GT3 reliability
04-07-2008, 07:32 PM
#16
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two words: BOMB PROOF!
04-08-2008, 01:51 AM
#17
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What if you did it the right way and put on the correct pulley and bolt from the RS and properly torqued it and maybe even added a sprinkle of loctite. Is it still a problem?
What if it is 3 years adn 60K miles into ownership and you need to replace the clutch just because of normal wear? Isn't this a part that can be replaced with a part that is the same or comparable to stock? Do I also need to put the Perelli Corsa tires in the exact same sizes on again? Are 18" wheels and tires bad for the car? What about windshield wipers? Are the Autozone brand a no-no?
While my car was at the Porsche dealer having the LWFW and clutch and pulley and BOLT installed, our service rep just happened to be in town and asked about my car since it caught his attention. My mechanic, who is the lead mechanic at my dealer told him exactly what we were doing. He did not at all have a problem with it because it was being done right, with all the right parts. The only thing he told my mechanic to tell me is that my new RS clutch will be a little noiser at times.
have any problems whatsoever. As the revs dropped when coming to a stop, there were no issues with the idle, or even a hint of a possible stall because the ECU might not be ready for the quicker rev drops.
What if it is 3 years adn 60K miles into ownership and you need to replace the clutch just because of normal wear? Isn't this a part that can be replaced with a part that is the same or comparable to stock? Do I also need to put the Perelli Corsa tires in the exact same sizes on again? Are 18" wheels and tires bad for the car? What about windshield wipers? Are the Autozone brand a no-no?
While my car was at the Porsche dealer having the LWFW and clutch and pulley and BOLT installed, our service rep just happened to be in town and asked about my car since it caught his attention. My mechanic, who is the lead mechanic at my dealer told him exactly what we were doing. He did not at all have a problem with it because it was being done right, with all the right parts. The only thing he told my mechanic to tell me is that my new RS clutch will be a little noiser at times.
have any problems whatsoever. As the revs dropped when coming to a stop, there were no issues with the idle, or even a hint of a possible stall because the ECU might not be ready for the quicker rev drops.
watts group in LA got enough of these cars that can literally do their own R&D. sh*t, watt has enough GT3 in his garage to do his own R&D. i would take his words with some wt. my dealer now requires customer to sign off if they want to do lwt flywheel that warranty will be out, despite all OME porsche parts.
04-08-2008, 11:47 AM
#18
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A$900 for a front lip?!? Given that sort of cost level, I would track a Miata if I were in that situation, but that's not what you asked. And, since I am spouting off on questions that have not been asked, it is better to start track driving (if you this fits the case) in something slower and more forgiving to learn cornering and momentum driving--another plug for the Miata (in spec form, it is a fantastic track car). Of course, I did not take that advice from the beginning, when it was given to me, but I eventually followed it and to this day race a car I can cause to be unrepairable and have such an event not impact my kids' college funds. Sorry, too much coffee this morning.
18" wheels are great for the GT3 and increase your tire choice. 18" CCW 14 wheels cost under $3k, shipped, in the US. BBS race wheels are the other choice--for me. See the many threads on wheels, there are other choices.
How long consumables last depends upon how one drives and what tracks are being driven. Hoosiers and race compound brake pads last me a handful of days (2 DE events 4-5 days usually). Rotors last me 3-4 sets of pads. To assist you in qualifying that data point, my self assessment is that I am overly hard on brakes and tires, and not as fast as I think I am but I have fun out there.
Incremental clutch wear is inconsequential because of track driving.
You can and should spend a lot on safety equipment, as included on CJ Ichiban's list.
18" wheels are great for the GT3 and increase your tire choice. 18" CCW 14 wheels cost under $3k, shipped, in the US. BBS race wheels are the other choice--for me. See the many threads on wheels, there are other choices.
How long consumables last depends upon how one drives and what tracks are being driven. Hoosiers and race compound brake pads last me a handful of days (2 DE events 4-5 days usually). Rotors last me 3-4 sets of pads. To assist you in qualifying that data point, my self assessment is that I am overly hard on brakes and tires, and not as fast as I think I am but I have fun out there.
Incremental clutch wear is inconsequential because of track driving.
