sirtom

Porsche's ED program just sucks. You'd think being a sister company of Audi they could implement a useful program that doesn't further rip off their high dollar customers.

I'd do ED on a Ferrari before considering it on a Porsche.

Btw, a 3 to 4k USD surcharge just for Gt3 insurance for 2 weeks or less is plain absurd.

Larry Cable

I do not believe the charge is merely for the insurance coverage.

sirtom

Pasting an Email from PCNA to me directly, sent yesterday. Highlighting the interesting parts in orange and red.

<<
European Delivery is available on all of our models, including GT3 and any
future variations. Because the vehicles are not established yet, I can not
tell you if European Delivery on that specific vehicle will be a zero
dollar option, but any charge will be to cover the additional insurance
cost for the higher liability vehicle. The VAT is at the dealer's
discretion to collect from the customer, as they are accepting liability
should the vehicle not return. We always recommend every dealer collects at
least a deposit, if not the full amount, of the VAT to protect themselves.
I hope this helps answer your questions, please let me know if there is
anything else I can assist with.

Best regards,

xxxx yyyyy [omitted name]
Porsche European Delivery

Porsche Cars North America
980 Hammond Drive, Suite 1000
Atlanta, GA 30328
>>

sirtom

As an update, PCNA ED department just wrote me further a few minutes ago and stated the following:

<<
The European Delivery option is free for customers. Yes, the dealers are
charged for the option, but they are also incentivised on the back end to
make up for this cost, and then some. However, it is our policy not to be
involved with pricing negotiations between the customer and their
dealership, which is also why there is never a discount on our models for
European Delivery or otherwise. The BMW discount still affects the margin
on the car for the dealership so they are technically still paying for your
European Delivery, it's just advertised differently. [...]
>>

Larry Cable

sirtom

And for anyone still tuned in or wondering, my response was:

<<
[...]
The base price of the GT3 jumping from $106k to $130+ from the 997 to 991 is already bad enough. I'd like to do a Porsche ED, but this year I have decided to do a BMW ED on a M235i manual. I will get 90% of the experience I'd get in a Porsche, and 95% of the fun. I can still take the car to Hockenheim and the Nuerburgring, have insurance, plates, return shipping, redelivery, and I get a free track day stateside at BMW's facility in Spartanburg - all for $39,000 USD. And it actually comes with a manual transmission, like my old GT3 used to have.

The VAT alone on a GT3 is $32k, almost as much as the entire $39k vehicle price of the M235i. I love the GT3 but with the aggressive new pricing, less friendly ED program (than competitors), and charging customers VAT (even if it's not direct, it is through recommended policies), it makes no sense for me to order one.

I certainly don't mean to get on your case personally, as some of these issues have to do with pricing and features, but I'm hoping this message will get relayed to your management for them to consider making more consumer friendly changes.
>>

Larry Cable

You do realized that the VAT is a deposit in escrow, that will be returned to you once the car has left Germany?

I do however agree with you regarding the Porsche scheme, it sucks compared to BMW which I have also done a couple of times before too ...

enjoy the M235i ... or maybe even an M4?

sirtom

Yes but still - shouldn't they trust the customers enough to 'front' the VAT for them with this price of car? I'd understand this policy if it was a 'regular' problem for ED customers to go rogue and sell the car in Europe, sneak home without the car, and not export it (in this case, 19% VAT would be owed to the German government). However, this doesn't happen, and the EUR isn't so much stronger than USD now to justify that type of transaction these days anyway. I understand these policies from when Porsche was small, but now with VW AG at the helm (with their deep pockets), these policies really should disappear soon IMO. Hell - I'd be buying a Cayman S or Boxster S for no reason just to have on this upcoming Germany trip if Porsche offered such a (more reasonable) program.

Yes - I'll be driving the M235i there, and getting an M4 at the Ring for a couple days. Will try to make it on Spa & Hockenheim if at all possible. It will be my 6th Nuerburgring trip, my favorite place on earth - I cannot wait! I'm always happy to be there regardless of the car I'm in - the Ring is an extremely special and magical place on earth!

Larry Cable

I totally agree with you, it is ridiculous, especially when neither BMW, Audi nor MB require such for their ED programs. Its insane!

I'm a big Ring fan also, been going there since 2001 I love it! - it is unique... have a bier and steak on a stone for me at the Pistenklause!

p.s
A cautionary tale; I rented an E92 M3 from a local ring source, and crashed it at Spa (pilot error) and ended up "buying" the car (35,000eu deductable) so be prepared for the worst case scenario, none of us are infallible!

have a safe trip and enjoy the M235i

globed

I've done ED twice with Porsche (993 and 997 GT3) and once with BMW. I was also miffed about the fee and the VAT deposit. No matter, I wouldn't have passed it up.

While other brands tend to have discounts, they have frequently excluded their top guns (M, AMG) or removed the discount for those models.

The highlight for me is the gentlemen who factory delivered my 993 back in 1996 was still working there when I factory delivered my GT3 in 2010... And remembered me.

The factory itself is far more automated now, so not interesting in itself. Restaurant is nice. Museum is much more interesting now. The best bit is planning thousands of miles across Europe.

Not that anyone asked, but I would personally stay away from November-April due to winter tyre regulations and fabulous mountain passes being under snow. July and August too crowded, so May/June and Sept/Oct are best IMHO.

If it helps, just convince yourself you are getting a great deal on renting a GT3 without mileage charges and she'll be broken in when she lands in the states... And the holes in your front bumper are free of charge

surlynkid

When I did ED on my M car, it was 7% discount. That was about 2 years ago. It was an incredible deal. I only spent the weekend. I think the manufacturers make more profit on this then meets the eye. They are now having a used car imported versus a new car. I think the tariffs have to be lower on a used car. The VAT thing is bullsh!t. What am I going to do - sneak it back to the US myself? Of course not. I am going to use their free boat ride and then pick it up in Spartanburg for more fun. I had a deposit down on an M4, but cancelled when I heard they were not going to give ED pricing on that model. I got the GT3 instead. Turns out people are getting the 7% ED on new M4s.

Alan C.

I did three Euro deliveries in the 80's. All discounted and with four weeks of insurance. The last was a 3.2 Carrera and it included dinner,a hotel and breakfast on the day of arrival. Great tours of the factory and the old museum. I'm pretty sure I hit the sweet spot. Fantastic memories.

crgkart

I found Porsche's program is reasonable enough to do the European delivery and go pick my Cayman GTS up in Leipzig. Porsche provides me with 16 days free insurance, factory tours, museum ticket, 3 courses meal, an hour track time with an instruction in a similar car that I bought. The 19% VAT is fully refunable once the car is back so it really doesn't bother me one bit.

BTW, Jamie is awesome to deal with.