Let's hear it: How much "more" value does the GTS buy?
06-21-2017, 05:48 PM
#1
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
Let's hear it: How much "more" value does the GTS buy?
OK, so GTS vs C2S. Similar mileage, similar builds (suspension, LSD, Adaptive Sport seats).
With GTS, you get:
1) a bit different interior trim package?
2) Wider 4 hips
3) different badging
4) powerkit making 23 hp and bit more torque down low
What you pay: an extra $15-20k for similar mileage/condition.
Let's hear it; put a $ price on each of these. Does it add up to $15-20k more? I realize money is different for each person, but assuming it doesn't grow on trees; is the GTS worth the 20-30% premium up front? Yes, I know it is likely to hold it's value every bit as well as a C2S, if not more, but $20k isn't exactly chump change.....
Let's hear the arguments for and against, considering the price. If you think the GTS is worth 30% more in terms of driving experience, then please quantify. If you don't think it is, then please quantify that too. Thanks!
With GTS, you get:
1) a bit different interior trim package?
2) Wider 4 hips
3) different badging
4) powerkit making 23 hp and bit more torque down low
What you pay: an extra $15-20k for similar mileage/condition.
Let's hear it; put a $ price on each of these. Does it add up to $15-20k more? I realize money is different for each person, but assuming it doesn't grow on trees; is the GTS worth the 20-30% premium up front? Yes, I know it is likely to hold it's value every bit as well as a C2S, if not more, but $20k isn't exactly chump change.....
Let's hear the arguments for and against, considering the price. If you think the GTS is worth 30% more in terms of driving experience, then please quantify. If you don't think it is, then please quantify that too. Thanks!
06-21-2017, 05:55 PM
#2
I started looking this January for a C2S. Now I am looking at GTS's and Turbos. From what I have read, it is worth it. I love the look of the fat *** and the centerlocks.
If I was a responsible Marine I would get a 997.1 C4S with IMS bearing fix.
But I am not responsible.
And I want to swoon each and every time I walk into my garage...which my motorcycles kind of do but nothing beats taking an indoor cover off a pristine Porsche.
If I was a responsible Marine I would get a 997.1 C4S with IMS bearing fix.
But I am not responsible.
And I want to swoon each and every time I walk into my garage...which my motorcycles kind of do but nothing beats taking an indoor cover off a pristine Porsche.
06-21-2017, 05:59 PM
#4
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
I started looking this January for a C2S. Now I am looking at GTS's and Turbos. From what I have read, it is worth it. I love the look of the fat *** and the centerlocks.
If I was a responsible Marine I would get a 997.1 C4S with IMS bearing fix.
But I am not responsible.
And I want to swoon each and every time I walk into my garage...which my motorcycles kind of do but nothing beats taking an indoor cover off a pristine Porsche.
If I was a responsible Marine I would get a 997.1 C4S with IMS bearing fix.
But I am not responsible.
And I want to swoon each and every time I walk into my garage...which my motorcycles kind of do but nothing beats taking an indoor cover off a pristine Porsche.
06-21-2017, 06:17 PM
#5
06-21-2017, 06:23 PM
#6
Three Wheelin'
If you're going to try and quantify it (monetarily) you just may have missed the point entirely.
Can you quantify the value of a quality timepiece vs a digital Casio? they both will give you close enough to accurate time, and while the casio might require a battery at some point you could buy 100 of them for the cost of a quality timepiece. That's missed the point entirely. You're doing that because it's something important to you, for whatever reason.
If you're going to try and logic your way in or out of it it's going to end up a fruitless exercise.
Part of the reason I got my GTS was the relative rarity, the wider hips, and the difficulty of getting all the other options on a Carrera S (sans the wider track). You are not going to find a Carrera S with centerlocks (if you like that or not, it's not an option).. wider rear track with RWD? If you like it or not, it's not an option. There isn't a way to quantify it if it flat out isn't a factory option. What's it worth to me? What would be the point in trying to stick a dollar value on something that's only available on one car as a package? You can configure a Carrera S with some of the things a GTS has. Not all. If you're the sort who can be happy with some and not all.. well then, there you have it.
