dianic

What would the impact be if moving from a 5-50 grade oil to a 5-40 oil in warm temps? And why would one do that? Would the benefit of the additives be reduced due to the lower viscosity at extreme temps?

gradyex

Thanks for your imput Kevin. I will keep this oil in my car and change it every 4-5 k miles. I hate to keep bothering you with questions but I have a couple more that id like some feedback. If anyone else wants to chime in feel free. Is it normal to spot a few metal shavings either in your oil filter or the bottom of your oil pan taken from the crank? I ask because I have spotted a few small metal shavings when I pour off the oil that I remove from the crank at the bottom of the tub. I couldn't find any in the oil filter. By a few I mean less than 10. It has not gotten worse over time. I had 2 samples sent to Blackstone and everything checked out as "normal". I wonder what percentage of cars with the GT1 engine are affected and how many failures are directly linked to this valvetrain noise? I do know that there are varying degrees of it in most cars but I guess I am referring to the ones where the noise is past what one would think is acceptable?

Macster

If the UOA finds no metal content in the oil then the fragments are simply debris/trash that is coming loose and falling/end up in the oil sump or in the context of a dry sump engine the crankcase.

That the pieces come out of the crankcase mean they were too large to be picked up by the scavage pump otherwise they would have been broken up and ended up fine enough (over time) to possibly raise the metal ppm count of the oil and to show up in the filter when you cut it apart. The pieces might have been in there since the engine left the factory but various factors have worked to move them close enough to the drain hole to be carried out by the draining oil.

I've been very busy lately and have lost the context of this thread but if your car's engine is running ok and not making any scary noises the metal means nothing. I'd not pull the engine and tear it down on just a few pieces of metal coming from the crankcase oil.

Be careful that you do not over react to the very real but very rare troubles that a few other owners have had.

Sincerely,

Macster.

Macster

Popular I don't know. My research is that it is not a common oil, one that is stocked on auto parts store shelves, at least here in the USA where I've looked.

I found one place that sells/ships it:

http://matrixsyntheticoils.com/store...reet_oils.html

In 20 quart cases, the oil is approx. $10/quart and that is not including shipping.

The oil is according to the Motul web site a Group V (ester) oil A40 (Porsche) approved.

http://www.motul-oil.co.uk/pdfs/synt...5W-40_(GB).pdf

BTW, while I have been too busy to take my 996 Turbo in for service before a vacation I had to postpone I did manage to find the time to buy 12 quarts of Mobil 1 5w-50 oil to use in my Turbo its next oil change.

Sincerely,

Macster.

Kevin

Gradyex, can you post your Blackstone results? Can you scan them and email them to me.

These engines should NOT be shedding metal at 20K. I would take a magnet and see if you have iron, lead or aluminum. This will give you a clue to where the debris is coming from.

Depending on your miles and engine noise you would be a canidate for Mobil 5W40 TDT. I would want more metal conditioners vs what is in the Mobil 0W40 and 5W50..

gradyex

Macster, I want to thank you for your detailed imput. I truely appreciate it. Kevin I will try and post my Blackstone results when I get a chance. I located the 2nd report and am looking for the 1st one. I am interested in getting your feedback as well.

gradyex

Kevin, here are my 2 Blackstone oil sample reports. One was taken in August 2010 and the other in Dec 2010. My cars milage is incorrectly listed as 25,000 miles in the first report. It should read approx. 22,500. I normally drive my car about 3500+ miles every 6 months or so. Your imput is appreciated.

E55AMG

trying to keep all this info. straight. would this be a fair recap for a higher mileage car (in my case 46+ and I plan on keeping the car):

If noise is present switch to 5-40TDT
no noise 5-50 is better than 0-40

I live in NY and see temps at both extremes.

