What do you expect for $100K?
08-23-2016, 06:15 PM
#46
Sir Thomas Lord of All Mets Fans
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
Ha. Back seat! That's funny.
I'm 5'10" 175 and can't sit behind myself. I doubt my kids could either.
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$1ooK car dealership? What do I expect? Polite, clean, reasonable hours, maybe some weekend service, service advisers that speak English and communicate clearly. Fair pricing and backing up their work. Timely repair time.
Took my Ex5 in for an oil change. 2oo kms after that service it threw the 1st and 2nd connecting rod bearings.
...59 days later I picked up my barely cleaned, fresh engine truck. I commented to the service manager that for the time at the dealership, they perhaps should have returned my car detailed like a new delivery. Service manager said they did not make enough money on the $25k warrantied repair. Perhaps thinking that I did not appreciated all the hard work that they did.
He said to me " Right now, I just want to punch you in the face".
I was not expecting that from my $1ooK dealership.
Doubt I will be visiting that monogopoly BMW franchise again. They have the largest 3 dealers within 60 minutes of my house.
I'm 5'10" 175 and can't sit behind myself. I doubt my kids could either.
---
$1ooK car dealership? What do I expect? Polite, clean, reasonable hours, maybe some weekend service, service advisers that speak English and communicate clearly. Fair pricing and backing up their work. Timely repair time.
Took my Ex5 in for an oil change. 2oo kms after that service it threw the 1st and 2nd connecting rod bearings.
...59 days later I picked up my barely cleaned, fresh engine truck. I commented to the service manager that for the time at the dealership, they perhaps should have returned my car detailed like a new delivery. Service manager said they did not make enough money on the $25k warrantied repair. Perhaps thinking that I did not appreciated all the hard work that they did.
He said to me " Right now, I just want to punch you in the face".
I was not expecting that from my $1ooK dealership.
Doubt I will be visiting that monogopoly BMW franchise again. They have the largest 3 dealers within 60 minutes of my house.
I didn't pay $100K for my unicorn, but the original owner did and a good deal more. I would not. To be honest, more than the dough, I just do not like the looks of the 991 and following generations, more than anything, the interior is just too cluttered. To me, the 997.2 is the right balance.
My expectations were a great weekend car, a nice car for special night out with the wife, a nice car than anyone else in the neighborhood drove (yeah, I know, a bit shallow), reliability, excellent performance, and a marque with like-minded fellow enthusiasts. The Porsche has delivered on fronts in the 2.5 years since we bought it.
T
p.s. I agree with QC. If you're making 200 G's a year and buying $100+K cars every few years, to me, that's wacky. But, if your important family obligations are taken care of, and it floats your boat, go for it. Life's too short.
08-23-2016, 07:38 PM
#47
Rennlist Member
What precisely don't you like about the 997 interior? I came to Porsche from older, cheaper cars - 1995 Ford Escort, 1997 Honda Civic, etc. - so to me the interior of my 997.2S seems classy and luxurious with all that leather, & without the profusion of buttons that pollute modern Porsches. To me, the 997 interior compares favorably with our 2011 Ferrari California.
Important note: My 997 doesn't have the full leather option which, admittedly, spruces the ambiance up a notch or two. The standard leather used on the seats isn't even particularly rich or expensive feeling.
I do feel the 991 kicked things up a notch but to the point others have already made, $100K is the base price of entry these days on a 991.2. We're looking at $125K for a C2S with well-chosen and non-frivolous options.
08-23-2016, 07:45 PM
#48
Rennlist Member
This thread has taken a turn (as most threads do) and now is less about what one expects out of $100K and more about what it takes to buy a $100K car, but I'll chime in to both. I also agree with Quadcammer...your "run of the mill" doctors, lawyers, business execs and small business owners are not dropping $100K on vehicles, and I'm on a coast too where salaries are higher than more midwestern or rural areas. $100K is a lot of money to spend on a vehicle, and it takes a car enthusiast with either a huge bank account or a high threshold for debt on a depreciating asset to make that kind of purchase.
08-23-2016, 07:59 PM
#49
This is my thought as well. The personal friends that do buy often are trading their 2 yr old car in on the new one so they are not in fact dropping $130k every time they are buying, just trading up.
