fantasma

Thanks evereybody for all your suggestinons and ideas.

A few comments:

• I think the MB cars are not for me. Not sporty enougth. Maybe I'm just prejudiced... I'm not inte turbo cars either. I like the throttle adjustability of a high compression atmospheric car.
• The 997 GT3RS would definitely be an alternative, but I only like it in white - the other colours are OTT for me. Haven't seen any used ones in white in Sweden at all... Ordering a new one is not an alternative right now, although on a side note, I'm on the "pre-order" list for a new 997 GT3 Mk II MY09, if there will be such a car...
• If I choose a car with my heart I would go for the 360CS
• If I choose a car with my brain I would go for the 997GT3.
• The F430 would be somewhere in between. I'm looking at a car in Titanium grey that is quite discreet, for a Ferrari...

/fantasma

Nordschleife

Ferraris look great in Grigio Titanio, make sure you have yellow callipers and a cognac leather interior

R+C

cgomez

I believe only in the US there's such a hge premium for used Ferraris. It just doesn't make sense that a used 360 CS is at least $180K.

At the similar price (than the 997 GT3) I would go for the 360 CS. It might be slower around the track but would be awesome experience. Also, it is easy to sell if you dont like it much.

The 430 Scuderia would be amazing if you are one of the lucky few who is allowed to order one...

fantasma

I will not be driving the car in the Swedish winter anyway, although I like the idea of drifting a Gallardo in the snow...

The problem with the Gallardo is that it is a bit OTT. I test drove a yellow Gallardo and at every traffic light there were people taking pictures with their cell-phones. I only drove the Gallardo for less than an hour, but the handling felt really good. The car was very easy to drive, light clutch, light steering, etc. Coming from a 996 GT3 it felt much less physical, which is both a good and a bad thing.

/fantasma

fantasma

Interesting comment. The F430 I looked at was Grigio Titanio with the Crema (light beige) interior, sports seats and yellow calipers (CCM). My wife suggested that the cognac-colored interior of a nearby 612 Scaglietti would have suited the F430 better than Crema...
Nevertheless the F430 looked very classy and discreet, something that you can't say of a 360 CS Rosso Scuderia...

/fantasma

Nordschleife

Lamborghini also do some beautiful discrete colours.

I thought my preference would be for a grey Gallardo, and then I reaslised that when I am driving on the Autobahn, I want everybody to see me coming, so suddenly that bright yellow seemd a good idea.

When I get in a Lamborghini (apart trom the GT350 and 400), I accept that I am arsehole and enjoy it. Particulary in Germany, where arseholes thrive! I know you Swedes are more conservative, so perhaps a dark blue would be better!

R+C
PS I am in Britain at the moment, driving an interesting car is almost impossible, so much envy. A motor bike is much better

Nordschleife

Personally, I generally specify a 'tone on tone' interior, so Cognac with Anise leather (anise is a little darker than crema), the anise leather roof lining always looks great and gives a sense of spaciousness.

R+C

fantasma

I'm not really familiar with how the Ferrari interior options look, but the Grigio Titanio car had a combination of Crema and Black leather. The area around the instrumentation, dashboard, etc. where black. The roof was in Crema, though, giving a light interior.

/fantasma

fantasma

The Swedish allocation of 430 Scuderia is sold out, so that is not an option. The Scuderia would be stretching my budget anyway. It would also be hard for me to push a brand new Scuderia on the occasioanl track day - it's such an exclusive car. Maybe I'm just being a chicken...

/fantasma

Bob Rouleau

Is the Audi R8 an alternative?

fantasma

I've been looking at the R8. Unfortunately the Swedish allocation (once again) is sold out. I own an Audi S4 Avant and I like Audi, but the R8 is not really in the same league as say a F430, a Gallardo or a GT3. In my eyes it competes primarily with the Carrera (4)S.

The upside of course is that it is really discreet. It looks like a pumped-up Audi TT which is both a good thing and a bad thing.

The problem in Sweden is that there is a lot of envy. It is vey sad, but many people don't approve of exotic sports cars. They just presume that you are some sort of playboy or criminal...

