Alan Smithee

http://www.autoblog.com/2010/04/20/s...-ring-running/

C'mon, guys...spill it! You know who you are...

Carrera GT

I don't know that anyone knows much more than all the speculation out there already.

I just hope:

1. Sensible price
2. Not parts bin engineering
3. RS suspension, SC/TC.
4. Not an end-of-model "special"

Tacet-Conundrum

Of course it's going to be an end-of-model "special". Unless they do the sensible thing and sell them after the next generation comes out at the same time.

Wonder if it is going to retain the 3.6 engine?

Carrera GT

Speculation seems to be it will be the new "Turbo" engine. There have been years when Porsche had three and even four "obsolescent" models on the same showroom floor. That might fly in some parts of the world, but hell, look at their current line-up:

Panamera
Boxster
Cayman
Cayenne (old-new)
Cayenne (new-new)
911 (13+ models)

918 (rumors and prototype)

So if you are a dealer wanting to make money and sell weeks and months of inventory, you need the factory to drive deals with incentives alongside buyers comparing the 2012 with the (then) "old model specials" ... me ... if I'm asked to pay $200K for a "special" GT2RS and I already know Porsche has a 918 prototype, I want the 918 and I fear the financial consequences of having a 2011 GT2RS just a year later when it's already looking like chopped liver compared to the 2012 Carrera with whatever changes have made the "old" cars look as distinctly old as the factory seems to think is necessary to sell the new car and suddenly the 2011 cars are seeing the same 30% discounts from new and you almost wish Chevrolet sold 911s ... :|

There's always going to be the case in favor of waiting for the next great thing and there's always the case in favor of just getting what you want to drive now and enjoy. The factor that balances those two cases is money. Cost. If the factory raises the cost of ownership of the GT3RS to the same level they asked of the normal GT2, well, the market has spoken and the car won't sell.

With the recent introduction of competition from McLaren in the sub-$200K price range for "super car" vehicles, I fail to see how Porsche can be so blind or so stubborn as to assert that the "looks like a base Carrera" GT2 can possibly compete at $200K+ when it's really a 2005 model appearance (give or take LED tail lights) and it doesn't stack up in terms of technology or specifications (power, dual clutch transmission.)

GT3

Agreed. Even if the GT2RS has PDK, for $200K, I'd rather have the MP4-12C.
Or just buy a 2008 dry sump GT1 engine GT2 for 40% less

Carrera GT

Maybe I'm being too hard on the GT2RS, it's a niche super car with a "we drive these cars" owner, which is not necessarily the same as the other $200K cars (say Lamborghini or Mercedes.) But if you take Mercedes for comparison, the new SLS is a helluva a lot of car and I fully expected it to have another insane SLR price only to find it's under $200K. I think Mercedes is saying they've read the market and realize the buyer expects a lot more car and a lot less price.

Conversely, with the 458 Italia, I think Ferrari has read their market and said they're happy selling 50% fewer cars and commanding huge premiums ($250K to $300K "entry level" mid-engine car.) I've scratched my head looked at the patently grotesque F-bomb 458 and I think there's method to the madness. For starters, Ferrari has lost their way -- they have a product line-up that was envisaged and built five years ago (the California, the 599) and they thought the luxo-barge was the way forward. But the global depression hit hard and Ferrari had to devise a plan to deal with deeply underwater resale values (something Ferrari rarely has to contend with) as well as planning for future models with the same elite niche in the market where their secondary market was even stronger than their primary new car sales -- this has been the golden thread of Ferrari buying for a couple of decades, but it was cut by the economic collapse, so they've had to face the challenge of reconnecting the secondary market to the new cars to enable the new car buyers to afford their lavish indulgence and largess to the dealer. I don't think Ferrari will succeed with this first attempt in the 458, but I do think the have to try and try again, or they're sunk. How long before a VW Ferrari if they fail? I have little doubt that Fiat management had to go to their board with a contingency plan for Ferrari given the impact of a prolonged global wealth collapse -- something that didn't include withdrawing from Formula 1! I think phase one of that plan was to consolidate on low volume, high premium new vehicle sales while they balance supply and demand to resurrect the secondary market so as to have a viable sales cycle to draw in new buyers for their new vehicle sales. This would also go some way towards explaining why their product line-up is so broad. A Maserati SUV ("Kubang") becomes a possibility again ... : )