Solo1111

In my case I live in Seattle but I am also interested to see if this is just an engine oil issue. I have researched online and called up a few Porsche service specialists. Almost all of them have said that it had something to do with the meshing of the intermediate gears. The weird thing about my case is that now that I have finally driven over 10k, sometimes I hear the noise and others not, compared to before where it was very consistent.

gradyex

Solo I didn't notice the noise until after 10-15k miles (I honestly don't remember but it was after the first year of ownership). It might have been there but it wasn't so apparent. If your noise is getting better thats great. If you do your own oil changes just keep an eye on the metal fragments in the oil filter. If you take your car to the dealer for an oil change have them give you the old oil filter back in a ziplock bag so you can cut it open and examine it later. Unless you cut it open you won't be able to see any metal shavings if they exist. My dealer told me the noise is "normal" and has something to do with one of the oil pumps inside the engine? Personally I find it hard to beleive that it is related to an oil pump or the mechanism that drives it? I wouldn't be too concerned at this point or there would be a lot of failures and this thread would be over 10 pages long by now. The noise is common but the failures aren't as far as I can tell. Others can chime in if they feel differently about this. Its not something one wants in a $150k car but the bottom line is if it doesn't effect the longevity of the engine I can live with it.

Kevin

E55AMG> do you have noise? I would make the switch to either 5W..

Gradyex, Thanks for posting the Blackstone results.. You can clearly see how as your stretch your oil that the additive are tappering off. Look at the moly, boron, phosphorus and zinc. It's like screwing a piece of gum.. It will soon turn sour. Your copper went "up" and above the Blackstone average. This is MOST likely your IMS bearings. I have posted pictures in the past what they look like. ALL of the turbo IMS bearing shed the top babbit layer to wear in to the copper layer.. It's the facts.. Depending on if you have a dual mass flywheel and a heavy foot with the clutch>> you can also be wearing the thrust bearing (main bearing set).. It's has been a concern that starting the engine with the clutch engaged puts alot of stress on the thrust bearing>no oil pressure at start up. When tearing apart earlier engines 930's and 3.2's that do not have the clutch/ign switch >thrust bearing wear is less..

Regardless of the oil fight, whether you like a blonde or red head > changing your engine oil sooner is the best wear prevention.

Solo, shoot me a email or call me. With regards to the noise, the engine has to warm up. One really needs to get out and walk around the back of the car. I can usually tell when I aproach the rear tires.. If I can hear the metalic/rattle at the rear tire, this is my above normal threshold meter.

Solo1111

Kevin, it seems the noise for my car does not exist at idle. It can be heard inside (esp if you take the rear seats) around the 1400-2000 rpms. I haven't really tried the warming the car up aspect but I'll definitely give it a shot tomorrow.

Solo1111

Thanks for the tip. Unfortunately I am not mechanically savvy and I am too scared to work on a 150k car myself. However, I'll ask my dealer to save the oil filer and take it for a diagnostic. However, I have been pretty lucky with the oil issue where so far my car has not been chewing up oil like some of the owners. My car's oil stay at a consistent level after my first two years of ownership (around 4500 miles at the time).

gradyex

Thanks Kevin for your feedback. All I can do is change the oil often, inspect the oil filter often, and drive the car. The TDT oil has helped tone down the noise a bit so I will keep it in for now. There is really nothing else I can do as Porsche calls the noise "normal". The car runs strong, hardly burns oil and besides the noise the engine has had no other issues. My factory warranty is up in a week but I have a good aftermarket extended warranty with Fidelity (Platinum coverage) for the next 3 years/36k mi. The plan is just enjoy the car and hope for the best. I love the sound of the GT1 engine (even with the stock exhaust), and I documented the noise with Porsche many times so its in the service files. If any one else has had the same issues and has logged a lot of miles on their GT1 engine please post and let us know. Thanks.

Kevinmacd

Hey get used to it! Even the 996tt make the noise. BTW the reason your 4S didn't do it is because it was an enitirely different design,. The IMS shafts in those are supported by a ball bearing at the flywheel side. You cannot compare the two engines! Apples and oranges.