The official Bilstein PASM Thread
01-03-2013, 11:28 AM
#1
The official Bilstein PASM & RSS Thread
After reading alot just now in GMP's thread about how unhappy people are with the B16 kit I though we might aswell make a seperate thread and discuss it here i.e the pro's the con's and peoples real experiences!
Last edited by GTRNICK; 01-13-2013 at 08:13 PM.
01-03-2013, 12:00 PM
#2
I have fitted a clubsport PASM kit and all the parts RSS have to offer for the 997tt in terms of suspension components and have had them fitted for nearly a year!
At first I was very happy with what I had done as the car felt like it was on rails and kind of still does, but now as time goes by a slight part of me is thinking did I make the right choice in spending all those thousands as the car seems to be getting worse not in handling but in ride quality. Also since the weather has been cold the car just doesn't stop squeeking over bumps and humps which is very annoying!
At first I was very happy with what I had done as the car felt like it was on rails and kind of still does, but now as time goes by a slight part of me is thinking did I make the right choice in spending all those thousands as the car seems to be getting worse not in handling but in ride quality. Also since the weather has been cold the car just doesn't stop squeeking over bumps and humps which is very annoying!
01-03-2013, 12:40 PM
#3
Instructor
My Bilstein coilovers offer a very rough ride on all but the smoothest of highways. My 997TT now rides WORSE than my dad's old pick-up truck. They groan, squeak, pop, and are just awful. Embarrassing when I take a date out for a drive or a nite on the town. The only pro is that they do turn in better on twisty seacoast roads in CA.
01-03-2013, 01:34 PM
#4
Get the Bilstein's B16 and call up TPC Racing for their DSC module. It replaces the stock PASM module and it is a fantastic piece of kit. It follows the adhesion circle and comes with three maps that you can change. Basically when you brake the fronts get stiff, when turning left the front right and blah blah, however, it acts independently and can make small changes to each shock as opposed to Porsche's on or off model. Anyway, driving around it does not feel stiff, but very compliant, now start loading up the suspension and the car stays level and doesn't bounce over imperfections. Give them a call, you won't be disappointed.
I am not a paid spokesperson just a satisfied customer. Good luck.
I am not a paid spokesperson just a satisfied customer. Good luck.
01-03-2013, 01:37 PM
#5
Get the Bilstein's B16 and call up TPC Racing for their DSC module. It replaces the stock PASM module and it is a fantastic piece of kit. It follows the adhesion circle and comes with three maps that you can change. Basically when you brake the fronts get stiff, when turning left the front right and blah blah, however, it acts independently and can make small changes to each shock as opposed to Porsche's on or off model. Anyway, driving around it does not feel stiff, but very compliant, now start loading up the suspension and the car stays level and doesn't bounce over imperfections. Give them a call, you won't be disappointed.
I am not a paid spokesperson just a satisfied customer. Good luck.
I am not a paid spokesperson just a satisfied customer. Good luck.
Last edited by GTRNICK; 01-03-2013 at 01:58 PM.
01-04-2013, 04:00 AM
#7
Having experienced this dreadful product myself, what I'm hearing now from GTR Nick and Lewisb comes as no surprise at all. Being subjected to tolerating such an incredibly crappy noisy and unresolved ride in a car like this is unsustainable unless the car was knowingly being relegated from its prime purpose as a DD road car to a dedicated track car.
This Bilstein kit is therefore not suitable for the purpose intended on the basis it destroys everything the car was designed for along with failing in it's key intent. To call any mod an improvement it would need to satisfy a criteria applicable to the car it is being fitted to. Where a Porsche is concerned, and mindful it is a car that has been engineered to provide excellent handling while being liveable as a Daily drive, this product is far too unresolved to allow the vehicle to retain its intended use as a DD. The very fact there are no product warnings on the packaging, nor warnings from the vendor/s advising the purchaser the ride of the car will be noisy along with the resultant ride being essentially totally unsuitable for a daily driving environment, the sale of this product is in my opinion in breach of todays consumer protection laws.