You can and should spend a lot on safety equipment, as included on CJ Ichiban's list.
chris,
not sure how it works but maybe you could get your reseller's license, so that you could get parts for cheaper...it might cost less in the long run than being gouged at 4x the cost of spoiler lips...I'm sure you could find some way to get care packages sent from germany or california (where all the good parts come from), just not sure what taxes are for importing.
here in the US, spoiler lips vary in price from 180-240 bucks, give or take.
parts of your car that the lawn-gnomes next to the track have been known to take off:
spoiler lips
undercar brake ducts - replace them with cup car ducts! and have them zip tied also
but honestly at 4-5 track days a year, the wear and tear is minimal on the car. mooty and I are doing 10x that I'm sure. whenever you do get the car, the first priority should be to properly bed in the brake system. I've posted a few times on how to do this to maximize rotor and pad life, as well as grip. look up the threads regarding brake fade, PCCB, etc. it makes a HUGE difference.
the main benefit of running 18" wheels is that you've got more tire selection, and they're less expensive than 19" wheels. of course you have to spend money on new wheels to do this, so depending on how many miles you actually put on the car, it may or may not benefit you. 18" tires are between 25% and 50% cheaper for whatever reason.
I personally run the 19''s, and just order tires ahead of time...partly because it's highly impossible to find them last minute (if you get a flat, per chance) and if you look at it like an expected cost, then the jillion dollars doesn't hit so hard.
not sure how it works but maybe you could get your reseller's license, so that you could get parts for cheaper...it might cost less in the long run than being gouged at 4x the cost of spoiler lips...I'm sure you could find some way to get care packages sent from germany or california (where all the good parts come from), just not sure what taxes are for importing.
here in the US, spoiler lips vary in price from 180-240 bucks, give or take.
parts of your car that the lawn-gnomes next to the track have been known to take off:
spoiler lips
undercar brake ducts - replace them with cup car ducts! and have them zip tied also
but honestly at 4-5 track days a year, the wear and tear is minimal on the car. mooty and I are doing 10x that I'm sure. whenever you do get the car, the first priority should be to properly bed in the brake system. I've posted a few times on how to do this to maximize rotor and pad life, as well as grip. look up the threads regarding brake fade, PCCB, etc. it makes a HUGE difference.
the main benefit of running 18" wheels is that you've got more tire selection, and they're less expensive than 19" wheels. of course you have to spend money on new wheels to do this, so depending on how many miles you actually put on the car, it may or may not benefit you. 18" tires are between 25% and 50% cheaper for whatever reason.
I personally run the 19''s, and just order tires ahead of time...partly because it's highly impossible to find them last minute (if you get a flat, per chance) and if you look at it like an expected cost, then the jillion dollars doesn't hit so hard.
Having read your replies, I did some investigating after initially freaking out at the price differences...
i) the salesperson was tripping, his price included installation supposedly... The lips cost $500 Aus and I would just do it myself. Still can't believe $400 to put it on...
ii) strongly considering importing parts from US if feasible. Enquired with customs today and duty taxes total 20% of cost. Then there's shippping... When the time comes I might get some suggestions off you guys in regards to your best local suppliers so I can enquire if they'd ship to Aus... May end up being very worth my while especially if they'd supply dumby invoice understating value of goods.
Mnorec- Thanks for the feedback on wear and tear items, it falls in line with what i was expecting for track. I considered setting up my 200sx as a track car,quite popular here but the cost of doing the neccesary brake, suspension, turbo etc,etc mods would have cost approx $20k... This is money i'd rather put towards the gt3 and I heath the warning about it being far less forgiving on the edge- i hope to not visit this region any time soon (fingers crossed). Thus, I will do it the safe way and use a pro instructor to learn properly and hopefully lessen the risk of a major incident.
C.J.Ichiban- your advice has been invaluable... thanks heaps!
Had a couple questions for you if I may? Thoughts or opinions you may have?
-You mentioned a roll cage, can I go without it safely for ther level of tracking I intend to do? I intend to order the gt2 buckets if available, can harnesses still be fitted if I don't have a cage to fix to?
- Wheel sizes- I think i'll run a set of 18's as the second set, what size wheels/ tyres would you think is appropriate? 245 on 9" front, 305 on 12" rear?
- Brake pads- Will stock pads cope for the few track days I intend to do? or should I use race pads (pagids)? Can I swap between the two and bed them in each time without harm to steel rotors (as I don't think race pads will be appropriate for continued non track use without squelling issues)? What's the norm considering it'll be more street use then track? I understand that usually its best not to change pads without machining etc or is this different?
Now, I'm hanging more than ever for an eventual announcement and subsequent delivery. I think the wait will kill me!
