TripleM

Anyone has experience with KW Club Sport?

85Gold

+1 I have Moton Club Sports on my M3 and they are awesome I had the whole suspension done by BimmerWorld as they race BMW's. They set the car up and all I have to do is make minor changes based on different tracks. I would have been lost from the start, ie spring rates, adj sway bars, adj shocks are way beyond my ability if they weren't at least dialed in from the start.

Peter

mooty

not in the same league. not even on the same planet.

frafoss

The reason why I ask is because I do about 20-25 track days a year, but since this is my only car I also need the suspension to give some comfort on daily driving also.

Are the Motons to track focused for my use? I'm thinking of the Motons Club sport setup.

mooty

pss 9 is not any more comfy than moton cs.
find a good shop, discuss with them how you going to use your car, at 20+ track days and assuming you plan to continue tracking in future, i think moton is a good investment if you want aftermkt coil overs. with proper springs, moton has very compliant ride. you may also want to PM NJGT on this topic.

i had moton on gt6 (is there such a car?)

i mean 6gt3. the ride was fun. but i didn't like the noises from the upper monoballs, but you can stay with rubber if you prefer. again a good shop can fill you on all that.

sharkster

this is correct mooty. For some reason there is a common misconception that because you have double/tripple adjustable coil overs it "less" comortable on the street than PSS9s etc... Not so. It's all in the configuration and set up. I take people for rides all the time in the turbo with Motons etc... They never complain about it being too rough. It's just very compliant, doesn't pogo-around and very flat. Motons CS are quite a bit less maintenance than the JRZs (also a fantastic set up) and more user friendly I feel. I prefer the hardware too.

frafoss

Thanks for the fast replies. Yes, I will continue tracking in the future.

Mooty, you says with proper spring the ride is compliant. What spring do you have in mind? Have got an offer with Motons Club sport with Eibach ERS springs. I don't know the stiffnes of these.

For my car I see there are two versions, one for street and on for track. The track version is with incl. spher. bearing rear hub. Which should I pick?

Sharkster, you say its all in the configuration and set up. What do you recommend?

Do you recommend new sway bars also? I have a set of Cargraphic anti roll bars with fixed front and rear adjustable available.

Who is NJGT?

Thanks for the help.

frayed

James built my M3 as well. Euro motor, Motons, Blanton Diff, etc etc. I'll get it on track in a couple of weeks for its shake down run.

Motons are such a supple shock, incredible high speed damping. On the 996 GT3 they make all the difference in the world. BMWs with their intrinsic balance can be run with suboptimal suspension setups yet mask mistakes in chassis tuning. 911s are the opposite and a good damper like a moton can transform the car.

Steve Weiner-Rennsport Systems

We have done quite a number of Moton systems on a variety of cars used for street, dual-purpose (street/DE) and full competition cars.

As Mooty pointed out, its all about the configuration-setup and these can be made to ride much better than PSS-9's with the correct spring package, shock adjustments, and gas pressures. In some cases, we've had Moton build a custom-valved set of shocks with revised droop & bump stops for special applications.

IMHO,...Moton sets the Gold Standard for customer support to users and dealers in all respects but you do pay for some of that with their premium pricing. You get what you pay for,...

pole position

I suggest you do a little homework on the KW product line, especially their competition stuff which will be build , after a short quiz from their tech department in Germany, to your individual needs. Easy as good as Motons, JRZ's or Ohlins and their trackrecord in pro racing backs that up.

I am sure you have heard of Manthey and you are right, they ARE on another planet when it comes to P car racing and I let you figure out what their suspension of choice is.

mooty

i am no expert on springs. i bought my from steve weiner long long ago and he picked the spring rates for me.

i had rear spherical bearings. it has better performance than rubber, but when it gets older, it gets noisy. but you may not mind. i learned to igonore it.

NJ-GT is a poster's handle on rennlist. he plays with springs and suspension a lot and is quite knowledgeable on the subject. he also runs moton Cs.

mooty

i have done quite a bit of research when i went with moton. yes KW has excellent high end line, but that is not to be compared with jrz RS or moton CS, which are essentially bottom of the ladder entry product. if you are talking about the upper end KW stuff, you need to compare with moton 4 way competition stuff.

i am not talking about custom valved products. other's will build them as well. we have moton custom valved and custom shock body length for Evo 8 when it first arrived USA. i am speaking about off the shelf, pre-valved, ready to ship applications.

and as far as customer support of non pro teams i find moton's support hard very hard to beat. when my shocks failed (rear right on a cayman), lex sourced another one (it was very new product, i believe i had the first customer set in USA) and shipped next day air to CA. i had it on the car in less than 48 hours after failure.

within my track group, some have ran leda, some jrz, bilstein and kw. we haven't seen any of them respond with such speed.

mooty

i find on e36m3 only ground control race shox (which cannot be street driven or you rebuild them every other weekend) and moton cs to be optimal. i loved mine, but my motor sucked, just my particular m3.

frayed

The question was. . . are the KW clubsports worth a schit? Yet you answer the question with how awesome their race shocks are. You're jacked up if you think the OP or most of the folks looking to upgrade their stock shocks ON A STREET CAR can derive any benefit from a 20k set of custom built race dampers.

mooty

we cannot get our hands on manthey's custom kw set up just like we cannot get lance armstrongs time trial helmet, time trial bike, bonay's 47mm base pvd, ... somethings do exist but not available.