DME reading .2 997 GT3 RS
08-17-2018, 05:19 PM
#1
Three Wheelin'
Thread Starter
DME reading .2 997 GT3 RS
I am considering purchasing a .2 997 GT3 RS and there is an over rev recorded 260 hours ago. Car has and is running perfect. Any insight to what this means would be appreciated.
08-17-2018, 05:35 PM
#2
Rennlist Member
it means someone most likely did a 5-2 downshift and zinged the motor at 236.9 hours. You said car has 490+ hours on it?
Below is factory stuff, the 997.2RS has a little different ranges but same idea.
Rev ranges - 997 GT3:
Create the VAL before deleting the fault memory. Overspeed events are documented as follows in the VAL:
Rev range 1: 8,400 -1 ... to 9,200 -1
⇒ Maximum permitted engine speed exceeded; engine damage possible.
Rev range 2: 9,200 -1 ... to 9,400 -1
⇒ Maximum permitted engine speed exceeded; engine damage possible.
Rev range 3: 9,400 -1 ... to 9,600 -1
⇒ Maximum permitted engine speed exceeded; engine damage possible.
Rev range 4: 9,600 -1 ... to 10,000 -1
⇒ Maximum permitted engine speed clearly exceeded; engine damage probable.
Rev range 5: 10,000 -1 ... to 11,000 -1
⇒ Maximum permitted engine speed very clearly exceeded; engine damage very probable.
Rev range 6: over 11,000 -1
⇒ Engine damage has generally occurred.
Below is factory stuff, the 997.2RS has a little different ranges but same idea.
Rev ranges - 997 GT3:
Create the VAL before deleting the fault memory. Overspeed events are documented as follows in the VAL:
Rev range 1: 8,400 -1 ... to 9,200 -1
⇒ Maximum permitted engine speed exceeded; engine damage possible.
Rev range 2: 9,200 -1 ... to 9,400 -1
⇒ Maximum permitted engine speed exceeded; engine damage possible.
Rev range 3: 9,400 -1 ... to 9,600 -1
⇒ Maximum permitted engine speed exceeded; engine damage possible.
Rev range 4: 9,600 -1 ... to 10,000 -1
⇒ Maximum permitted engine speed clearly exceeded; engine damage probable.
Rev range 5: 10,000 -1 ... to 11,000 -1
⇒ Maximum permitted engine speed very clearly exceeded; engine damage very probable.
Rev range 6: over 11,000 -1
⇒ Engine damage has generally occurred.
08-17-2018, 06:13 PM
#3
Three Wheelin'
Thread Starter
Yes. The car has 12,800 miles on it. Looks like this event took place at approx 6000 mil. It looks like also from what I can gather that it was in that range for a 10th of a second or so. Not sure what to make of it. Car is running terrific.
08-17-2018, 08:28 PM
#5
'If overspeed entries are found and if the difference between the current hourmeter and the status when the last overspeed event was recorded is less than 50 operating hours, there is a high probability that the damage was caused by overspeed event(s).'
And then ...
'The value “50 operating hours” should be seen as a guide. The possibility of engine damage occurring much later due to previous overspeed event(s) cannot be ruled out.'
08-17-2018, 09:53 PM
#6
Trucker
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
Per Porsche ...
'If overspeed entries are found and if the difference between the current hourmeter and the status when the last overspeed event was recorded is less than 50 operating hours, there is a high probability that the damage was caused by overspeed event(s).'
And then ...
'The value “50 operating hours” should be seen as a guide. The possibility of engine damage occurring much later due to previous overspeed event(s) cannot be ruled out.'
'If overspeed entries are found and if the difference between the current hourmeter and the status when the last overspeed event was recorded is less than 50 operating hours, there is a high probability that the damage was caused by overspeed event(s).'
And then ...
'The value “50 operating hours” should be seen as a guide. The possibility of engine damage occurring much later due to previous overspeed event(s) cannot be ruled out.'
08-17-2018, 10:29 PM
#7
Rennlist Member
What POR9 cited is consistent with factory sources.
Trending Topics
08-17-2018, 11:41 PM
#8
Burning Brakes
Basically you have to assume/ plan that a rebuild may be necessary at some point. So whatever that number is to rebuild and whatever parts (pistons +) plus labor and time and then branded car as such (rebuilt motor) that is your answer.
I would even argue a slight discount to sum of the parts. Ie if this pretty blue car were 190k with current mileage and 0 overrevs and it costs 30k-40k to rebuild maybe another 10k for the "rebuilt status" and you are almost there. If that interests you.
Granted this may never have to get done. But the next buyer will ask for it.