Ok, I'll play, just for the purpose of following instructions in the original post. Value to meet out to the right.
With GTS, you get:
1) a bit different interior trim package? - Purchase price of my car
2) Wider 4 hips - Purchase price of my car
3) different badging - 0
4) powerkit making 23 hp and bit more torque down low OEM, not aftermarket - Purchase price of my car
5) centerlocks - meh.. could take it or leave it. but neat, and not something you get OEM on a Carrera - Purchase price of my car
6) RWD widebody - Purchase price of my car
so it looks like the value is the purchase price of my car.
Can you quantify the value of a quality timepiece vs a digital Casio? they both will give you close enough to accurate time, and while the casio might require a battery at some point you could buy 100 of them for the cost of a quality timepiece. That's missed the point entirely. You're doing that because it's something important to you, for whatever reason.
If you're going to try and logic your way in or out of it it's going to end up a fruitless exercise.
Part of the reason I got my GTS was the relative rarity, the wider hips, and the difficulty of getting all the other options on a Carrera S (sans the wider track). You are not going to find a Carrera S with centerlocks (if you like that or not, it's not an option).. wider rear track with RWD? If you like it or not, it's not an option. There isn't a way to quantify it if it flat out isn't a factory option. What's it worth to me? What would be the point in trying to stick a dollar value on something that's only available on one car as a package? You can configure a Carrera S with some of the things a GTS has. Not all. If you're the sort who can be happy with some and not all.. well then, there you have it.
Ok, I'll play, just for the purpose of following instructions in the original post. Value to meet out to the right.
With GTS, you get:
1) a bit different interior trim package? - Purchase price of my car
2) Wider 4 hips - Purchase price of my car
3) different badging - 0
4) powerkit making 23 hp and bit more torque down low OEM, not aftermarket - Purchase price of my car
5) centerlocks - meh.. could take it or leave it. but neat, and not something you get OEM on a Carrera - Purchase price of my car
6) RWD widebody - Purchase price of my car
so it looks like the value is the purchase price of my car.
06-21-2017, 07:08 PM
#7
Bottom line is, if you don't love the idea of it before you buy it, youll hate it after you buy it.
so...lets hear about this GTS than youre considering passing up. pretty sure most people on the 997.2 side of the forum can attest to my adventures trying to find one while im overseas currently.
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06-21-2017, 07:09 PM
#8
If you're going to try and quantify it (monetarily) you just may have missed the point entirely.
Can you quantify the value of a quality timepiece vs a digital Casio? they both will give you close enough to accurate time, and while the casio might require a battery at some point you could buy 100 of them for the cost of a quality timepiece. That's missed the point entirely. You're doing that because it's something important to you, for whatever reason.
If you're going to try and logic your way in or out of it it's going to end up a fruitless exercise.
Part of the reason I got my GTS was the relative rarity, the wider hips, and the difficulty of getting all the other options on a Carrera S (sans the wider track). You are not going to find a Carrera S with centerlocks (if you like that or not, it's not an option).. wider rear track with RWD? If you like it or not, it's not an option. There isn't a way to quantify it if it flat out isn't a factory option. What's it worth to me? What would be the point in trying to stick a dollar value on something that's only available on one car as a package? You can configure a Carrera S with some of the things a GTS has. Not all. If you're the sort who can be happy with some and not all.. well then, there you have it.
Ok, I'll play, just for the purpose of following instructions in the original post. Value to meet out to the right.
With GTS, you get:
1) a bit different interior trim package? - Purchase price of my car
2) Wider 4 hips - Purchase price of my car
3) different badging - 0
4) powerkit making 23 hp and bit more torque down low OEM, not aftermarket - Purchase price of my car
5) centerlocks - meh.. could take it or leave it. but neat, and not something you get OEM on a Carrera - Purchase price of my car
6) RWD widebody - Purchase price of my car
so it looks like the value is the purchase price of my car.
