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Warning!: no start after fill up

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Old 03-12-2018, 03:19 PM
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Miamirice
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Default Warning!: no start after fill up

i have a 2006 S. It has always started quickly with no drama. Saturday I filled it with gas and it just cranked and cranked without starting until the battery died. I was fortunate to push it 10 feet and park it and caught Uber Home. I was thinking fuel pump and started researching. There was mention of crank position sensor. Kept reading and found a bunch of stories of my exact experience.

Its the tank vent valve. I learned it will start if you floor the pedal and then crank it. I went back with jumper and sure enough it fired up. Now the $100 part is on order and looks very simple to change. You have been warned!
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Old 03-12-2018, 04:47 PM
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TomF
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This is common on a variety of Porsche models, including the 911 and happens after a certain age or mileage.

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Old 03-12-2018, 05:30 PM
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Was the check engine light on prior to it totally failing?
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Old 03-12-2018, 06:45 PM
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Originally Posted by nodoors View Post
Was the check engine light on prior to it totally failing?
it has been, however it reads 0491 and 0492 which I believe are airpunps? So was assuming it was either faulty air pump or vacuume leak.
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Old 03-12-2018, 10:06 PM
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Originally Posted by Miamirice View Post
i have a 2006 S. It has always started quickly with no drama. Saturday I filled it with gas and it just cranked and cranked without starting until the battery died. I was fortunate ...
Thanks for sharing the experience. I'll try to remember that one. BTW, the repeated cranking is a good way to kill a starter. It just gets too hot and stays hot if you keep trying it. Good to hear yours survived, but it may have been weakened.
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Old 03-13-2018, 06:15 AM
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Default More info please

Part number?
picture?
exact location. Of the valve please...
i have a very similar issue right now and don't really want to rip into the fuel pumps.

thanks





Originally Posted by Miamirice View Post
i have a 2006 S. It has always started quickly with no drama. Saturday I filled it with gas and it just cranked and cranked without starting until the battery died. I was fortunate to push it 10 feet and park it and caught Uber Home. I was thinking fuel pump and started researching. There was mention of crank position sensor. Kept reading and found a bunch of stories of my exact experience.

Its the tank vent valve. I learned it will start if you floor the pedal and then crank it. I went back with jumper and sure enough it fired up. Now the $100 part is on order and looks very simple to change. You have been warned!
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Old 03-13-2018, 08:57 AM
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Originally Posted by nodoors View Post
Was the check engine light on prior to it totally failing?
Originally Posted by Miamirice View Post
it has been, however it reads 0491 and 0492 which I believe are airpunps? So was assuming it was either faulty air pump or vacuume leak.
So it warned you ahead of time and you did, what about it?

Vacuum systems are a pain in the *** when it comes to emissions management. There's other posts here on rennlist that mention those codes. Search is your friend, especially if you use the whole code (P0491,etc) when posting/searching.

That and do you know the age of the battery? They don't last forever. If you run it until dead you WILL harm it. Using lead acid batteries below 11 volts will greatly reduce it's lifespan. I've had boats for years and this is one thing you REALLY have to avoid. Any car battery older than 5 years is a gamble. Sure, some folks have fringe examples of getting longer than that, but for the most part if it's 5 years old you should budget to replace it.
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Old 03-13-2018, 11:07 AM
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Originally Posted by wkearney99 View Post
So it warned you ahead of time and you did, what about it?

Vacuum systems are a pain in the *** when it comes to emissions management. There's other posts here on rennlist that mention those codes. Search is your friend, especially if you use the whole code (P0491,etc) when posting/searching.

That and do you know the age of the battery? They don't last forever. If you run it until dead you WILL harm it. Using lead acid batteries below 11 volts will greatly reduce it's lifespan. I've had boats for years and this is one thing you REALLY have to avoid. Any car battery older than 5 years is a gamble. Sure, some folks have fringe examples of getting longer than that, but for the most part if it's 5 years old you should budget to replace it.
battery is solid. Search those codes and says absolutely 0 about trouble starting the car. In fact it says itís a benign issue.

Now code P0441 would tell me otherwise. Wkearney99- Am I missing something?
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Old 03-13-2018, 11:11 AM
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Originally Posted by s4for5 View Post
Part number?
picture?
exact location. Of the valve please...
i have a very similar issue right now and don't really want to rip into the fuel pumps.

thanks



https://youtu.be/iO_cyOmqUh8

The takeaway from my post is..if you have this issue. ...until you get this replacement done, start motor with pedal floored AFTER filling the tank with fuel.

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Old 03-13-2018, 12:10 PM
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Originally Posted by oldskewel View Post
Thanks for sharing the experience. I'll try to remember that one. BTW, the repeated cranking is a good way to kill a starter. It just gets too hot and stays hot if you keep trying it. Good to hear yours survived, but it may have been weakened.
Totally agree. In aviation, you always give the starter a cool-down period if you are unable to start the engine. This has not translated to the auto world, mainly because people just donít care since a starter failure certainly doesnít mean an unsafe car (unlike pretty much everything in an aircraft engine).

Good post about starter cooldowns after cranking attempts.
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Old 03-13-2018, 01:22 PM
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Originally Posted by Miamirice View Post
battery is solid. Search those codes and says absolutely 0 about trouble starting the car. In fact it says itís a benign issue.

Now code P0441 would tell me otherwise. Wkearney99- Am I missing something?
It's an '06.. you know the battery is solid because it's already been recently replaced? With batteries, ugh, you really can't assume anything. Way too much depends on them. In modern vehicles there's much less margin for error when the battery starts to fail.

When I read codes having already been seen, without other debugging having been done, it raises some questions. When you start seeing emissions/vacuum-related codes it's a sign things are likely going to be an adventure to fix.
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Old 03-14-2018, 12:05 PM
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Default Code question


Would the P0441 code show up in an OBD port reader or only with a durametric?
I have the no start symptom but my OBD reader shows no codes

thanks


Originally Posted by Miamirice View Post

The takeaway from my post is..if you have this issue. ...until you get this replacement done, start motor with pedal floored AFTER filling the tank with fuel.

https://youtu.be/iO_cyOmqUh8

Last edited by s4for5; 03-14-2018 at 01:23 PM.
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Old 03-14-2018, 01:50 PM
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Originally Posted by s4for5 View Post
Would the P0441 code show up in an OBD port reader or only with a durametric?
I have the no start symptom but my OBD reader shows no codes

thanks
Any code between P0000-P0999 will show up with a generic OBD-II code reader. And the description of the fault is supposed to be accurate. Codes in that range are considered all-vehicle codes - related to emissions. Codes above P1000 are manufacturer specific codes - and they can (and do) vary widely from manufacturer to manufacturer - and even within different models from the same manufacturer. They typically can be read by a generic OBD-II code reader - but for an accurate description of what the code actually means on your year/model/car - Google is your friend.

More than you ever wanted to know about OBD-II:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/On-board_diagnostics
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OBD-II_PIDs
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Old 03-18-2018, 11:05 AM
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s4for5
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Part number help on this please
Pelican shows 94811020201 as a crankcase breather and 94811020203 as the Purge valve for fuel vapor canister.
does the 03 replace the 01 ???
TIA


Last edited by s4for5; 03-18-2018 at 11:30 AM.
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Old 03-18-2018, 12:28 PM
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Yes, the last two numbers is the revision year...
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