TypeRx

Thanks....$67 from Sunset. Do most people that do the GT2 conversion change this clutch pedal spring as well? And has anyone here actually done the "mod"?

Yogi911

Both AMS and EvoMS kits come with a new clutch spring so more than likely yours is not "factory turbo".

I am not sure exactly which spring it is but both kits include one. Whether it was changed out during kit install is another question. Since it is a "gt2 slave conversion" i suppose the supplied spring in the kit is a gt2 spring.

Google search either kit and you can clearly see the spring in the pictures and on the "kit includes:" lists.

TypeRx

Got it, thanks for the clarification. If my car has the softer spring already installed I have no idea how stiff it would have been with the factory turbo spring. It definitely works your leg right now!

The Defector

Ok help me out. Been workin a lot, not sleeping much, making up the difference with draft beers from my new kegerator.

The GT2 spring with the EVOMS kit would be more or less difficult to compress than the stock turbo spring?

What is the order of hardest to compress clutch spring, turbo, gt2, gt3? Are these measured numbers or seat of the pants readings?

JC

A418t81

I ordered the GT3 spring referenced on the previous page to install in my car. I'll report back with the improvement in pedal pressure soon.

The Defector

Thanks
JC

Johnny DB

Any updates?

Thanks

A418t81

Yea, sort of. I got the part and looked into installing it and I'm not sure I want to mess with it to be honest. I'm 6'2, 230 and that space is small and you have to contort yourself upside down up in there and try to push and pull the clutch pedal at the same time...which I can't even get my arm up by me to do that. I'm also totally used to the clutch pedal feel now and it doesn't bother me at all. I may still get a wild hair, who knows.

Johnny DB

Thanks for the update.

Cobaltactic

I just installed the BBi slave on a fully stock drivetrain, a few points:

1) it is about as stiff as the OEM system without the accumulator working...so, if you're finding the clutch very stiff on cold start after sitting overnight, your accumulator is shot and this slave feels similar, or perhaps 15-20% less. If you want to replicate that feeling, with the car off, pump the clutch about 20+ times to drain the accumulator.

2) the take-up feel is MUCH MUCH better. it engages closer to the floor than the OEM slave, but with a lot more control, but it sure takes some getting used to for the spring-back on the pedal. I'm considering the GT3 spring, but as the other guy mentioned, he's used to it now, so perhaps i'll try it for awhile and see if i acclimatize before spending more money and time on it.

3) the power steering lines are plumbed separately through the BBi slave, but simply ported through an orfice, so it has the proper pressure drop, etc expected by the steering pump without removing lines and plugging holes, etc as in the GT2 mod. the bonus with this is there's no way for the clutch and steering hydraulics to mix anymore, but its as simple as installing a new slave (easier actually, since you're not screwing around with the accumulator).

So, in summary, the BBI slave requires a fair bit more effort to actuate the clutch, but its waaay simpler to install than the GT2 mod, costs about the same and you never have to worry about squeezing oil out of the clutch reservoir or having the accumulator fail.

If BBI is reading this, the only two changes i would like to see are the bleed nipple rotated 90deg, for better access, and a larger diameter piston to reduce the effort to actuate the clutch

I'm still interested to know if the GT3 spring is a solution to reduce the pedal effort...any updates?

eviligloo

Thanks for your review! I was considering the bbi slave but after trying a GT2 slave conversion clutch I said no way. I don't like the really hard to push down clutch pedal and I'm not confident that the GT3 spring will return it close enough to the stock hydraulically assisted feel. I like having a lighter clutch even though it's less "precise" with the catch point.

I want to know that if i skip leg day that i'll still be able to drive my car home from the gym.

vaportrail

I was directed to this thread by some friends who are way more active on the forums than I. They are coming over Sunday to help/ drink whiskey . I have the BBI slave on the shelf ready to go. It came with little documentation, just a note that said to flush the pentosin. Any chance you could quickly detail out the steps you took?

I am reasonably mechanically inclined, anything would help.

Thanks for the awesome review also.

Cobaltactic

to swap the slave i cobbled together a DIY from a few sources...

Basically,
1. chock the front tires and raise the rear end as high as you can (or use hoist) and block the rear tires

2. prep for dropping the engine by removing the airbox and disconnecting the y-pipe hoses

3. set up blocking and a bottle jack under the engine block, at the crash bracket

4. get a bit of weight on the bottle jack and then use a long extension and a deep 18mm (i think) socket to loosen the engine mount nuts until the nut is about flush with the end of the stud - this is your backup in case the bottle jack craps out, so don't load it up with the full engine weight as you only have a few turns of thread engaged. lower the bottle jack until the engine is barely resting on the nuts. now you have room to work on top of the transmission.