Can you quantify the value of a quality timepiece vs a digital Casio? they both will give you close enough to accurate time, and while the casio might require a battery at some point you could buy 100 of them for the cost of a quality timepiece. That's missed the point entirely. You're doing that because it's something important to you, for whatever reason.
If you're going to try and logic your way in or out of it it's going to end up a fruitless exercise.
Part of the reason I got my GTS was the relative rarity, the wider hips, and the difficulty of getting all the other options on a Carrera S (sans the wider track). You are not going to find a Carrera S with centerlocks (if you like that or not, it's not an option).. wider rear track with RWD? If you like it or not, it's not an option. There isn't a way to quantify it if it flat out isn't a factory option. What's it worth to me? What would be the point in trying to stick a dollar value on something that's only available on one car as a package? You can configure a Carrera S with some of the things a GTS has. Not all. If you're the sort who can be happy with some and not all.. well then, there you have it.
Ok, I'll play, just for the purpose of following instructions in the original post. Value to meet out to the right.
With GTS, you get:
1) a bit different interior trim package? - Purchase price of my car
2) Wider 4 hips - Purchase price of my car
3) different badging - 0
4) powerkit making 23 hp and bit more torque down low OEM, not aftermarket - Purchase price of my car
5) centerlocks - meh.. could take it or leave it. but neat, and not something you get OEM on a Carrera - Purchase price of my car
6) RWD widebody - Purchase price of my car
so it looks like the value is the purchase price of my car.
What rims are those, they look like they offset the WB perfectly!
06-21-2017, 07:51 PM
#10
I will be looking for a 997 GTS come end of year. Personally if I can get one with 30k miles, that is in good condition with a clear bra, and PDK for $65k, I will go for it. I think that is the right price for one. Now, if I can find a 997 C2S with the same options for $55k, then I would have a hard time spending the extra money on a GTS. But I do feel that for $10k more it is worth it. Do I think a GTS would be worth it at $70k or more, I don't think so.
06-22-2017, 12:06 AM
#11
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When I was looking at 997.2's a couple of years ago, the price premium of the GTS was somewhat smaller than it is now. The GTS has simply not depreciated as much as the "regular" S. I got the car because I loved the wider hips and I liked the relative scarcity of the model. I like the looks of the centerlocks but I don't like how difficult it is to find a set of winter wheels/tires for a reasonable price.
Wait did I just use the word "reasonable" in regards to Porsche?
Wait did I just use the word "reasonable" in regards to Porsche?
06-22-2017, 01:05 AM
#12
Three Wheelin'
06-22-2017, 02:37 AM
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I feel like this question of, “is a GTS worth it” has been beaten to death here lately. I know you dismissed the “money is different to different people” part of the equation, but it's true. I got my GTS because it was cheaper than an older 6MT R8 and slightly subtler, not because it was more expensive than a C2S.
If you don't think it's worth it to you, I'm not sure why we're supposed to convince you that it is. None of us know your financial situation or needs from a car. Obviously it was worth it to those of us who bought one because we chose to buy one.
If you don't think it's worth it to you, I'm not sure why we're supposed to convince you that it is. None of us know your financial situation or needs from a car. Obviously it was worth it to those of us who bought one because we chose to buy one.
06-22-2017, 09:31 AM
#14
funny you mention RTF I actually just finished reading that million page threat about the guy in Canada that got screwed. I think I will go with Forgeline if I get into a GTS vs a .2 Turbo.
06-22-2017, 02:21 PM
#15
I will chime in, having driven a couple of GTS....
If they both have sport suspension, they are going to feel pretty similar on back roads. The GTS is wider, yes. Nobody outside of a Porschephile will notice.
Power: top end, the GTS pulls better, but I live at 4200 feet, so neither is world-beating. The 991 C2S has them both beat, and a turbo is better yet. Don't sweat the power, get a turbo if you want a difference you can "feel".
Overall specs: centerlock wheels? Meh. The standard GTS stuff like PSE? Of course. Then again, a Gundo and Sharkwerks muffler bypass is cheap and just as good. Alcantara interior? Not a fan, I would opt for full leather personally.