Legally, by rights this crap should be fully refundable along with all out of pocket expenses, and i would test it for sure! Junk like this should be sold like cigarettes with warnings all over the packaging.
This Bilstein kit is therefore not suitable for the purpose intended on the basis it destroys everything the car was designed for along with failing in it's key intent. To call any mod an improvement it would need to satisfy a criteria applicable to the car it is being fitted to. Where a Porsche is concerned, and mindful it is a car that has been engineered to provide excellent handling while being liveable as a Daily drive, this product is far too unresolved to allow the vehicle to retain its intended use as a DD. The very fact there are no product warnings on the packaging, nor warnings from the vendor/s advising the purchaser the ride of the car will be noisy along with the resultant ride being essentially totally unsuitable for a daily driving environment, the sale of this product is in my opinion in breach of todays consumer protection laws.
Legally, by rights this crap should be fully refundable along with all out of pocket expenses, and i would test it for sure! Junk like this should be sold like cigarettes with warnings all over the packaging.
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01-04-2013, 10:28 AM
#8
The problem I have speed21 is I fitted a lot of parts at the same time so it would be unfair for me to put the total blame on the Bilstein would be unfair at this point. (I spent a good £8000 BTW)
Once I have done my checks on the car when I get it on the ramp etc... Etc… I will see what I think after that!!!
The thing that pisses me off with a lot of the aftermarket manufacturers, in this case Bilstein or RSS is that they just tell you half the story and not the full. I could never release a product without making customers aware of the pros and cons and that’s if there should be any cons!
Also I think they are in such a rush to make a product and put it out there on the market to make the money without fully testing it that they shoot themselves in the foot and the customer’s foot also which is very unfair.
For E.G. the first PASM kit that Bilstein brought out had issues with corrosion and the links braking which is not meant to be a problem anymore but.....this is a company that supplies OEM lol (Lucky for me I purchased their revised kit)
Then RSS sending me LCA Bolts made of mush and then trying to blame me/installer for the problems.
Also sending me M14 nuts at the same time for the other part's and not being able to torque them up properly without them threading lol what a joke!!!!! (Luckily for me the suspension specialist had a friend on the same industrial estate who could make some there and then out of high strength material)
So the LCA bolts were sent back to RSS for testing and they admitted fault, so a recall on all those particular batch of bolts was done THANKS TO ME!!!! Which is a good thing because it was supposedly down to the supplier of the metal/material for those bolts, why? (The excuse was -Again greed trying to keep up with the demand because they didn’t have enough supply from the regular guys!)
Now my car is squeaking due to the possible fact that the bearings used are cheap crap or dry who knows!
Man I have had enough!
Once I have done my checks on the car when I get it on the ramp etc... Etc… I will see what I think after that!!!
The thing that pisses me off with a lot of the aftermarket manufacturers, in this case Bilstein or RSS is that they just tell you half the story and not the full. I could never release a product without making customers aware of the pros and cons and that’s if there should be any cons!
Also I think they are in such a rush to make a product and put it out there on the market to make the money without fully testing it that they shoot themselves in the foot and the customer’s foot also which is very unfair.
For E.G. the first PASM kit that Bilstein brought out had issues with corrosion and the links braking which is not meant to be a problem anymore but.....this is a company that supplies OEM lol (Lucky for me I purchased their revised kit)
Then RSS sending me LCA Bolts made of mush and then trying to blame me/installer for the problems.
Also sending me M14 nuts at the same time for the other part's and not being able to torque them up properly without them threading lol what a joke!!!!! (Luckily for me the suspension specialist had a friend on the same industrial estate who could make some there and then out of high strength material)
So the LCA bolts were sent back to RSS for testing and they admitted fault, so a recall on all those particular batch of bolts was done THANKS TO ME!!!! Which is a good thing because it was supposedly down to the supplier of the metal/material for those bolts, why? (The excuse was -Again greed trying to keep up with the demand because they didn’t have enough supply from the regular guys!)
