Wow, just took delivery of my first 911
01-27-2016 | 02:09 AM
#1
Thread Starter
Rennlist Member
Joined: Dec 2015
Posts: 1,264
Likes: 132
From: Orange County
Wow, just took delivery of my first 911
All I can say is, "Wow!!"
I bought this car that was listed on this site from Forum Member. 2005 997.1 6MT, with 20,600 miles:
https://rennlist.com/forums/vehicle-...to-2019-a.html
Its really hard for me to inspect every inch of the car since it is so dirty and its so dark, so I concentrated on the driving aspect.
A little background: I am in my mid 40s, been a car fanatic my whole life. I can blame my dad. I grew up in a house where my dad probably always had a car better than his socioeconomic status. That isn't to say we were poor, but it isn't like I grew up with a filthy rich guy who had a collection of 20 cars at a time. That being said, I grew up with him owning cars such as a early 80s black 911sc coupe, Red Targa, BMW E36 M3 (with Dinan exhaust, headers, intake, ECU and cams), Acura NSX, Nissan 300zx TT (with stage 1 Jim Wolff turbo kit), AMG CLK55 (2), Currently AMG SL55, and just a couple of weeks ago he drove my Brothers 991 C2S with PDK and fell in love, so he has one being shipped as I type this (I think he thought at his age he was over the whole 911 thing, and then he got in my brothers and felt the refinement and the PDK and realized it isn't just a young mans car).
I grew up driving a little 88' Honda CRX Si (red), Acura Integra GS, 1994 Honda Civic coupe EX, 1999 Honda Civic coupe Si (until I got hit in it, before I even sold my Ex), 2003 Nissan 350z w/ Nismo Headers, Exhaust, Intake, Crawford Plenum, and most recently a 2003.5 BMW M3 6mt. The has been my baby for a long time and I love that car. Unfortunately I live in South Orange County Ca and I am finding that with the M3s being had with high milage for 15,000-20,000$ a lot of younger guys are buying them and modding them like crazy. It is almost to the point where the M3 now looks like a car for a guy in their late 20s to late 30s. (Even the E90s are getting this way, which I really don't like to see this trend). I was contemplating making my M3 to simulate a CSL (but with the 6MT) but I always wanted a 911 and this was the time.
I am really surprised that the 911 is that much different than the M3. My M3 is pretty light, manual seats, no Nav, etc.... Pretty much the lightest you can get without stripping stuff out or doing a sunroof delete. I guess we are comparing a 3415lb M3 to a 3075lb 911? The 911 feels even much lighter still. The front end tracks like it is on rails. I race Karts and I love the feel of the 911 also being low and such good visibility looking down at the road. All the hondas I have been in kind of have that feel and I always liked it. Perhaps the wt being in the back, the front being so light, being so low to the ground, the 911 reminds me most of the NSX. I know some here may look down on that car as it is a Japanese car, but I still really have a lot of respect and really liked driving that car.
On paper, I was kind of disappointed in the 911 motor. a 3.8L with "ONLY" 355hp? While My M3 that started production in 1999 is able to produce 333hp with only a 3.2L motor. Plus the 8,000 redline vs 7,300 and independent throttle bodies, etc. That M motor really is a special motor, and I still think it is. One thing I did notice coming from my 350z was that the M3 motor didn't seem to wind up as quickly. I am not sure if that is due to the design of a V6 vs an inline 6? But the torque curve on the M felt much flatter. It didn't really feel like the M was that much faster than the 350z, until you looked at the speedo and realized you were going faster. The M3 was just much more refined
Fast forward to the 911 and the engine seems to rev much quicker than the M3 and the torque curve even seems better than the m3 (which was already really good). So many things that the M3 did well: steering feel and response, brakes (compared to my 350z), responsive motor, suspension and handling, etc..... are all just a bit better on the 911, plus you sit lower in the car like the 350z (although the 350z front end visability isn't close to the 911). In general, this car has to rank right up there with the NSX and 360 Modena I have driven. I know it isn't an "exotic" like the 360, but it just maybe as fun to drive.
I just have so much going through my mind right now and had to put some of my thoughts to words. Sorry for the long post. When it is cleaned, I will have to post some pictures and do a more formal introduction.
I bought this car that was listed on this site from Forum Member. 2005 997.1 6MT, with 20,600 miles:
https://rennlist.com/forums/vehicle-...to-2019-a.html
Its really hard for me to inspect every inch of the car since it is so dirty and its so dark, so I concentrated on the driving aspect.