Regards
Chris
04-08-2008, 12:24 PM
#19
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My GT3 turned 18,000 miles on Sunday while on track At Barber Motorsports Park (it's 3rd track event). It's not leaked a drop in all that time, & has only needed gas, tires & oil changes up to this point. Seems pretty reliable to me.
04-08-2008, 09:06 PM
#20
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chris, at 5 track days per annum- you should be okay on mainly stock parts. Brake pads are relatively cheap compared to the cost of the car, and will definitely last you 4 or 5 sessions, depending on your track config and how well you bed them in...and how well you cool them down. I ran the stock pads for a really full day in italy (6 or 7 sessions) and had no issues.
Alignment will make the biggest difference in creating the proper handling attitude you deserve in the car. I personally run the GMG cup specs on my car, and can pass those along to you when appropriate. you can make the car behave really differently depending on how technical you want to get, but basically it's simple- you want good turn in, tons of stability at high speeds, and no body roll mid corner. how you get the car to do that...well that's different for everyone. I run around 2.2 deg of camber while some guys are 3.2+. I don't worry about being able to rotate the car in slow stuff- I can overpower the rear in 2nd gear to make it step out when I need it- like a big go-kart.
about tires...I run 19's so I can't comment. TONS of info on here from mooty and others.
GT2 buckets are cool seats for sure- but at the least you're gonna need a harness bar to fix the harnesses to. Most of us run a half cage, either the GMG one, the Porsche Tequipment one, or a custom fab'd one. Different strokes for everyone.
with all the hassle on parts, etc- how different is it if there is a non-invoiced mailing? lets say your american buddy sends you seat belts? lol.
Alignment will make the biggest difference in creating the proper handling attitude you deserve in the car. I personally run the GMG cup specs on my car, and can pass those along to you when appropriate. you can make the car behave really differently depending on how technical you want to get, but basically it's simple- you want good turn in, tons of stability at high speeds, and no body roll mid corner. how you get the car to do that...well that's different for everyone. I run around 2.2 deg of camber while some guys are 3.2+. I don't worry about being able to rotate the car in slow stuff- I can overpower the rear in 2nd gear to make it step out when I need it- like a big go-kart.
about tires...I run 19's so I can't comment. TONS of info on here from mooty and others.
GT2 buckets are cool seats for sure- but at the least you're gonna need a harness bar to fix the harnesses to. Most of us run a half cage, either the GMG one, the Porsche Tequipment one, or a custom fab'd one. Different strokes for everyone.
with all the hassle on parts, etc- how different is it if there is a non-invoiced mailing? lets say your american buddy sends you seat belts? lol.
04-08-2008, 09:07 PM
#21
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I'm glad I asked the question in this thread as all the favourable responses and straight up advice have put my mind at ease...
It has become evident that on the whole, these things are rock solid! There will always be the occasional one with issues. All I can say now is bring on a re-release Porsche because I'm hanging to get my hands on one more than ever... and dont give me a dud! lol
04-08-2008, 09:30 PM
#22
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Hi to all,
I am new to this forum and live in AUS... I have recently placed a deposit with my dealer for a 997 gt3 mkII . This is my dream car and unfortunately here in Australia they don't come cheap at approx $290k on the road... probably the sort of money you guys are paying for gt2s!!! None the less owning a Porsche has always been a goal and I intend to track it with some professional training etc.
Having read through the forums for the last little while, I have only one concern...Reliability! One of the reasons I have opted for the GT3 is for its suposed "bulletproof" reputation...Thoughts would be greatly appreciated as there have been conflicted reports of late in some threads. I am well aware of the RMS issue (which I can't believe hasn't been sorted) but what else am I to expect?
I currently drive a Nissan (sylvia in some countries) 200sx s15 (2lt turbo, 180kw, 1150kg) and whilst it doesn't even remotely compare in performance dispite fantastic acceleration (beaten a 996 carrera off the line till 120km/h before the 911 came back and pulled away) it has astounded me for reliability. It has 145000 km on the clock and is constantly driven like its stolen- abused to the crap!... Apart from regular servicing it has been nearly faultless- only cracked the rear crossmember assembly once (freak according to Nissan) but probably due to my constant clutch dumping @ 4000+rpm and the original clutch even went for 125k km. Tyres that should last 30+K are gone in 15-20k and that ain't from being ripped up either.
Lots of pointless info, I know, but the point is that this car has set the bar stupendously high for reliabilty and whilst the GT3 won't be abused in the same manner, is it good to go the distance? Will it be reliable? What should I realisticly expect because Porsche repairs certainly ain't gonna be cheap? Or will I be dissapointed after having spent 7 times the cost of the Nissan?
