2009 Turbo w/ 28,000 miles, $83,992 asking price
11-17-2012, 01:18 PM
#16
Drifting
Thanks for the "heads up."
I was able to test drive the car this morning after all. It appears that the front piece was replaced in the past; it definitely has a different color; the salesman could not provide details. There are a couple of rock chips in it so it was replaced some time ago. The car feels a bit beat up. Inside there's a small cut in the front seat leather. The emergency brake is all scratched up. What is even more strange is that navigation does not appear to be installed. The car has an aluminum steering wheel, which some people might like, but I prefer leather.
All in all, it did not give me a lot of confidence.
I was able to test drive the car this morning after all. It appears that the front piece was replaced in the past; it definitely has a different color; the salesman could not provide details. There are a couple of rock chips in it so it was replaced some time ago. The car feels a bit beat up. Inside there's a small cut in the front seat leather. The emergency brake is all scratched up. What is even more strange is that navigation does not appear to be installed. The car has an aluminum steering wheel, which some people might like, but I prefer leather.
All in all, it did not give me a lot of confidence.
11-17-2012, 01:59 PM
#17
Three Wheelin'
Regarding repainted bumper, could be but for sure impossible to tell.
But more often than not this is the factory finish and look.
This speedster in meteor gray for example just came in from Stuttgart and was just put in the dealers showroom when this picture was taken :
Last edited by TT-911; 12-15-2012 at 07:47 AM.
11-17-2012, 02:05 PM
#18
Rennlist Member
If you send me the vin, I can run a carfax
Edwin
Edwin
11-17-2012, 02:11 PM
#19
Three Wheelin'
Thanks for the "heads up."
I was able to test drive the car this morning after all. It appears that the front piece was replaced in the past; it definitely has a different color; the salesman could not provide details. There are a couple of rock chips in it so it was replaced some time ago.
I was able to test drive the car this morning after all. It appears that the front piece was replaced in the past; it definitely has a different color; the salesman could not provide details. There are a couple of rock chips in it so it was replaced some time ago.
This will happen to a lot of cars in the future, people doubting perfectly good and original cars because paint does not match.
Easily repaired by a pro.
Most likely woman driver with lots of jewelry. Replace with carbon handle and solved.
That is indeed strange , was there a big gaping hole in the center console ? Or what do you mean ? This would make me very cautious and would likely make me walk.
11-17-2012, 02:17 PM
#20
Racer
Thread Starter
Or it simply came like that, most likely if no trace from respray is evident.
This will happen to a lot of cars in the future, people doubting perfectly good and original cars because paint does not match.
Easily repaired by a pro.
Most likely woman driver with lots of jewelry. Replace with carbon handle and solved.
That is indeed strange , was there a big gaping hole in the center console ? Or what do you mean ? This would make me very cautious and would likely make me walk.
This will happen to a lot of cars in the future, people doubting perfectly good and original cars because paint does not match.
Easily repaired by a pro.
Most likely woman driver with lots of jewelry. Replace with carbon handle and solved.
That is indeed strange , was there a big gaping hole in the center console ? Or what do you mean ? This would make me very cautious and would likely make me walk.
11-17-2012, 02:27 PM
#21
JRW1 please do not be disappointed by the front bumper. A respray done by a quality painter, will match perfect. I would say about 1K. Reason is the bumper has to be removed, sanded, cleaned and preped. Then painted off the car, put back on and buffed. Just lots of labor. Paint must be water based as is the case with Porsche vehicles. Work out a deal with the salesman, that way its Porsche approved! Also, make sure the body shop tags the work as "Detail" that way no problems in the future from some **** retentive Rennlister wanting a break in price :-)
Last edited by atcbi5; 11-17-2012 at 02:44 PM.
