FTS

I buy a case of Motul each year, I have few bottles left from last year that I am going to use it up, then give SRF a go and see the differences.

gmgracing

Gentlemen

We have swithced to Endless on our sprint and endurance cars and have had great success/

Coniserable testing has been done and we find that brake fluid is better than the SRF which as been regarded as the best on the market for years.

Other brake fluids do not even come close..


Here is some info:

Endless RF650 was tested by several motorsports teams, and brake manufacturers in Europe and was found to have better pedal feel, the highest dry boiling point (RF650 started to boil a bit higher temp. than what was rated on the can so the Endless rating is actually a little conservative).

Was tested against SRF, Pro-Speed RS683, Brembo and AP Fluid in late 2010.
It is also the official brake fluid of Mercedes-GP F1 team, factory equipment in the Porsche 997 Cup cars & RS-Rs and is regarded by many in the know as the best brake fluid on the market today. It is now alsoused exclusively by GMG on all our cars.



We have the fluid in stock if anyone needs any and can also install at the shop.

Carrera GT

You could bleed out using a powerbleeder.
Sounds a bit like you're used to a car with glazed pads and rotors.
There's numerous posts on RL re. RF650 and it's well regarded. Some say it improves feel.
The flexible lines to the calipers aren't going to contribute to feel on the street.

You could check for a kinked hard line -- that will contribute to a soft pedal because pressures don't change as quickly and pistons don't retract properly. Unlikely, but not impossible.

I'd be curious to hear your opinion if you did a complete flush/cycle/bleed with RF650. Note that you need a service tool to cycle the ABS to flush its pump.

Carrera GT

That's bizarre. Do you have a part number or a photo? Presumably the work order shows the part number that had to be replaced. I wonder about this sort of thing when the cars need frequent pad swaps.

How long before we go to liquid cooled brakes?

Terry L

I don't have either but they are ceramic rings in an ivory color which fit on the tips of the pistons. The shop which did the rebuild showed me a new sample from a rebuild kit.

Carrera GT

Fair enough. I'm going to do a "nut and bolt" on my car next week before its next track day, so I'll add that to the checklist. I'll ask the dealer for part numbers.

jlr

My 93 RS America was my standard for brake feel, though it's possible the rotors/pads were glazed. Naturally, it did not have the stopping power of the GT3, but it felt less boosted. I will say that the GT3 brakes are excellent for heel-toe, so maybe I'm just trying to find fault. Perfect cars leave us with little to tinker with. I did, today, order SS lines and could try the RF650 as well. Thanks for the replies.

Carrera GT

I had a '94 RSA. Standard Carrera brakes, but never seemed inadequate. I like the pedal feel of the 996 and 997 GT3's -- it's just the rotor durability and cost that's a catastrophe.
If you want to get a feel for an unboosted brake pedal, try to Ariel Atom or the Radical ... both require physical training I think for the driver to be able to modulate on the threshold for more than a 20 minute session.

Brakes have become a weakness for Porsche and something I'm annoyed to find myself having to "fix" now, when it wasn't broken in the previous 911's.

jlr

Yeah, funny thing that the 93 RSA/C2 brakes to me seemed better about town, solid feel and sensitive, but probably less adept once you really got into them. Then, I had a 94 RSA with Big Red conversion, as I said, that had a C2 m/c -- very mushy just driving around but incredible stopping power when required.

Carrera GT

Yep. I was "advised" to "go big reds!" but as I spoke with people, they said you really needed the RS caliper on the rear, and the Pagid black pad on the rear and yellows on the fronts if you run sticky tires ... but with more piston area, you'll need to push more fluid so upgrade the master and the bias will be adjusted by the pads ... and it did more, but only in terms of fade and, and, and ... one of those things on the RSA where I realized that the car was not the weakness and the brakes weren't limiting the performance ... : ) ... so instead, in '96, I got my first ever corner balance which completely changed my understanding of what matters in a car for an amateur driver and I was at the beginning of learning ...

jlr

I know, it's never as easy as it sounds! Every little change leads to a host of new issues. I should have gotten it by now that the car is much better than me. I'll remember that when I drive the GT3 to the office tomorrow...

jlr

Just an update about the SS lines and fluid. Today, my mechanic and bud installed the lines and Endless brake fluid, over the weekend had the Sharky bypass installed also. At any rate, during the flush he did notice some bubbles (recent and first DE in the car w/ stock fluid a few weeks ago). I had complained about soft pedal, but now can say that it is firm and sits rather high, more difficult for heel-toe but appropriate for a GT3 I think. I am pleased, and am very picky when it comes to "feel" -- steering, suspension, brake, or otherwise. It sounds great too. I have to go out of town on business, but can't wait to drive it more when I get back.

TrackDays247.com

Rare is the occasion that on a new Porsche where non-OEM brake lines will make any difference....

jlr

Agreed. I think the difference is the fluid -- firmer than new, much firmer than after first DE.

jlr

Though better, I still find the PCCBs a touch unresponsive around town. When I get out in the twisties, and put some heat into them, they are great. They do seem to require more pressure, but modulate well, are precise. The brake pedal height changes a bit, higher when cold and lower when in use. Never noticed that before on other cars. A new experience -- sometimes I like them, and at others, I think I'm going to switch them for steel.