That said, it's nothing to see $60k-$70k new pickups everywhere so the $100k car is not that much more of a purchase. My personal "comfort zone" is $85K max for a special car even though I could buy new. I am too cheap and just don't value any vehicle more than that. That is why I will always buy a "like new" 911 after they have taken their hit. A $140k car will always be a $140k car regardless if you buy it new or after it has taken its depretiational hit. It was built to those standards regardless.
That said, it's nothing to see $60k-$70k new pickups everywhere so the $100k car is not that much more of a purchase. My personal "comfort zone" is $85K max for a special car even though I could buy new. I am too cheap and just don't value any vehicle more than that. That is why I will always buy a "like new" 911 after they have taken their hit. A $140k car will always be a $140k car regardless if you buy it new or after it has taken its depretiational hit. It was built to those standards regardless.
08-23-2016, 08:07 PM
#50
Dealers love it, their banks love it, and if they've incorporated themselves in the process, there's the appicable tax deduction(s) available.
08-23-2016, 08:13 PM
#51
Sir Thomas Lord of All Mets Fans
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
Originally Posted by andy92782
Prior to my 997, I drove a 2007 BMW 335i (E90) with Sport and Premium packages. To be blunt, the 997 interior is a visible step down in quality compared to the E90. The plastics feel cheaper and the whole interior squeaks and rattles excessively when the car is in motion. The E90 was as solid as a bank vault. Considering the E90 had an MSRP of less than half that of my 997.2 ($106k), the situation on the Porsche is a bit embarrassing.
Important note: My 997 doesn't have the full leather option which, admittedly, spruces the ambiance up a notch or two. The standard leather used on the seats isn't even particularly rich or expensive feeling.
I do feel the 991 kicked things up a notch but to the point others have already made, $100K is the base price of entry these days on a 991.2. We're looking at $125K for a C2S with well-chosen and non-frivolous options.
Important note: My 997 doesn't have the full leather option which, admittedly, spruces the ambiance up a notch or two. The standard leather used on the seats isn't even particularly rich or expensive feeling.
I do feel the 991 kicked things up a notch but to the point others have already made, $100K is the base price of entry these days on a 991.2. We're looking at $125K for a C2S with well-chosen and non-frivolous options.
08-23-2016, 08:56 PM
#52
Prior to my 997, I drove a 2007 BMW 335i (E90) with Sport and Premium packages. To be blunt, the 997 interior is a visible step down in quality compared to the E90. The plastics feel cheaper and the whole interior squeaks and rattles excessively when the car is in motion. The E90 was as solid as a bank vault. Considering the E90 had an MSRP of less than half that of my 997.2 ($106k), the situation on the Porsche is a bit embarrassing.
Important note: My 997 doesn't have the full leather option which, admittedly, spruces the ambiance up a notch or two. The standard leather used on the seats isn't even particularly rich or expensive feeling.
I do feel the 991 kicked things up a notch but to the point others have already made, $100K is the base price of entry these days on a 991.2. We're looking at $125K for a C2S with well-chosen and non-frivolous options.
Important note: My 997 doesn't have the full leather option which, admittedly, spruces the ambiance up a notch or two. The standard leather used on the seats isn't even particularly rich or expensive feeling.
I do feel the 991 kicked things up a notch but to the point others have already made, $100K is the base price of entry these days on a 991.2. We're looking at $125K for a C2S with well-chosen and non-frivolous options.
08-23-2016, 09:46 PM
#53
"Full leather interior" makes a huge difference in interior feel and appearance. My "full leather interior" and highly optioned C4S is every bit as nice as any of my Audis interiors. (RS4, A8,S4).
08-23-2016, 09:58 PM
#54
Totally correct, and I agree about the leasing. I was responding to the notion that people were buying $100K cars, not leasing them. There's obviously a difference. And for what it is worth, I'm not opposed to leasing. My business vehicle/daily driver is leased. But we were talking about people buying $100K cars and I was just responding to the person who suggested that your run of the mill lawyer, doctor, etc was making those purchases, which I firmly do not believe.
08-24-2016, 12:07 AM
#55
I keep telling myself the corvette wont be built as good...
But IM serious...