/fantasma

Nordschleife

to be fair to the R8

its an alternative to a C2 or C4, rather than a GT3.

Two of us have driven the car so far and whilst its very nice, it just doesn't have 'it'. Enormously competent, but not enough power, and spoilt by tacky features, like that hideous side panel, stupid steering wheel 1950's shaped instruments, brain dead gearbox..... Somebody has gone round and smoothed all the edges off which is sad. In the early stages we were tapped by Audi to cemment on the car, both of us said 'keep it hard edged, do not soften it '. Well I doubt they considered that for more than five minutes.

The R8 bears the same relationship to a proper car as a boudoir grand does to a concert grand piano. As it happens, the boss (Winterkorn) agrees, he describes it as 'the car for our wives', although the Audi PR machine has worked overtime to cover that gaffe up.

To be fair to Audi, the demand for the kind of car the Pussycat Dolls drive is much greater than the demand for a proper car. So I expect them to be clogging Rodeo Drive real soon now.

Oh, and unlike most people we didn't much like the RS4 either, so just putting that engine in another chassis wasn't going to win our vote.

R+C

leslie

Sorry to hijack the thread fantasma but I have (semi) related experiences to share and a similar problem...

I am in Singapore where the demand and supply for these exotics are subtly different. I currently have a manual 04 Gallardo in silver which I drive daily. For me, the silver and a manual was the only way to go as I didnt want (or maybe just wasnt used to at that point in time) to have the attention of a brightly coloured in-your-face Lambo as a daily driver. After daily driving for the last 9 months, I think the manual Gallardo is perhaps the best kept secret. Light, progressive and most importantly not at all jerky, the manual transmission makes the car a real breeze to drive daily. I absolutely hate the jerkyness of the Gallardo E-gear. post 06 revisions have made a difference but still cannot hold a candle to the conventional manual. In town traffic, it is just difficult to drive the Gallardo E -gear smoothly. And silver greatly reduced the camera phone at every traffic light syndrome.

My current dillema is similar to fantasma's. I am thinking of making a change. For roughly the same money, I can switch from my 04 manual G into either a 04 360CS or a brand new 997 GT3RS. Usage will be the same. Daily driver during the week and the occassional cannonball run, track day toy on the weekends.

I am well aware that both are going to be significantly more hardcore than the current car but that is precisely why I want to make the change. For me, a short daily drive to work is significantly enhanced by driving something boderline civilsed.....(I know, am sick in the head!)

Any thoughts from the board? TIA!

Nordschleife

The manual gearchange in the Gallardo is excellent, one of the few cars where I immediately banged the changes home with the confidence one usually takes a couple of days to develop. Part of it lies in the balance of the lever.
If you are really sick go for the CS or the 430 Scuderia (the Scud), if you only have amild infection, then the GT3RS.
At some stage, you will have to realise that driving street cars on the track is unsatisfying and vice versa. At that point you will have a track car and a street catr and enjoy both sorts of driving much more.

R+C

fantasma

I agree completely. A year ago I had only one car, a 996 Carrera (with X51 Powerkit and X74 30 mm sports suspension) that I used for both street and track. I had three sets of wheels, winter tyres, street tyres and R-rated semi-slick track tyres. As you state, this wasn't satifying.

Then I bought the 996GT3 Clubsport as a focused track day tool and an Audi S4 Avant to transport my family: wife and 6 months old son. The problem I have is that it is hard to find the time to drive on the track so I don't use my GT3 - I've only attended two (!) track days during the last 12 months :-(. Now I want a sports car that I can use more often than that. It is a shame to have a GT3, a dream car in many people's eyes, collecting dust.

Living in central Stockholm, having three cars is not feasable/practical so I'm "forced" to have a combined "sunday morning drive" and track day car. As opposed to Leslie I will not use it as a daily driver. I actually have a 15 minute walk to the office.

Maybe I should just move out of town to a house with a large garage. Then I could rationliase a larger collection of single purpose cars... On the other hand I would spend at least an hour per day in traffic to get to the office.

Decisions, decisions, decisions...

/fantasma