bk_911

I've been haunting these forums a bit and right now I've been considering a 997.1 GT3 or a Cayman GT4. I've driven the GT4 so far which I loved, I'm about to drive the GT3 this week if schedules align.

On one hand you have the GT3 which I've lusted for since the 997.1 came out. On the other hand I drove a GT4 and came away more than impressed. I almost bought one but was too late on a deal.

I've driven FWD, and AWD cars on track. Never rwd or rear engined. So one of my major concerns is learning to drive a GT3 properly and safely on track (and in canyons).

I'd love to hear your personal stories and tips on how to drive these cars the way they were mean to be driven, but at the same time not to make any moronic mistakes.

I plan to drive the heck out of the GT3 if I get it. It definitely won't be a museum piece.

NAM VET

In our prior Superformance Cobra Replica, which my son and I drove thousands of miles on tracks, from VIR to Topeka, we learned one really important driving trait, which is absolutely transferrable to now driving our GT3. That is to always avoid abrupt inputs to the car, to be always smooth with brake and throttle inputs. To not stomp on the brakes, and not jump on the gas, or suddenly lift off the throttle. I had a fast run yesterday on a very rural winding road, and once again was astounded at how secure our GT3 was over bumps and ripples, and around off camber sweepers and over whoop de doos. I sometimes think a GT3 is such a perfect sports car for winding roads because it is a relatively narrow, small car, and not wide and fat like an R8, or 'Vette, or GTR. The narrow body of the Porsche just gives a driver more room to use all of a lane or road course, and the driver is not sitting down so far in the car, allowing greater vision of the road in front of the car. Something that greatly helps a driver control a car is steering feel, and the sense a GT3 driver has of what is happening where the rubber meets the road is superlative.

There are fast, expensive sports cars nowadays which have a multitude of electronic handling aids, the latest Ferrari's come to mind, that can make an average driver really quick around an apex, and the later GT3's have some of these computer controlled assists. But an earlier GT3, a 996 or a .1 or .2 997 variant really do need the driver's decisions and actions to extract the maximum from the car.

Then too, GT3's are unusually reliable, dependable cars, and just thrive on track time. Porsche made very few compromises when they set the specs on the cars. There are faster cars on a track than any of the GT3 versions, but when a driver pulls into the pits, or reaches the destination cafe at the conclusion of a fun run, he or she knows that they, not the car, did it.

Make no mistake about it, any GT3 is a formidable machine on a back road or a race course.

All the best....

NV

bk_911

Great post again! Smooth inputs. Very good advice. I will remember that. I try to do that anyway but not always with success.

What about this "oh ****" situations like when a deer pops out?

Drew_K

I've tracked a FWD car a decent amount (Focus ST), as well as instructed quite a few FWD and AWD folks. You'll have to unlearn some habits, at least from what I've seen in typical FWD drivers including myself. With FWD, lifting fixes a lot of issues due to the understeer that FWD cars inherently have. That isn't usually the right answer with RWD. With FWD, you can also charge into a corner with too much speed, pitch it in, lift, and the car will make it through as long as you keep the wheels pointed in the direction you want to travel (all of this within reason). That's asking for a spin with RWD.

You'll figure it out - just take your time. Next time you track a FWD or AWD car, try to pay attention to exactly what you're doing when the car gets a little out of shape (e.g., am I lifting, countersteering, both?). It'll help with the transition to RWD, particularly rear engine RWD.

audipwr1

More throttle = more fun any moment past the apex

The faster the lift before the apex = more rotation

Trail braking = fastest way but also most challenging for most regular folks. I glide into apex and power out in all but low speed turns for this reason

No FWD or AWD car in existence I know about is as fun as either the two cars you mentioned

997s07

You have to respect the car. The .1 is a handful. One thing that complicates the driving is the high RPMs the car has to be in. So you are likely not to be in high gears, usually 2nd or 3rd. In canyon country there is limited room for error. I would advise not to go there until you "know" the car. A buddy of mine lost his car and a lot of brain cells about 6 months ago in the canyons - not because he couldn't drive (a former DTM test driver), but because there was no room to get the car back.

The above said, go in fast, brake hard, get on the throttle halfway to the apex - but not too much throttle, increase the throttle as you pass the apex. That method, I found to be the fastest. Try these methods on the track first.

ngng

honestly, it's not a great learners rwd car. respect the car and drive within your limits. the car is very easy to drive "quickly" which also means you can get into a lot of trouble, really fast. the .1 doesn't have stability like the .2 and the .1 traction control is a joke. like others have said, be smooth (smooth doesn't necessarily mean slow)

AudiOn19s

my .02

When learning what's most important is you get to the gas for maintenance throttle (to balance the car) almost immediately after turn-in.

Learn to drive the car off of the available rear grip past apex.

Gas fixes everything (well pretty much)

Trail brake on entry to be fast as the last skill set you learn

bk_911

I'm in the SFBay area, and would definitely want instruction from a seasoned expert if possible. I've run my previous track days with HOD. They've been great and I've had a lot of good instruction from them.

I also hear the porsche club is good. Do they have instruction as well?

ChrisF

Yes. Highly recommend PCA GGR events for that.

Also highly recommend getting the car setup properly because the difference between a good setup and a bad one is night and day. I think when setup right, the car is nowhere near as difficult to drive as some would have you believe. The key is having a healthy respect and sneaking up slowly on the car's potential.

ShakeNBake

^^this

You can think of it this way - if there is weight on or transferring to the rear it's happy. Unhappy everywhere else, especially before the apex, and especially pulling weight off the rear. Under power you lose steering. You have do everything very deliberately and accurately, and coming off the throttle anything more than a slight modulation is never the right answer, even when sideways, if you want to retain control. Another way to say it is that you need to commit early, and be brave. Late apex, get on the power early, and be more aggressive that you are comfortable with on the power. You will carry a lot of power-on slip angle, it's normal.

In the canyons, it will really bite you if you drop throttle to correct a corner exit...very easy to loop it even at low speed. Virtually all mishaps I've seen in GT3s are lifts when people panic. Learning to stay on the gas is like forcing yourself bungie-jump. Took me forever to get comfortable, and eventually everything will come so naturally to you that you will use it as a weapon vs. avoiding it trying to kill you. GT3 is probably the most difficult to drive fast modern car. It's why you hear so many camry drivers say "Doowd I passed a GT3 this weekend".

And it's why they made the 991 a cream-puff to drive. Too many people whining about being passed at DEs I'd guess.

bk_911

Great posts guys.. The scenario I'm most concerned with is something like this:

Say you're charging into a blind corner, perhaps one that's over a crest (think sonoma, thunderhill and the like). Once you pop up over the hill you get that butt pucker moment where you realize someone spun out up there.

Now you're in the situation, where you've scrubbed speed off like a good boy, your entry speed is perfect, you're feeding throttle back in, but you have to panic stop to make sure you don't hit an object in the road.

What is the best course of action there? I suppose this could also be a canyon scenario.

Logically I'd think you'd want to get the car pointed as straight as possible first then slam the brakes on. Thoughts on that type of scenario?

ngng

on the track? watch your corner workers...

on the street? avoid the obstacle, then brake. and slow the hell down

audipwr1

My view is that these cars are too fast to be fun on the street period

997s07

^^^ same here. Damn stressful correcting every freaking 2 minutes.