Im thinking of going to a corvette grandsport lt1 with 8 speed or seven speed manual, stage 2 aero carbon fiber package, z07 package...
Turn it into lap time rat...
1.2 G's 0-60 in 3.6 seconds braking in 91 feet all under 80k....
5 year powertrain warranty (GM warranties vehicles tracked)
I mean, ****....I like Porsche but I can't even get a 2013 2 year warranty CPO 991 Carrera 4s with pdk sport chorno plus and SPASM for that much...
But IM serious...
Im thinking of going to a corvette grandsport lt1 with 8 speed or seven speed manual, stage 2 aero carbon fiber package, z07 package...
Turn it into lap time rat...
1.2 G's 0-60 in 3.6 seconds braking in 91 feet all under 80k....
5 year powertrain warranty (GM warranties vehicles tracked)
I mean, ****....I like Porsche but I can't even get a 2013 2 year warranty CPO 991 Carrera 4s with pdk sport chorno plus and SPASM for that much...
08-24-2016, 12:11 AM
#56
I keep telling myself the corvette wont be built as good...
But IM serious...
Im thinking of going to a corvette grandsport lt1 with 8 speed or seven speed manual, stage 2 aero carbon fiber package, z07 package...
Turn it into lap time rat...
1.2 G's 0-60 in 3.6 seconds braking in 91 feet all under 80k....
5 year powertrain warranty (GM warranties vehicles tracked)
I mean, ****....I like Porsche but I can't even get a 2013 2 year warranty CPO 991 Carrera 4s with pdk sport chorno plus and SPASM for that much...
But IM serious...
Im thinking of going to a corvette grandsport lt1 with 8 speed or seven speed manual, stage 2 aero carbon fiber package, z07 package...
Turn it into lap time rat...
1.2 G's 0-60 in 3.6 seconds braking in 91 feet all under 80k....
5 year powertrain warranty (GM warranties vehicles tracked)
I mean, ****....I like Porsche but I can't even get a 2013 2 year warranty CPO 991 Carrera 4s with pdk sport chorno plus and SPASM for that much...
08-24-2016, 12:21 AM
#57
I was fortunate enough to buy my 09 C2S when PNA offered 0.9% financing. When you consider the creeping double digit inflation, that was free money.
Paid $85k, which today, as others have said, would put me in a Cayman (had 2, meh).
What is a new C2s today? $120k? Before I threw down that amount, I would take a long hard look at the GT 350!
But, the question was, what do you expect for $100k.
It sure as S@^% wouldn't be a 991 C2, or C2S, it would be a 2010-12 TT with < 20k on the clock.
I have seen very clean 997.2 TTs sell for $100k or less, and THAT is the bargain in 911s, if there is one.
A simple flash and the car can hold it's own with some pretty heavy hitters costing a lot more.
Boringly reliable, easy enough that a wife/gf can take it to buy groceries, not a high strung exotic.
A 550+/-h.p., AWD car that runs on pump gas.
But someone else brought up another point: A friend just bought a F-150 Crew Cab, 4X4, leather(heated, cooled, vibrating!) seats, truck was $71k! $70k for an F-150???
Add tax, tag, you're at $1k monthly, not including insurance, unless you put a bunch down.
For a pick-up truck.
So I guess that my answer is a low milage 997/2 TT for $100k. YMMV.
Paid $85k, which today, as others have said, would put me in a Cayman (had 2, meh).
What is a new C2s today? $120k? Before I threw down that amount, I would take a long hard look at the GT 350!
But, the question was, what do you expect for $100k.
It sure as S@^% wouldn't be a 991 C2, or C2S, it would be a 2010-12 TT with < 20k on the clock.
I have seen very clean 997.2 TTs sell for $100k or less, and THAT is the bargain in 911s, if there is one.
A simple flash and the car can hold it's own with some pretty heavy hitters costing a lot more.
Boringly reliable, easy enough that a wife/gf can take it to buy groceries, not a high strung exotic.
A 550+/-h.p., AWD car that runs on pump gas.
But someone else brought up another point: A friend just bought a F-150 Crew Cab, 4X4, leather(heated, cooled, vibrating!) seats, truck was $71k! $70k for an F-150???
