100% true! The changes made to .2 suspension made a significant improvement to general ride and handling over .1. So yes I also probably wouldn't bother with DSC on this occasion.

.2tt is an incredibly fast and capable car out of the box, incredibly user friendly, so mindful of OP's reported difficulties with the car it again reinforces the argument of driver training. Frankly without it he is endangering himself and others...

Cincyscott: DSC user feedback appears generally positive, and even the minor light issue is not a deal breaker for you. I think it needs to be accepted that 99% of these kinds of performance mods come with some small issue or other. Main thing is any minuses that are found by each user don't out-weight the pluses.

 

EDIt: On second thought I won't keep the comment I made in response to your jab assuming I am endangering people. Me responding to you makes me as stupid. I'll just let the moderators deal with it.

 

OP

My suggestion even before you take your car out to the track get it aligned or make any modifications is to sit with a seasoned driver in a 911.

I have more seat time as a passenger around a track then I do in my own car it is the most rewarding and valuable experience you can gain before going out in your own.

 

Yea I was planning on doing that this summer around my local track. A local indy shop told me the PCA for my area do track lessons for people new to the 911. I'm not totally ignorant on how to handle a rear engine car. Not driving at 10/10ths on the street. Either way compared to the muscle car this is still easy as hell to drive fast. Probably the way I came off made it sound wrong. I'm no stranger to performance cars. I've driven pretty much every new one out there short of anything from lamborghini. I'm just comparing this to the new 991 4s and new 981. IMO both of those currently handle better than this car. Now I bought this car middle of winter and threw winter tires on. My opinion may change come summer, that is why Tom told me to wait, and I'll listen to his advice.

I'm OCD with my cars. I know how I want them to feel. I improve the car till it is to my satisfaction, and it's as simple as that.

But regardless, because I drove the newer 911 and 981 before I drove this one, I want to make it handle like the new ones if possible. So I'm still going to do an alignment and the DSC. I'll find someone local who has a .2 to test drive before I get the DSC to try it out on my car, since some thinks it doesn't have value on a .2. I'll be the judge of that for myself.

I do overkill, always have on my cars when it comes to suspension. It's not like I'm going crazy with it. We are talking an alignment and a module that takes 2 minutes to put in lol. I'm not creating a cup car here. I like predictable and safe for my goal. And any car can always improve in that regard.

But I can report out on the mods to see how they effect the car in every day driving. I like to do my suspension stuff one at at time to see the difference each part makes.

 

Jem - I wasn't ware that you had an alignment and are driving on winter tires. Winter tires are made of softer rubber designed to stay grippy even at -40 deg! As a result winter tires are a bit squirmy when driven on pavement. Handling is definitely less precise. Waiting for summer tires is a good idea. If this is a street car (no track or little track) I would not align to GT3 specs since with the negative camber you'll wear the inside edge of your tires prematurely. I would NOT use toe out unless you like a darty car that needs constant steering corrections to travel in a straight line. Even my race car has a touch of toe-in.

Regards,

 

I haven't done an alignment. At least not an alignment that people are indicating. Just OEM spec. What alignment would you recommend? Yes this is a street car. Maybe 2-3 track events per year. I asked if the GT3 alignment would wear my tires prematurely and people said no.

 

Good god hand the man a chill pill! Jab not required, just reading your own words and forming an obvious conclusion as others have also done here, that you are well out of your depth with the car itself. If you want to take that as a jab then stay in denial.

Placing fault at not having a dsc unit, stiffer shocks, or some other susp mod is not going to resolve your core issue with the car until you learn how to drive the rear engine chassis properly. The .2 car is a brilliant out of the box package and is very competent in skilled hands without need of any mods. In unskilled hands a car of this HP output would be like handing a baby a loaded hand gun so my comments were justified given your own comments.

As a friendly suggestion, once you have learned how to competently drive a 911 chassis then by all means fire away here and ask the questions about spending money on suspension mods. I thought Chris's earlier advice not to spend a cent at this stage was appropriate, yet that has evidently fallen upon deaf ears in a bid to blame areas other than your skill.

 

It's all relative. My comments are not saying the car is sloppy in general as a car. I don't now how much clearer I can make myself. You need to learn to listen or at least read properly.

Again I am using the 991 4s as my benchmark. I am saying these things compared to the 991 4s. I was never worried about losing control on a 4s.
Also by Chris are you saying TTsurgeon? Pretty sure he said alignment and tires. Which is what I will do in 2 months. It's too cold right now.