A little background: I am in my mid 40s, been a car fanatic my whole life. I can blame my dad. I grew up in a house where my dad probably always had a car better than his socioeconomic status. That isn't to say we were poor, but it isn't like I grew up with a filthy rich guy who had a collection of 20 cars at a time. That being said, I grew up with him owning cars such as a early 80s black 911sc coupe, Red Targa, BMW E36 M3 (with Dinan exhaust, headers, intake, ECU and cams), Acura NSX, Nissan 300zx TT (with stage 1 Jim Wolff turbo kit), AMG CLK55 (2), Currently AMG SL55, and just a couple of weeks ago he drove my Brothers 991 C2S with PDK and fell in love, so he has one being shipped as I type this (I think he thought at his age he was over the whole 911 thing, and then he got in my brothers and felt the refinement and the PDK and realized it isn't just a young mans car).
I grew up driving a little 88' Honda CRX Si (red), Acura Integra GS, 1994 Honda Civic coupe EX, 1999 Honda Civic coupe Si (until I got hit in it, before I even sold my Ex), 2003 Nissan 350z w/ Nismo Headers, Exhaust, Intake, Crawford Plenum, and most recently a 2003.5 BMW M3 6mt. The has been my baby for a long time and I love that car. Unfortunately I live in South Orange County Ca and I am finding that with the M3s being had with high milage for 15,000-20,000$ a lot of younger guys are buying them and modding them like crazy. It is almost to the point where the M3 now looks like a car for a guy in their late 20s to late 30s. (Even the E90s are getting this way, which I really don't like to see this trend). I was contemplating making my M3 to simulate a CSL (but with the 6MT) but I always wanted a 911 and this was the time.
I am really surprised that the 911 is that much different than the M3. My M3 is pretty light, manual seats, no Nav, etc.... Pretty much the lightest you can get without stripping stuff out or doing a sunroof delete. I guess we are comparing a 3415lb M3 to a 3075lb 911? The 911 feels even much lighter still. The front end tracks like it is on rails. I race Karts and I love the feel of the 911 also being low and such good visibility looking down at the road. All the hondas I have been in kind of have that feel and I always liked it. Perhaps the wt being in the back, the front being so light, being so low to the ground, the 911 reminds me most of the NSX. I know some here may look down on that car as it is a Japanese car, but I still really have a lot of respect and really liked driving that car.
On paper, I was kind of disappointed in the 911 motor. a 3.8L with "ONLY" 355hp? While My M3 that started production in 1999 is able to produce 333hp with only a 3.2L motor. Plus the 8,000 redline vs 7,300 and independent throttle bodies, etc. That M motor really is a special motor, and I still think it is. One thing I did notice coming from my 350z was that the M3 motor didn't seem to wind up as quickly. I am not sure if that is due to the design of a V6 vs an inline 6? But the torque curve on the M felt much flatter. It didn't really feel like the M was that much faster than the 350z, until you looked at the speedo and realized you were going faster. The M3 was just much more refined
Fast forward to the 911 and the engine seems to rev much quicker than the M3 and the torque curve even seems better than the m3 (which was already really good). So many things that the M3 did well: steering feel and response, brakes (compared to my 350z), responsive motor, suspension and handling, etc..... are all just a bit better on the 911, plus you sit lower in the car like the 350z (although the 350z front end visability isn't close to the 911). In general, this car has to rank right up there with the NSX and 360 Modena I have driven. I know it isn't an "exotic" like the 360, but it just maybe as fun to drive.
I just have so much going through my mind right now and had to put some of my thoughts to words. Sorry for the long post. When it is cleaned, I will have to post some pictures and do a more formal introduction.
01-27-2016 | 10:22 AM
#3
Burning Brakes
Joined: May 2013
Posts: 1,179
Likes: 27
From: Phoenix
Welcome to the 997 fold!
I saw that car in the classifieds and it looks like a great deal with the low miles and fidelity warranty!
I can relate to thinking maybe 345 hp wasn't going to be enough... my last car was an IS350 (306hp) and even though the car was a bit heavy and didn't corner worth a crap compared with the 911, it was decently quick. I was worried 345 wouldn't feel like a whole lot more than 306 (you can only tell so much on a test drive), but the 911's hp delivery across a broad RPM range is excellent, especially when combined with its lower weight. And handling is about perfect.