Add tax, tag, you're at $1k monthly, not including insurance, unless you put a bunch down.
For a pick-up truck.
So I guess that my answer is a low milage 997/2 TT for $100k. YMMV.
08-24-2016, 02:13 AM
#60
ok, I gotta chime in too and I have had similar ideas and thinking as the op. Are Porsche 911s really worth $100k?
Just a little history, I have been a car and driver guy for over 30 years. The Porsche 911 is a car that most of us grew up reading about in the magazines and dreaming about owning some day. It represents an incredible racing heritage, performance, and unique driving experience that really does create life long enthusiasts for most who are fortunate enough to own/drive one. On a superficial level, it also represents a level of achievement or financial income. People want to be seen in a car that represents their level of "success" and Porsche represents people who most likely earn 100k plus.
I have been a die hard Porsche fanatic and owner for 16 years. I admired them from afar when I was younger, but once I drove one, it became my mission to own one. Now I own several and purchased all of them gently used and letting the original owners take most of the depreciation hit.
I remember walking around the Porsche parking lot at a special intro day around 2005 when the introduction of the 997 happened. I remember looking at nicely optioned 2005 Carrera S 997 for 100k and honestly thinking they were a bargain. Being a car guy I could totally justify the price when I would think about the performance, quality, heritage, brand, and looks. When I saw the 997 it was the first 911 that I felt in my gut that I HAVE to have it some day and new at $100k I felt it was worth it. My 2006 C4S is a very nicely optioned 911 that stickered at $115k new. I Purchased it in 2010 gently used with cpo and only 6300 miles on it for about 60% of the original price.
Today I have to admit that as big as a Porsche fan that I am... I started to get really annoyed with Porsche marketing and pricing starting with option prices on the 997.2. Suddenly in 2009 there was $20k jump in pricing for options added to almost every car and those options basically being electronic gadgets and gizmos. Especially when these gadgets come standard on cars costing $20k new!!! From 2012-Present the pricing of all porsche options just makes me angry. I can no longer justify spending $30-40k for gadgets and options on any car. Suddenly I honestly started to question if the 911 was worth the asking price any more, especially when the options cost more then a decent new car!
Today, a nice Carrera S with good options is pushing 150k out the door. I honestly now think that new Porsches are no longer worth their asking prices.
Just a little history, I have been a car and driver guy for over 30 years. The Porsche 911 is a car that most of us grew up reading about in the magazines and dreaming about owning some day. It represents an incredible racing heritage, performance, and unique driving experience that really does create life long enthusiasts for most who are fortunate enough to own/drive one. On a superficial level, it also represents a level of achievement or financial income. People want to be seen in a car that represents their level of "success" and Porsche represents people who most likely earn 100k plus.
I have been a die hard Porsche fanatic and owner for 16 years. I admired them from afar when I was younger, but once I drove one, it became my mission to own one. Now I own several and purchased all of them gently used and letting the original owners take most of the depreciation hit.
I remember walking around the Porsche parking lot at a special intro day around 2005 when the introduction of the 997 happened. I remember looking at nicely optioned 2005 Carrera S 997 for 100k and honestly thinking they were a bargain. Being a car guy I could totally justify the price when I would think about the performance, quality, heritage, brand, and looks. When I saw the 997 it was the first 911 that I felt in my gut that I HAVE to have it some day and new at $100k I felt it was worth it. My 2006 C4S is a very nicely optioned 911 that stickered at $115k new. I Purchased it in 2010 gently used with cpo and only 6300 miles on it for about 60% of the original price.
Today I have to admit that as big as a Porsche fan that I am... I started to get really annoyed with Porsche marketing and pricing starting with option prices on the 997.2. Suddenly in 2009 there was $20k jump in pricing for options added to almost every car and those options basically being electronic gadgets and gizmos. Especially when these gadgets come standard on cars costing $20k new!!! From 2012-Present the pricing of all porsche options just makes me angry. I can no longer justify spending $30-40k for gadgets and options on any car. Suddenly I honestly started to question if the 911 was worth the asking price any more, especially when the options cost more then a decent new car!
Today, a nice Carrera S with good options is pushing 150k out the door. I honestly now think that new Porsches are no longer worth their asking prices.