Now my car is squeaking due to the possible fact that the bearings used are cheap crap or dry who knows!
Man I have had enough!
01-04-2013, 02:34 PM
#9
Instructor
Having experienced this dreadful product myself, what I'm hearing now from GTR Nick and Lewisb comes as no surprise at all. Being subjected to tolerating such an incredibly crappy noisy and unresolved ride in a car like this is unsustainable unless the car was knowingly being relegated from its prime purpose as a DD road car to a dedicated track car.
This Bilstein kit is therefore not suitable for the purpose intended on the basis it destroys everything the car was designed for along with failing in it's key intent. To call any mod an improvement it would need to satisfy a criteria applicable to the car it is being fitted to. Where a Porsche is concerned, and mindful it is a car that has been engineered to provide excellent handling while being liveable as a Daily drive, this product is far too unresolved to allow the vehicle to retain its intended use as a DD. The very fact there are no product warnings on the packaging, nor warnings from the vendor/s advising the purchaser the ride of the car will be noisy along with the resultant ride being essentially totally unsuitable for a daily driving environment, the sale of this product is in my opinion in breach of todays consumer protection laws.
Legally, by rights this crap should be fully refundable along with all out of pocket expenses, and i would test it for sure! Junk like this should be sold like cigarettes with warnings all over the packaging.
This Bilstein kit is therefore not suitable for the purpose intended on the basis it destroys everything the car was designed for along with failing in it's key intent. To call any mod an improvement it would need to satisfy a criteria applicable to the car it is being fitted to. Where a Porsche is concerned, and mindful it is a car that has been engineered to provide excellent handling while being liveable as a Daily drive, this product is far too unresolved to allow the vehicle to retain its intended use as a DD. The very fact there are no product warnings on the packaging, nor warnings from the vendor/s advising the purchaser the ride of the car will be noisy along with the resultant ride being essentially totally unsuitable for a daily driving environment, the sale of this product is in my opinion in breach of todays consumer protection laws.
Legally, by rights this crap should be fully refundable along with all out of pocket expenses, and i would test it for sure! Junk like this should be sold like cigarettes with warnings all over the packaging.
01-04-2013, 03:42 PM
#10
Drifting
Yeah.. The aftermarket is the "red light" district.. Better to wear a condom at all times with those sharks...
01-04-2013, 03:50 PM
#11
Drifting
The problem I have speed21 is I fitted a lot of parts at the same time so it would be unfair for me to put the total blame on the Bilstein would be unfair at this point. (I spent a good £8000 BTW)
Once I have done my checks on the car when I get it on the ramp etc... Etc… I will see what I think after that!!!
The thing that pisses me off with a lot of the aftermarket manufacturers, in this case Bilstein or RSS is that they just tell you half the story and not the full. I could never release a product without making customers aware of the pros and cons and that’s if there should be any cons!
Also I think they are in such a rush to make a product and put it out there on the market to make the money without fully testing it that they shoot themselves in the foot and the customer’s foot also which is very unfair.
For E.G. the first PASM kit that Bilstein brought out had issues with corrosion and the links braking which is not meant to be a problem anymore but.....this is a company that supplies OEM lol (Lucky for me I purchased their revised kit)
Then RSS sending me LCA Bolts made of mush and then trying to blame me/installer for the problems.
Also sending me M14 nuts at the same time for the other part's and not being able to torque them up properly without them threading lol what a joke!!!!! (Luckily for me the suspension specialist had a friend on the same industrial estate who could make some there and then out of high strength material)
So the LCA bolts were sent back to RSS for testing and they admitted fault, so a recall on all those particular batch of bolts was done THANKS TO ME!!!! Which is a good thing because it was supposedly down to the supplier of the metal/material for those bolts, why? (The excuse was -Again greed trying to keep up with the demand because they didn’t have enough supply from the regular guys!)
Now my car is squeaking due to the possible fact that the bearings used are cheap crap or dry who knows!
Man I have had enough!