As far as the NSX comparison, I think its a good one. I had an S2000 at the same time a good friend of mine had a late model NSX (04 I believe) and at the time I wished the S2000 could have had that sweat 6 that was in the NSX. My 911 is now that, plus more!
Enjoy!
I saw that car in the classifieds and it looks like a great deal with the low miles and fidelity warranty!
I can relate to thinking maybe 345 hp wasn't going to be enough... my last car was an IS350 (306hp) and even though the car was a bit heavy and didn't corner worth a crap compared with the 911, it was decently quick. I was worried 345 wouldn't feel like a whole lot more than 306 (you can only tell so much on a test drive), but the 911's hp delivery across a broad RPM range is excellent, especially when combined with its lower weight. And handling is about perfect.
As far as the NSX comparison, I think its a good one. I had an S2000 at the same time a good friend of mine had a late model NSX (04 I believe) and at the time I wished the S2000 could have had that sweat 6 that was in the NSX. My 911 is now that, plus more!
Enjoy!
01-27-2016 | 10:52 AM
#5
Thread Starter
Rennlist Member
Joined: Dec 2015
Posts: 1,264
Likes: 132
From: Orange County
Blu, that's interesting. The s2000 is such a fun car to drive. I know it isn't nearly as quick as many cars but we always hear so much about the Miata and BRZ (holy crap, are there ever 2 more overhyped cars in the history. Maybe they are "drvers cars" but they are slower than most family sedans off the line). But frankly I would much much rather have a used s2000 than a new Miata or Brz.
My buddy has 2 NSX. A type R replica and a Supercharged. He also happens to have an S2000 as his daily. He says that the S is actually funner to drive. The visibility is much better and a lot of thinks Honda learned on the NSX they integrated and modernized on the S. I still love the NSX.
My buddy has 2 NSX. A type R replica and a Supercharged. He also happens to have an S2000 as his daily. He says that the S is actually funner to drive. The visibility is much better and a lot of thinks Honda learned on the NSX they integrated and modernized on the S. I still love the NSX.
01-27-2016 | 11:08 AM
#6
Rennlist Member
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 402
Likes: 146
From: San Diego
Congratulations.
Yes - the performance figures with 911's are unimpressive on paper. My 'base' car puts out 'only' 345bhp, but the delivery is so satisfying that the numbers are irrelevant from the drivers seat. But it's the way the car handles that has made me a 911 fan for life. Coming from an M3, the front end is going to feel floaty when you first hit the twisties, but you will learn to appreciate the traction on corner exit and just how much that adds to driver enjoyment.
Yes - the performance figures with 911's are unimpressive on paper. My 'base' car puts out 'only' 345bhp, but the delivery is so satisfying that the numbers are irrelevant from the drivers seat. But it's the way the car handles that has made me a 911 fan for life. Coming from an M3, the front end is going to feel floaty when you first hit the twisties, but you will learn to appreciate the traction on corner exit and just how much that adds to driver enjoyment.
Trending Topics
01-28-2016 | 12:27 PM
#8
Three Wheelin'
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 1,550
Likes: 7
From: Greater Philadelphia Area, USA
Nice story and car, rodH.
Enjoy!
My word on engine power: You can drive fast in a very repeatable way in a 997S. If you are talking about off the line (short gears! great clutch! TIRE GRIP!) or through twisty roads, hilly roads or a track, the numbers for a 997S are honest, repeatable, and real-world.
You can pull the 0-60 time of sub 5 secs over and over and over, and fairly easily. If you see another car's 0-60 time, it might represent the best clutch dump and fight to hook up the rears, but it's very often not repeatable or reliable. Many times, you'll see a 0-60 posted of 4.5 seconds from a 400 HP car. I'm very confident most schmucks in the real world ain't hitting that. The 997S has short gearing, a good clutch and an *** that keeps the tires planted. Yee haw.
Gearing: You have a good set of ratios, and if you are 'on the cam' and keeping the revs up, there's no road, flat or twisty or hilly, that will be too much of a compromise for the gear ratios. The tranny will thrive, and you will love rowing.
Brakes: Go faster longer! The most underestimated speed component.
Sooo.... screw the numbers on paper.... and enjoy all 355 HP, because they're the best HP, pound per pound, anywhere.
The Flat-6 howl and balance above 4500 RPM: LISTEN TO IT!