The GTS should have adaptive sport seats standard, but it doesn't.
Would I take a well-equipped C2S over a GTS for $20k less? Of course. The price delta exists for a reason; the GTS is more rare, and people shopping for these cars aren't always price-sensitive, but if you put them side by side, let me drive both, I wouldn't guess for a second that one is $20k more than the other. At retail, I would go with a GTS over a C2S well equipped; the difference was something like $7,000 for similar builds, and it is worth that. $20k? Not for performance.
Also, with that said, if you took the GTS and the C2S to the track with similar performance options; they are going to be close, very close, and there are a lot faster cars out there for the track. $80k isn't far off of GT4 money (one just sold for $85k over in the classified). And, for track work, there are many other great cars. Hell, the new Civic R would likely take down either of these cars for 1/2 the money.
Now, for me, the 991 GTS is a lot more exciting. SC standard, different front bumper, just looks like a different car. The 997 GTS doesn't look much different than a 997 anything else. The Turbo is a lot sharper looking car than the Carrera, in the 997 guise. If you took the "GTS" badge off a 997, 9/10 people, even Porsche people, won't notice a difference. The 991 GTS is the best looking modern Carrera I have ever seen, simply stunning.
Long story short: if $20k is nothing to you, then why not? It will likely keep a price difference somewhat near $20k over the long term. Then again, as was pointed out in another thread: if in 5 years the C2S is worth $35k, do you expect the GTS to be worth $55k? Not likely. We don't see 57% price deltas from the C2S to C4S in the 993 market, so saying it will always be worth "at least" the $20k, if not more in the future, is nothing more than speculation (or pseudo-justification for spending more $. I know, we have all been there :-) ) But yes, the 20-23% delta that currently exists, sure.
If they both have sport suspension, they are going to feel pretty similar on back roads. The GTS is wider, yes. Nobody outside of a Porschephile will notice.
Power: top end, the GTS pulls better, but I live at 4200 feet, so neither is world-beating. The 991 C2S has them both beat, and a turbo is better yet. Don't sweat the power, get a turbo if you want a difference you can "feel".
Overall specs: centerlock wheels? Meh. The standard GTS stuff like PSE? Of course. Then again, a Gundo and Sharkwerks muffler bypass is cheap and just as good. Alcantara interior? Not a fan, I would opt for full leather personally.
The GTS should have adaptive sport seats standard, but it doesn't.
Would I take a well-equipped C2S over a GTS for $20k less? Of course. The price delta exists for a reason; the GTS is more rare, and people shopping for these cars aren't always price-sensitive, but if you put them side by side, let me drive both, I wouldn't guess for a second that one is $20k more than the other. At retail, I would go with a GTS over a C2S well equipped; the difference was something like $7,000 for similar builds, and it is worth that. $20k? Not for performance.
Also, with that said, if you took the GTS and the C2S to the track with similar performance options; they are going to be close, very close, and there are a lot faster cars out there for the track. $80k isn't far off of GT4 money (one just sold for $85k over in the classified). And, for track work, there are many other great cars. Hell, the new Civic R would likely take down either of these cars for 1/2 the money.
Now, for me, the 991 GTS is a lot more exciting. SC standard, different front bumper, just looks like a different car. The 997 GTS doesn't look much different than a 997 anything else. The Turbo is a lot sharper looking car than the Carrera, in the 997 guise. If you took the "GTS" badge off a 997, 9/10 people, even Porsche people, won't notice a difference. The 991 GTS is the best looking modern Carrera I have ever seen, simply stunning.
Long story short: if $20k is nothing to you, then why not? It will likely keep a price difference somewhat near $20k over the long term. Then again, as was pointed out in another thread: if in 5 years the C2S is worth $35k, do you expect the GTS to be worth $55k? Not likely. We don't see 57% price deltas from the C2S to C4S in the 993 market, so saying it will always be worth "at least" the $20k, if not more in the future, is nothing more than speculation (or pseudo-justification for spending more $. I know, we have all been there :-) ) But yes, the 20-23% delta that currently exists, sure.