(FYI- Nissan hasn't been tracked and GT3 won't be a daily drive- weekender and track car)
Kind regards
Chris
I am new to this forum and live in AUS... I have recently placed a deposit with my dealer for a 997 gt3 mkII . This is my dream car and unfortunately here in Australia they don't come cheap at approx $290k on the road... probably the sort of money you guys are paying for gt2s!!! None the less owning a Porsche has always been a goal and I intend to track it with some professional training etc.
Having read through the forums for the last little while, I have only one concern...Reliability! One of the reasons I have opted for the GT3 is for its suposed "bulletproof" reputation...Thoughts would be greatly appreciated as there have been conflicted reports of late in some threads. I am well aware of the RMS issue (which I can't believe hasn't been sorted) but what else am I to expect?
I currently drive a Nissan (sylvia in some countries) 200sx s15 (2lt turbo, 180kw, 1150kg) and whilst it doesn't even remotely compare in performance dispite fantastic acceleration (beaten a 996 carrera off the line till 120km/h before the 911 came back and pulled away) it has astounded me for reliability. It has 145000 km on the clock and is constantly driven like its stolen- abused to the crap!... Apart from regular servicing it has been nearly faultless- only cracked the rear crossmember assembly once (freak according to Nissan) but probably due to my constant clutch dumping @ 4000+rpm and the original clutch even went for 125k km. Tyres that should last 30+K are gone in 15-20k and that ain't from being ripped up either.
Lots of pointless info, I know, but the point is that this car has set the bar stupendously high for reliabilty and whilst the GT3 won't be abused in the same manner, is it good to go the distance? Will it be reliable? What should I realisticly expect because Porsche repairs certainly ain't gonna be cheap? Or will I be dissapointed after having spent 7 times the cost of the Nissan?
(FYI- Nissan hasn't been tracked and GT3 won't be a daily drive- weekender and track car)
Kind regards
Chris
04-08-2008, 09:43 PM
#23
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Hey C.J.
I think that stock brakes it will be then... certainly will save the messing about for the half dozen track days a year that I'll be doing...
The help with alignment I would certainly appreciate when the time comes. You fellas seem to have so much more knowledge than the few people around here that track these things. I know exactly what you mean with changing the cars feel as I have done karting for a few years now myself and am forever messing with alignment to get it feeling and unloading right. It'll just be very different and harder for me to understand a car's feedback and what to do about it. I really appreciate your offer with alignment settings and would really like to take you up on that offer when the time comes... Therefore, please don't disappear off this forum as I won't be able to chat to you... You've been a great help...
As for the customs question, I asked exactly that and they said that the sender would have to declare a value for goods and if they thought it were understated they would base the duty on its likely retail cost(or that of something similar) that's available here... Therefore. it could go either way...
What I forgot to ask then was whether I would have to pay duty if it were a gift from a mate or family? lol... May need to re-ask the question at some point as the answer may be quite different...
Take care and keep having fun out there...
Chris
I think that stock brakes it will be then... certainly will save the messing about for the half dozen track days a year that I'll be doing...
The help with alignment I would certainly appreciate when the time comes. You fellas seem to have so much more knowledge than the few people around here that track these things. I know exactly what you mean with changing the cars feel as I have done karting for a few years now myself and am forever messing with alignment to get it feeling and unloading right. It'll just be very different and harder for me to understand a car's feedback and what to do about it. I really appreciate your offer with alignment settings and would really like to take you up on that offer when the time comes... Therefore, please don't disappear off this forum as I won't be able to chat to you... You've been a great help...
As for the customs question, I asked exactly that and they said that the sender would have to declare a value for goods and if they thought it were understated they would base the duty on its likely retail cost(or that of something similar) that's available here... Therefore. it could go either way...
What I forgot to ask then was whether I would have to pay duty if it were a gift from a mate or family? lol... May need to re-ask the question at some point as the answer may be quite different...
Take care and keep having fun out there...
Chris
04-08-2008, 10:20 PM
#24
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chris, I'll be around don't worry. you need to get someone to send you "depreciated and used parts"
that could be the best move!
"uh hey mate, I'll take that rollbar...can you rub some dirt on it, and box it up?" lol
that could be the best move!
"uh hey mate, I'll take that rollbar...can you rub some dirt on it, and box it up?" lol
04-09-2008, 12:48 AM
#25
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