11-17-2012, 02:34 PM
#23
Race Director
I noticed that too, but the majority of metallic gray and metallic silver porsche bumpers don't match even when they are brand new from the factory. I noticed this regularly when I was hunting for my car and the cause of the difference in color is multifold (you guys probably already know this). 1) Porsche sprays the bumpers at a different facility separate from the body of the car. (2) They use a flex agent in the paint for the bumpers which impacts the shade slightly and (3) the impact of static charge that builds up on the plastic bumpers makes the metallic flakes in the paint "stand up". When you add all these together you almost always wills see a color difference in bumpers of the gray and silver metallics especially in the sun (the very dark metallics hide the difference better)
The color difference is most noticeable in direct sunlight which makes the metallic flakes pop more on the bumpers and hence they will appear a shade darker than the body. However in the shade or ambient light the difference should be barely noticeable whereas in these pics it seems the color difference is pronounced in the shade. The best way to have this checked is with a paint meter and an expert eye. The paint meter will let you know if the bumper has been resprayed, you will typically see readings of 300-400 microns on a hand done respray of the bumpers. This doesn't necessarily mean the car was wrecked, but dealers will respray for wear and tear on the bumper.
If you confirm it is actual factory paint then I would not touch it, if it is a bad respray and the rest of the car checks out clean then have them replace the bumper or respray it again to a better match. IMO a resprayed bumper on a used porsche is not a big deal as long as it was not in a collision and just touched up for cosmetic purposes (ie road rash and rock chips)
Good luck!
The color difference is most noticeable in direct sunlight which makes the metallic flakes pop more on the bumpers and hence they will appear a shade darker than the body. However in the shade or ambient light the difference should be barely noticeable whereas in these pics it seems the color difference is pronounced in the shade. The best way to have this checked is with a paint meter and an expert eye. The paint meter will let you know if the bumper has been resprayed, you will typically see readings of 300-400 microns on a hand done respray of the bumpers. This doesn't necessarily mean the car was wrecked, but dealers will respray for wear and tear on the bumper.
If you confirm it is actual factory paint then I would not touch it, if it is a bad respray and the rest of the car checks out clean then have them replace the bumper or respray it again to a better match. IMO a resprayed bumper on a used porsche is not a big deal as long as it was not in a collision and just touched up for cosmetic purposes (ie road rash and rock chips)
Good luck!
And based on my experience with my 2 cars (lapis blue Boxster which received both a new front and rear bumper cover and my arctic silver 03 Turbo which received a new front bumper cover and hood and passenger fender) the painted covers/panels color/tint matches untouched panels that even a trained eye can't tell which are replacement and which are original other than one ex-body shop employee was able to based on the paint finish of the repainted items does not have the same degree of orange peel the factory paint finish has.
Since my first post to this thread I looked at the pics and the front bumper cover's paint is markedly different.
The rear cover is as near as I tell indistinguishable from the rest of the body.
Given this alone this points to at least a bad respray of a rock chipped bumper cover, which is bad enough.
If this bumper cover was replaced due to accident damage the poor respray hints that if there was any deeper damage its repair is as substandard at the bumper cover paint job.
Not a comforting feeling.
11-17-2012, 02:36 PM
#24
I would check for the proper attachment of the fasteners. Underbody, front wheel wells etc. That problem can be fixed and its not out of the ordinary that dealers respray vehicles to sell them. This car was probably painted before and just traded in. They are going to sell it as is my guess. I would try to lower the price and get her fixed.
Last edited by atcbi5; 10-14-2013 at 07:04 AM.
11-17-2012, 02:57 PM
#25
Burning Brakes
Thanks for the "heads up."
I was able to test drive the car this morning after all. It appears that the front piece was replaced in the past; it definitely has a different color; the salesman could not provide details. There are a couple of rock chips in it so it was replaced some time ago. The car feels a bit beat up. Inside there's a small cut in the front seat leather. The emergency brake is all scratched up. What is even more strange is that navigation does not appear to be installed. The car has an aluminum steering wheel, which some people might like, but I prefer leather.
All in all, it did not give me a lot of confidence.
