Sweeper

[QUOTE=Salespunk;7016198]I read this as well. I'm suprised no one is talking about the cancellation in 7 years after the model cycle ends, and the Cayenne is ending too.
Also said something about a flat 8 caymen super car. Sounds like a new CGT huh. Sorry to hijack this thread.

I liked the 4 door, but would never buy one.

supercup

I agree the car is a design failure, like the last 7 series - utility/function over form (ala the new Aston Martin Raptide sedan, now that is a great looking car). However it is lilkely not a failure as a car, if you can get over the design (most won't). The car is very functional, more so than my M5 with more room, decent rear leg room and more space for stuff etc... A Mercedes S it is not, but I don't want a car that big or that drives with that type of feel.

I drove both the S and the Turbo last week and can say this is the first sedan I have ever driven (besides the Audi RS6 ala 2003) that I would consider buying instead of an M5 as a daily driver. The car handles very well, it much more luxurious than an M5 and the Turbo simply hauls @$$. The S make nice motor sounds and is pretty fast and the pdk is much better than the M5 SMG other than the backward shift buttons and the steering feel is very good (but not as good as my 06 M5).

I would not buy one until they get thru the 1st year teething problems. But after that I might have to give a Turbo a go. But if the next M5 comes and supercedes it at a (most likely) lesser price I won't make a change. But given the general dislike for the design a used Turbo might be in my future, the depreciation is likey to be very painful if you buy new.

The Cayenne and the Panemerra don't really fit for Porsche, but were needed to keep the brand seperate. Now that VW owns them they have other brands that can offer these cars, so they can get the benefit of all the Porsche development costs and technology and improve their line in other brands with revamped versions of these cars.

They can also move the Porsche brand back to sports cars and racing and move it up the price ladder if they wish, which I suspect they will. But you never know what VW will do, maybe they will simply drop the S and 4S, keep the Turbo and the Cayenne Turbo S, move the price way up and simply make them image cars, that offer the best of what you can get in that type of vehicle, they then will not compete with any other vehicles they currently offer in other lines.

JCM

MJSpeed

First off don't put words in my mouth. I'm not comparing it to the S class or 7 series, you are. However, you can't sit there and tell me the Panamierda looks as good as those two. Compare it to upcoming Aston Martin Rapide or even a Quattroporte. Heck even Lambo's 4 seater looks better.

I'm going to call bull**** on your statement that you only car about one perespective. If that were the case, where's your Gumpert? That sounds more like an argument to convince yourself as to why you're buying the Panamierda.

You know, I may be so inclined to accept that argument when discussing sports-cars, but not a four sedan. Sure I, along with many car enthusiasts want their 4-dour saloons to perform, that's why the M5, S8, Quattroporte Sport GT, S 63 and others exist. It's also the reason why Porsche, Lambo, Aston Martin and others are joining the fray...the only problem is that when it comes to design, Porsche utterly failed! It's a perfect example of why most car companies' CEO's should stay the **** out of the design studio.

And I disagree, after 40+ years of evolution, the 911's design is beautiful!!

allegretto

..whoa, hold on, too much caffeine

you can "call BS" if you like, but to mean something you'd have to have a clue about me, which you don't.

the Panamera's chief competition is the 7 and S. Lambo and AM sedans cost what? Porsche did not aim for the Lambo or AM as i see it.

finally, i too consider the 911 "beautiful" (though many did not at first, did they?) but it doesn't "...this car does it for me in every way..." actually no one car "does it for me in every way". which car does for you?

MJSpeed

Which car does it for me in everyway?

911 GT3RS
Carrera GT
F40

There are others but these I've driven and therefore came to mind.

MJSpeed

I completely agree.

rickg87

I like my Pontiac G8 GT for my daily sports sedan. For 30k new what a car. I put 3k into full suspension upgrade and it drives somewhere between a 5 series and an M5. Not as solid of course but loads of fun. 360HP. Tons of torque. Huge back seat and trunk.
And I get many compliments on it. Also, pretty exclusive. There aren't many around.
Sorry, I know this thread is about another car.

allegretto

so, "does it for me in every way" apparently has virtually nothing to do with being reliable daily transportation for you and your family.

it is clear to me that;

1) we have differing definitions of that expression
2) your threshold for discomfort on the street on a regular basis is far higher than mine
3) i'm severely confused by the shifting sands of your point since the Lambo, A-M,Maser, M-B and Beemer are not on that list yet you attack the Panamera for not being on the list.

so, i'll grant that the Panamera is not a *****-out, no compromise performance car, but methinks you're suffering from selective enforcement of the rules. are you a member of the current Administration?

SpeedGeek

I'm a huge fan of the Panamera even though it's not a car I would consider buying - big, heavy sedans just don't do it for me. But when I drove the Panamera I was just blown away by how good a driver's car it is compared to anything it competes with for 4-seat luxury. And I've driven most of them (although not the Mazer QP).

Regarding looks, well, flawed it may be, but I can't think of a single large sedan that looks really good anyway. They all look like ocean liners to me. Most of them look boring, the Panamera at least is different. And dynamically it's simply excellent.

Not sure what any of this has to do with a GT3, CGT, F40 or the Obama Administration??

allegretto

you're safe in SA

everything here is at risk of having something to do with the current Administration and its collectivist intentions

Nizer

Looks matter. That's why rich, middle-age guys get divorced and remarry younger women. Unfortunately as many know this is not always a wise strategy because....well...looks matter (to her too).

SpeedGeek

Wanna swap? We'll take Obama, you guys take Jacob Zuma for a few years. Let us know how that turns out.

allegretto

while i'll maintain that there is less difference between Obama and Zuma than some may think, you do have me there. at least O has never pubically called himself a Communist or Socialist.

OTOH, a trade may help us both since neither could readily carry the other's supporters. resulting in a much needed stalemate for both our Govs.

SpeedGeek

I'm a citizen of both countries, so I guess I can't win.

I have faith in Obama. His administration is certainly left of where I'm comfortable, but I believe in the man himself. That said, he sure has his work cut out. Too many problems to tackle with no good solutions. Plus, unrealistic expectations from his supporters and hatred from his detractors. Tough job. I hope America gets past the partisanship and finds a good way forward.

None of which has anything to do with the fact that the Panamera is a very good car to drive. Of course, if Obama turns out to be a really good socialist, maybe all Americans will get to own one. After all, that's how VW started out in the first place.

MJSpeed

I had this really long reply...it's just not worth it.

BTW what car does it for me is irrelevant, that's not what we're discussing.

I'll clarify it for you and I have not shifted on my point at all, I attack the Panamierda because IT IS a failure in design!

I also find it amusing that so many are smitten by these two facts, 1) that it has good/great performance and 2) it wears the Porsche logo. Then completely disregard it's awful looks with statements like, "I drove it today and after seeing it in person it's not so bad."

If you like it, that's perfectly fine. We all have different tastes. But to state that it, "doesn't photograph well" or "isn't so bad" is just simply coming up with excuses for it.

IF it sells well, then it's another win for the marketing/they'll-buy-anything-that-has-the-Porsche-name-on-it department.

This is way too much time spent in front of the computer and away from driving.