5. follow the up to step 12 in the following DIY, but remove the bracket too (15mm for the cylinder, 13mm for the bracket). one note - i never was able to get that red plastic connection out of the cylinder, so i ended up cutting the band off of the hose and then hack-sawed the old cylinder housing apart once out of the car to retrieve the aluminum fitting, hose clamped it back on the hose under the car. a bodge job, but it worked . also, clamp that low-pressure hose before removing - mine pissed oil everywhere until i got a clamp on it. super awesome. http://www.rmeuropean.com/porsche-99...placement.aspx

6. flush the system - i used a power-bleeder - push the clutch in with a block of wood (this evacuates all the fluid from the master cylinder), and push through 4 liters of Dot 4. if you want to flush some through the master cylinder, don't push it in and out with the bleeder pressurized, its likely to cause damage...release the pressure, then pump and keep the reservoir topped up.

7. now the fun bit, installing the new slave cylinder - i zip-tied the rubber boot onto the actuation rod, then stretched the boot out so it was able press back into the cylinder, keeping the rod seated in the cylinder and not flopping around. this made it way easier to position the rod into the clutch fork. Also, make sure the allen key grub screw on the slave block is tight before installing....mine wasn't and it leaked.

8. connect the lines *** follow-up, i ended up taking the slave off again due to the grub nut leaking, when reinstalling it the second time, it was waaay easier to push the piston in and get the bolts lined up without the lines connected...ie: do steps 7, 9, 10 and then 8. ****

9. rather than removing the starter i was able to get the feel around until the rod was seated in the fork (you can move it around slightly and feel that the end is captive in the divot, then gently move the cylinder ahead until its sitting in-line and positioned about 0.5in back from the bolt holes

10. put the bolt in the hole furthest from clutch, at the slave bleed nipple end, and position your hand so you can push on the end of the cylinder while holding the bolt in place (with palm of your hand). push slow and steady (about 0.5in), and ensure the cylinder is lined up, if the rod is at an angle you won`t likely be able to push the cylinder. this will likely take you a few tries. you may cry. keep trying until you feel the bolt catch the hole. get it finger tight, then put in the other bolt. you won`t be able to get your fingers inside the bell housing (unless you removed the starter and took a look with a mirror or something) but you should be able to tell if the rod is still in the fork when you start to tighten the two bolts - there should be a fair bit of tension in the cylinder, pushing back towards you - if the cylinder is loose on the bolts, the rod slipped off the fork. cry. try again.

11. tighten the two bolts, and then bleed the system (the bleeder is 8mm - you`ll need a short wrench) - i used another 2 liters of DOT4 for this, again, while pumping the clutch to work out any stuff, etc in the lines. it may take a few bleeds to get good resistance in the clutch pedal and not have to pull it back up by hand.

*** follow-up to this: first time around I didn't follow the procedure in the manual...short story long, my master cylinder popped shortly thereafter. soooo, new master cylinder installed, i then bled the system properly, namely: connect the bleed bottle to the nipple, have the clutch pressed in with a board or something propped up to the seat, fill the reservoir with dot 4 and pump up the power-bleeder to 10psi, crack the bleed valve and push a liter or two of dot 4 through the system total. i stopped every 200mL, closed the bleed nipple, released the pressure on the power-bleeder, then brought the clutch pedal back up fully, and pumped it a few times by hand (without the power-bleeder pressurized), then pushed the clutched back in with a block of wood, applied 10psi with the power-bleeder and then cracked the bleed nipple again. i put through about 2L of dot 4 this way and got a fair bit of air out, without cooking my master cylinder again.

12. raise the engine back up and tighten the engine mount nuts, reconnect the axle, and reinstall the airbox, then lower the car to test the clutch by running the car and pumping the clutch - try to engage 1st - VERY gently as it feels WAY different and has a totally different engagement point than the old system. if it doesn`t go in gear it probably means you have air in the lines - raise it up and bleed it again. if the pedal doesn`t return after pushing it in, pump it a quite a few times by hand until it gets resistance, then rebleed if its not actuating the clutch still (can`t get it in gear).

13. if it works, raise the car back up, fit the hoses, brackets, under trays back where they belong and button it all back up.

note: the power steering system doesn`t need to be bleed manually, simply run the car and turn the steering lock to lock a few times and it will work the air out.

vaportrail

This is awesome. Thank you

heliflyer

Is it necessary / recommended to change anything else when doing the BBI slave conversion?
Is the stock clutch pedal Spring OK to use or should it be swapped for a GT3 unit?
Thanks