Enjoy!
My word on engine power: You can drive fast in a very repeatable way in a 997S. If you are talking about off the line (short gears! great clutch! TIRE GRIP!) or through twisty roads, hilly roads or a track, the numbers for a 997S are honest, repeatable, and real-world.
You can pull the 0-60 time of sub 5 secs over and over and over, and fairly easily. If you see another car's 0-60 time, it might represent the best clutch dump and fight to hook up the rears, but it's very often not repeatable or reliable. Many times, you'll see a 0-60 posted of 4.5 seconds from a 400 HP car. I'm very confident most schmucks in the real world ain't hitting that. The 997S has short gearing, a good clutch and an *** that keeps the tires planted. Yee haw.
Gearing: You have a good set of ratios, and if you are 'on the cam' and keeping the revs up, there's no road, flat or twisty or hilly, that will be too much of a compromise for the gear ratios. The tranny will thrive, and you will love rowing.
Brakes: Go faster longer! The most underestimated speed component.
Sooo.... screw the numbers on paper.... and enjoy all 355 HP, because they're the best HP, pound per pound, anywhere.
The Flat-6 howl and balance above 4500 RPM: LISTEN TO IT!
01-28-2016 | 04:41 PM
#9
Thread Starter
Rennlist Member
Joined: Dec 2015
Posts: 1,264
Likes: 132
From: Orange County
well said. Trying to explain the amount of power felt vs my M3 is hard. I think that being a rear engine car, it not only gets better grip to put the power down more effectively, but it has much less drivetrain drag and weight of a long driveshaft. This means that the power loss when comparing RWHP vs Crank HP, would be less when comparing to a car like my M3.
Nice story and car, rodH.
Enjoy!
My word on engine power: You can drive fast in a very repeatable way in a 997S. If you are talking about off the line (short gears! great clutch! TIRE GRIP!) or through twisty roads, hilly roads or a track, the numbers for a 997S are honest, repeatable, and real-world.
You can pull the 0-60 time of sub 5 secs over and over and over, and fairly easily. If you see another car's 0-60 time, it might represent the best clutch dump and fight to hook up the rears, but it's very often not repeatable or reliable. Many times, you'll see a 0-60 posted of 4.5 seconds from a 400 HP car. I'm very confident most schmucks in the real world ain't hitting that. The 997S has short gearing, a good clutch and an *** that keeps the tires planted. Yee haw.
Gearing: You have a good set of ratios, and if you are 'on the cam' and keeping the revs up, there's no road, flat or twisty or hilly, that will be too much of a compromise for the gear ratios. The tranny will thrive, and you will love rowing.
Brakes: Go faster longer! The most underestimated speed component.
Sooo.... screw the numbers on paper.... and enjoy all 355 HP, because they're the best HP, pound per pound, anywhere.
The Flat-6 howl and balance above 4500 RPM: LISTEN TO IT!
Enjoy!
My word on engine power: You can drive fast in a very repeatable way in a 997S. If you are talking about off the line (short gears! great clutch! TIRE GRIP!) or through twisty roads, hilly roads or a track, the numbers for a 997S are honest, repeatable, and real-world.
You can pull the 0-60 time of sub 5 secs over and over and over, and fairly easily. If you see another car's 0-60 time, it might represent the best clutch dump and fight to hook up the rears, but it's very often not repeatable or reliable. Many times, you'll see a 0-60 posted of 4.5 seconds from a 400 HP car. I'm very confident most schmucks in the real world ain't hitting that. The 997S has short gearing, a good clutch and an *** that keeps the tires planted. Yee haw.
Gearing: You have a good set of ratios, and if you are 'on the cam' and keeping the revs up, there's no road, flat or twisty or hilly, that will be too much of a compromise for the gear ratios. The tranny will thrive, and you will love rowing.
Brakes: Go faster longer! The most underestimated speed component.
Sooo.... screw the numbers on paper.... and enjoy all 355 HP, because they're the best HP, pound per pound, anywhere.
The Flat-6 howl and balance above 4500 RPM: LISTEN TO IT!
01-28-2016 | 06:45 PM
#15
Rennlist Member
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 1,190
Likes: 17
From: OC, CA
Congrats and the car looks great! Always good to see another OC person sign up... one of these days we should take over a row at the C&C in Aliso Viejo...
BTW I used to own an S2000. Awesome car!
BTW I used to own an S2000. Awesome car!