Once I have done my checks on the car when I get it on the ramp etc... Etc… I will see what I think after that!!!
The thing that pisses me off with a lot of the aftermarket manufacturers, in this case Bilstein or RSS is that they just tell you half the story and not the full. I could never release a product without making customers aware of the pros and cons and that’s if there should be any cons!
Also I think they are in such a rush to make a product and put it out there on the market to make the money without fully testing it that they shoot themselves in the foot and the customer’s foot also which is very unfair.
For E.G. the first PASM kit that Bilstein brought out had issues with corrosion and the links braking which is not meant to be a problem anymore but.....this is a company that supplies OEM lol (Lucky for me I purchased their revised kit)
Then RSS sending me LCA Bolts made of mush and then trying to blame me/installer for the problems.
Also sending me M14 nuts at the same time for the other part's and not being able to torque them up properly without them threading lol what a joke!!!!! (Luckily for me the suspension specialist had a friend on the same industrial estate who could make some there and then out of high strength material)
So the LCA bolts were sent back to RSS for testing and they admitted fault, so a recall on all those particular batch of bolts was done THANKS TO ME!!!! Which is a good thing because it was supposedly down to the supplier of the metal/material for those bolts, why? (The excuse was -Again greed trying to keep up with the demand because they didn’t have enough supply from the regular guys!)
Now my car is squeaking due to the possible fact that the bearings used are cheap crap or dry who knows!
Man I have had enough!
That's amazing.. I thought that Bilstein and RSS were some of the better companies to deal with.. I'm sorry you spent all that cash only to have to go back to square one...Sucks brother..
01-04-2013, 04:34 PM
#12
Well not back to square one yet but I will get it all checked out first and take from there.
I'm booked in at the suspension specialists for the 2nd sat in January.
But what I wrote is what as happened so far!
I'm booked in at the suspension specialists for the 2nd sat in January.
But what I wrote is what as happened so far!
01-04-2013, 05:09 PM
#13
Drifting
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On some things, you just can't beat the factory, suspensions more than anything else. I just wish Porsche had offered a X73 type factory alternative so we wouldn't have to use aftermarket parts.
My personal issue with the Bilstein damptronic was the fatal "PASM failure", caused by the faulty design of the wiring. Why does the factory route theirs thru the top and the aftermarket exposed at the bottom of the shock? I guess now we know, one is specifically designed to avoid failure and the other is merely universal packaging for the masses.
My personal issue with the Bilstein damptronic was the fatal "PASM failure", caused by the faulty design of the wiring. Why does the factory route theirs thru the top and the aftermarket exposed at the bottom of the shock? I guess now we know, one is specifically designed to avoid failure and the other is merely universal packaging for the masses.
01-04-2013, 05:17 PM
#14
Drifting
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The more I think about it the more pissed I become. As their OEM supplier Bilstein damn well knew the Porsche design parameters, yet still delivered an inferior aftermarket coil over.
01-04-2013, 05:40 PM
#15
Lets see what happens with this guys it might not be all doom and gllom as the specialist I use is such an amazing guy I forgot to mention he is checking everything out for me for free! (He only fitted and setup the suspension for me)
I Quote
"Dear Nick,
We look forward to helping locate the niggles on your car!
We have provisionally booked 14:00hrs appointment for both the Saturdays 12th and 19th January.
Please could you confirm as soon as possible so that we can let the other appointment.
The health check includes a brief test drive, damper test and physical inspection. Alas, the health checks allow us to isolate and report for work to be scheduled for later dates.
We look forward to hearing from you.
Warmest regards,
Chris
center gravity limited"
I Quote
"Dear Nick,
We look forward to helping locate the niggles on your car!
We have provisionally booked 14:00hrs appointment for both the Saturdays 12th and 19th January.
Please could you confirm as soon as possible so that we can let the other appointment.
The health check includes a brief test drive, damper test and physical inspection. Alas, the health checks allow us to isolate and report for work to be scheduled for later dates.
We look forward to hearing from you.
Warmest regards,
Chris
center gravity limited"