We don't need another 10 page thread of your comments. I'll revisit the suspension after I'm back on summer tires. As I said before and I will say it one more time for the last time. I got this car in the dead of winter, I spent 2 weeks in below 30 degree weather on summer tires. I then switched to winter. So I do not have much experience on summer tires on this car. Therefor my opinion may change come spring.

Now I'd like to change the direction of this thread to alignments. Is this ok with you? Am I allowed to do this? Or do we need to argue for 10 pages?

So can people please post some feedback on the GT3 spec alignment. From a quick google search this seems to be popular. Is this different from the negative 1.5-2 camber and slight toe out? I'm wondering how come no one changed their spec now to a GT2 alignment.

What are the negative side effects of doing this?

 

Jem ... please take a step back. These people are trying to help you. That some are even still trying given some of your responses amazes me. When I first started out, I thought I knew everything. When I started truly listening is when my happy meter went up when driving. Nobody here is trying to put you down. We just really wanna see you get the full Monty experience. I bet if you look back on this thread a year from now, you will say something like, "Oh, man. That doesn't even sound like me any more." Meanwhile, soak up all of the data from the experience of those of us who have been right where you are now. I promise you are gonna love the journey!

 

As far as toe, I would not go more than 1/16th IN. Too much out will make the car rather unpredictable mid-turn. If anything, just go for zero toe if possible. Probably the only car I can see wanting toe out might be an F1 car or something small and riding on the ground. I am sure the other folks will chime in if they feel my advice is incorrect, which I openly welcome. I am always up to the education.

 

1) a) You had me fooled. Why then question the need for sways DSC's etc? 1) b)You are just being confrontational now because some here (inc me) have called you out on the obvious. Maybe you should consider articulating your position differently next time.....not that I feel in this instance the outcome would have been any different given your own words and, the questions you then asked against the responses given. Odd really. Not sure what you are hoping to hear? Did you want us all to say the car is a handling disaster, and you are a brilliant driver?
2) 10 pages is what you created as a consequence of your directing your last thread against the flow of advice which you sought out in the first instance. So it is every one else's fault that they found holes in your argument/responses?....and responded accordingly in a bid to put you straight?
3) GT3 Specs have already been provided along with informative and detailed links etc. Surely there is enough there for you to digest? Or, do we all need to add another 10 pages reinventing the wheel for you on that same topic?
PS. I don't suppose you have a picture of this car of yours? Normally photos are required.

 

Thank you for your words. My only issue is with speed21. He seems to love confrontation. My responses are solely directed at him and no one else. I appreciate everyone else's advice. This is what the forum is for. If you want feel free to read the 12 page exhaust thread and you'll understand my frustrations a bit more.

Thank you for this input. All constructive input is welcomed. If possible I'm trying to maybe consolidate into one thread a real account of suspension mods that are the best bang for buck on this car. I know on my past cars I spent a lot of time and money with suspension bits that for a 95% street driven car didn't really make a noticeable difference. I am sure it would have on the track but I just didn't see it o the street. But some were more noticeable than others. On the porsche it seems a correct alignment and the DSC are very noticeable in their improvements. Given how people unanimously recommend both.

I'm even wondering how do sway bars effect this car, or going with lower control arms. But it seems there is more to this alignment than what was simply stated before.

 

For you. I was going to post a lot of the ones I took in the new exhaust thread I will create once I get mine. It's not reinventing the wheel to ask what people have done for their alignments and to give real world feedback on them.

No one found any holes. All they said were get proper tires, alignment, go to a driving class for the car.

check, check, check. I will do all of them. No problem.

And no, we went 10 pages because you keep touting about europipe so bad to the point people questioned why you had so much blind love for it, and the thread was about people's experience with kline. Not europipe. But let's not bring that up.

But that's ok. I don't want this thread to become a mess again, which clearly you will do your best to make sure everyone I start is. I got the answers I needed for now. Thank you all who gave constructive advice, I appreciate that.

/endthread

 

Here is one of the interior while we are at it. Now speed, if you want to see more you are just going to have to be patient. I promise it will all come .

 

LOL! Why not bring it up! You need to get your story straight! Here is the thread,https://rennlist.com/forums/997-turb...e-exhaust.html I think you may need to read it before blaming others about the length and content. I was but only one of many posters there completely bewildered with your approach.....bit like this thread actually. Same **** different thread one may say.
I even told you on three separate occasions to buy the Kline inconel (not an EP) as did other posters there. You were the main one banging on and on and on about europipe and putting up god knows how many soundclips and other elaborate commentary on the system. I was wondering if were you on the payroll lol. Ridiculous! And still no sign of any system least of the all the inconel you were asked to buy.

Next time show me the ones with the large dice dangling off the rear view mirror, and the doggy with the bobbing head on the rear parcel shelf.