I was able to test drive the car this morning after all. It appears that the front piece was replaced in the past; it definitely has a different color; the salesman could not provide details. There are a couple of rock chips in it so it was replaced some time ago. The car feels a bit beat up. Inside there's a small cut in the front seat leather. The emergency brake is all scratched up. What is even more strange is that navigation does not appear to be installed. The car has an aluminum steering wheel, which some people might like, but I prefer leather.
All in all, it did not give me a lot of confidence.
If the car is mechanically sound and you can live with the interior condition the price isn't too bad.
11-17-2012, 03:03 PM
#26
Burning Brakes
During the CPO process the dealer will check DME, you only have to ask for the report. Once you have it post it here and you'll get lots of info or you could search for 'DME report'.
Regarding repainted bumper, could be but for sure impossible to tell.
But more often than not this is the factory finish and look.
This speedster in meteor gray for example just came in from Stuttgart and was just put in the dealers showroom when this picture was taken :
Regarding repainted bumper, could be but for sure impossible to tell.
But more often than not this is the factory finish and look.
This speedster in meteor gray for example just came in from Stuttgart and was just put in the dealers showroom when this picture was taken :
This is a great example of what I was referring to earlier. Take a look at where the bumper meets the body to the left of the driver's side headlight, completely different shade of gray. In this pic the bumper appears to be about a shade lighter
11-17-2012, 03:15 PM
#27
Racer
Thread Starter
There is another Turbo in town that I am trying to see and test drive, that is being sold privately. It has under 16,000 miles, and it appears to be impeccable; however he is asking $10,000 more:
http://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/vehicledetails.xhtml?zip=77002&endYear=2009&modelCode1=911&startYear=200 9&makeCode1=POR&listingType=used&listingTypes=used&sellerTypes=b&searchR adius=50&bodyStyleCodes=CONVERT&mmt=[POR[911[]][]]&listingId=328984253&Log=0
http://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/vehicledetails.xhtml?zip=77002&endYear=2009&modelCode1=911&startYear=200 9&makeCode1=POR&listingType=used&listingTypes=used&sellerTypes=b&searchR adius=50&bodyStyleCodes=CONVERT&mmt=[POR[911[]][]]&listingId=328984253&Log=0
11-17-2012, 03:29 PM
#28
Burning Brakes
I don't claim to be an expert but what I posted earlier is based on extensive conversations and homework I did before purchasing my meteor gray metallic turbo. I did so after seeing several meteor gray metallics (new and used) that looked to have resprayed bumpers, again based on the difference in shade under certain lighting.
I spoke extensively with top line porsche body shops, techs and detail gurus, and had several paint checks completed on a few cars before making my final purchase. My car checked out as 100% factory after all these independent inspections even though there is a slight difference under certain lighting
for example, under ambient overcast lighting (looks like a perfect match)
under direct sunlight you can see the bumper has a more pronounced metallic sparkle
and here you can see the bumper looks a shade darker
anyway, my point being that you can get mismatches direct from the factory based on the reasons I highlighted in my earlier email so it shouldn't necessarily be a concern. It should only be an issue if you can confirm that it was indeed resprayed, at which point you need to understand why, i.e. collision or just for cosmetic purposes, and if the latter you can have them redo it properly or possibly negotiate a lower price
Hope that helps
Art
11-17-2012, 05:23 PM
#29
Three Wheelin'
Last time I'll trust Wikipedia - Turbo/Turbo Cabriolet (2009-) "The facelifted version of the 997 Turbo, was unveiled at the 2009 Frankfurt Motor Show. It received a completely new 6-cylinder, 3.8 liter boxer engine delivering 500 hp (370 kW) with revised Borg-Warner variable turbine geometry (VTG) turbos - "
11-17-2012, 05:33 PM
#30
Three Wheelin'
Last time I'll trust Wikipedia - Turbo/Turbo Cabriolet (2009-) "The facelifted version of the 997 Turbo, was unveiled at the 2009 Frankfurt Motor Show. It received a completely new 6-cylinder, 3.8 liter boxer engine delivering 500 hp (370 kW) with revised Borg-Warner variable turbine geometry (VTG) turbos - "