorkel, front and rear ARB air lockers and a 4.7:1 t-case that was built up to the nines.
My in between as a 4.8 X5 that transitioned me well into the Cay GTS. I will say that it is a hell of a lot more fun than the 4runner but the 4runner did things I will never let this Cayenne do.

I should have mentioned my actual use case of the 4Runner has always been that of a station wagon, meaning as a commuter and long distance hauler so we can bring stuff with us, never a rock crawler. So, I definitely know where you're coming from but I've never really used mine to tackle anything more dramatic than snowy/icy roads.

To add a crazy plot twist to this story...the same friend that allowed me to test drive his own meticulously cared for Cayenne S just surprised me yesterday to know he's putting it up for sale. It has around 65k original miles and has all the major and preventative services done, and he's planning to ask $10k. I could practically push it from his driveway to mine too. Geez! :)

I used to have a Toyota,it lasted me around 250,000 miles and then it became problematic. I'm now nearing 300,000 miles with My 2005 Cayenne S and it's still going strong. Cost wise on maintenance is about the same with a good indie and using only OEM parts. The Toyota wins on insurance cost and gas mileage, but the Cayenne wins by a mile on the grin factor.

Thank you my friend! That one may count as the most surprising switch story yet, but of course I like it very much! I appreciate your feedback. What vintage was your 4Runner?

Don't see many other pink boats. Lol.

https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/rennlis...541cd662a6.jpg

That's AWESOME - almost Twin boats. What lake is yours in? Ours is an 06 LSV IN Lake Keowee in SC. What year - LSV or VLX?

It's an 08 vlx in kalmilka bc.
Have the 2014 dash in it though.

Used to take it to lake havasu for spring break, and even with the million dollar boats that need tilt trailers around, it was always getting compliments, it's just a sharp looking boat and colour combo.

Very cool.

This thread has taken a fun turn...very enjoyable to see! :)