Jon70

I agree, especially on the MP4-12C.

cgomez

Well, the regular GT2 MkII will already have the wider front track ala Cup/RS:

http://axisofoversteer.blogspot.com/2010/04/beast.html



No one has seen a GT2 RS (yet?), but the standard GT2 MkII just seems a mild improvement over the MKI if it "only" has 550hp (any tuner can safely bump the MkI GT2's power to 600hp without having to add additional cooling).

However, I would still consider a newer GT2 for daily driving (and will not buy another MkI GT2 b/c it would be a waste of another 3 years of exactly the same car). I use my car through the winter (w snow tires) leave it at the airport for up to 3-4 days and is 100% reliable ALL the time. Just not sure if the other supercars are up there yet in terms of reliability and usability .

I'm hoping the McLaren becomes a real alternative to P-cars in terms of reliability and usability, or the same for the 458 but I agree that Ferrari is focusing on much lower volumes and fatter margins, so not sure if the value will be there....

TTurbine

+1

savyboy

MP4-12C...ummm....so tasty....

+1

NJ-GT

Porsche is going to have an even harder time charging $200k+ for the 2011 GT2.

Sales for the 2008 GT2 and 2009 GT2 were horrible, at the time where Scuderias were selling in the $450k-$499k, no SLS AMG, no F458 no MP4-12C.

A new 997.2 GT2 will have a hard time to leave the dealer's showroom at a price tag of $200k+, when F458, Scuderias, MP4-12C, LP560/4, SLS can be in a very similar price range.

If you're fortunate enough to know the trade-in value of a pristine 2008 GT2, most likely you will stay away from buying another one.

Tacet-Conundrum

GT1 for sure; this is why I wonder if Porsche is going to keep the 3.6L motor? Of course there are those of us in the know to want the car with that motor in it. You would think Porsche would keep that motor for that reason. But who knows with what they have been pulling lately. As already mentioned above when do you pull the trigger? I came within an inc of getting an 997.2 TT but then I saw the next generation 911; it was over in that instant!

Like I said many times before since I was younger, when I first saw the 993 TT I said if I could ever own a Turbo that would be the one. Then the 996 came out and I said the same about it. Then the 997.1 then the 997.2; said the same thing about both of those. Now the 998/991 (whatever the internal name will be) looks like it will be the one.

Only difference from back in the 993 TT I could only dream about it. It's been realistic since 2007! Came close a few times with test driving used 997.1s but my better half always tells me to buy new so we can collect the car from Germany. I think she just wants to take a trip to Europe.

I always thought the GT2 was over-priced; especially since there is less technology in it. Compared to the standard TT that is!

The only way they will put a PDK in the GT2, let alone the GT3, is if they are Track proven. Since I don't really follow Porsche racing I cannot confirm if they have a track ready PDK? Can you imagine how much it will cost to replace the clutch plates in a PDK?

tcsracing1

i cant see the benefits of the RS version of a standard GT2? The GT2 is already pretty much on par with a RS body if im correct?

if they make a GT2 RS, then what? a Caymen RS? Boxster RS??

devalues the RS name like when chevrolet began using "SS" on everything.

rodsky

Plus a Turbo S is not that far short of $200K as it is.

allegretto

I can take just about any Porsche from the showroom to the track and beat the pi$$ out of it all day. Yes there is maintenance and such, but a well-maintained 911 is just about bulletproof

y'all want Mc Larens now? seems as though they have an awful lot to prove before they are interchangeable with a Porsche.

whatever...