I would even argue a slight discount to sum of the parts. Ie if this pretty blue car were 190k with current mileage and 0 overrevs and it costs 30k-40k to rebuild maybe another 10k for the "rebuilt status" and you are almost there. If that interests you.
Granted this may never have to get done. But the next buyer will ask for it.
08-18-2018, 12:25 AM
#9
Three Wheelin'
Thread Starter
Ok I agree with you. Have been reading up all eve. Issue imainly is possibility long term timing chain failure due to possible weakening. Otherwise the issues show up more immediately ie bent valves scored cyliners etc. So if compression checks out ok then replace timing chain to be safe. It’s also highly possible bc That engine is one of the toughest in the world... no residual failure/damage pending but after 260 hours since event... change the timing chain. Some wouldn’t touch it at all but others who race see this happen and just deal with it - these are parts that can be replaced/repaired like any. Heck cup cars get a full engine overhaul every 50 hours or something like that? So I have decided to buy it and incl the cost of the timing chain replacement and dme wart plus plus plus adding up to full overhaul in pricing. Otherwise a near perfect car.
08-18-2018, 12:49 AM
#10
Rennlist Member
Well, in that case, congratulations. I had my eye on that car since it was first listed several months ago, as it certainly showed as a pretty example. I hope it serves you well and no issues should arise. Enjoy!
08-18-2018, 03:14 AM
#11
Three Wheelin'
Thread Starter
The engine spent 3.77 hundredths of a second above range 2 (incl range 3, 4 and 5 combined) 240 hours ago. All events took place exactly the same time so looks like a miss shift for sure but otherwise no over revs recorded at all. So a mistake but perhaps not a pattern of abuse. Doesn't necessarily mean that there isn't an issue lingering but less likely the more hours on the engine. The oil has been changed 5 times in 12800 miles too so seem relatively well cared for ie a little less than annually but certainly all very low mile oil changes. That being said the engine will get a an overhaul and coolant pipes welded while at it. My question is if Porsche or BBi completes the overhaul do they reset the DME on the fresh engine? I know they can but do they? Or does it stay and then the car comes with the documented overhaul post over rev event for the next sale down the road?
08-18-2018, 09:20 AM
#12
Basically you have to assume/ plan that a rebuild may be necessary at some point. So whatever that number is to rebuild and whatever parts (pistons +) plus labor and time and then branded car as such (rebuilt motor) that is your answer.
I would even argue a slight discount to sum of the parts. Ie if this pretty blue car were 190k with current mileage and 0 overrevs and it costs 30k-40k to rebuild maybe another 10k for the "rebuilt status" and you are almost there. If that interests you.
Granted this may never have to get done. But the next buyer will ask for it.
I would even argue a slight discount to sum of the parts. Ie if this pretty blue car were 190k with current mileage and 0 overrevs and it costs 30k-40k to rebuild maybe another 10k for the "rebuilt status" and you are almost there. If that interests you.
Granted this may never have to get done. But the next buyer will ask for it.
08-18-2018, 06:44 PM
#13
Three Wheelin'
Thread Starter
After Weighing all of the options and issues I have decided to pass on this car. I’m not passing negative judgment on it , I’m just deciding that I don’t have the risk profile or time and frankly knowledge to deal with it down the road if there are any issues. It’s probably a terrific deal for somebody though
The following users liked this post:
turbospeeder (05-19-2020)
08-18-2018, 07:35 PM
#15
Ok I agree with you. Have been reading up all eve. Issue imainly is possibility long term timing chain failure due to possible weakening. Otherwise the issues show up more immediately ie bent valves scored cyliners etc. So if compression checks out ok then replace timing chain to be safe. It’s also highly possible bc That engine is one of the toughest in the world... no residual failure/damage pending but after 260 hours since event... change the timing chain. Some wouldn’t touch it at all but others who race see this happen and just deal with it - these are parts that can be replaced/repaired like any. Heck cup cars get a full engine overhaul every 50 hours or something like that? So I have decided to buy it and incl the cost of the timing chain replacement and dme wart plus plus plus adding up to full overhaul in pricing. Otherwise a near perfect car.
* Damaged valves and/or pistons (impact marks on the valve, valve impressions on the piston, valve bent).
* Cylinder liner damage (even “piston seizure”).
* Damaged or displaced connecting rod bearings.
* Loosened or loose fastening screw(s) on the crankshaft pulley.
* Loosened or loose fastening screw(s) on the camshaft gear.
* Loosened or loose connecting rod bolts.
* Cracked timing chain(s).
* Changed timing.
* Irreparably damaged clutch elements (pressure plate and/or drive plate).
* Vibrations and/or engine imbalance due to irreparably damaged clutch elements.
* Vibrations around the transmission.
* Defective synchronisation.