SpeedyD

The irony is that the highest net worth buyers are the ones usually keeping their cars low mileage and looking for ROI. It is a mindset of accumulation and winning that (often) gets people into the higher buckets of wealth... and that mindset is very hard to break.

Look at high end exotic cars ($1mm+ Ferraris, Porsches, etc) and look at the mileage they trade hands at... the net worth of their owners tend to be in the tens of millions (or hundreds) and you would think the difference between their car being $500k after 10 years vs. $3mm is a drop in the bucket if they have a net worth of $100mm+... yet the mileage tends to be miniscule and the attention to mileage is insane.

I personally think all this focus on value is misguided and maybe part of the recent views (likely short term, and likely to reverse) that somehow all these things are collectible.

To address the OP, I do think it makes the 997.2 more desirable overall. For me personally, it leaves me with the GT3 as my only future Porsche option (new), though that has recently been the case regardless... I think the .2 depreciation curve will be relatively flat given its characteristics, and certainly much flatter than the 996 before it. It will likely mean the 997 is looked upon very favorably in the future (as it is now) as being a bit of the optimal bridge between the older gen of cars and the newer gen. It is probably already a bit too GT-ish overall, however, to ever be a true must-have classic... But who knows!?

snake eyes

100K yearly salary is the buy in for a 997.2 . Almost all new Porsches are leased and average single income not family salary is 150k
I am just saying random numbers.

Sure sounds good...

and makes sense..However, golden rule says never spend over a 3rd of your yearly take home on a car.
So how many are following that.

Mbiondo

Frankly, who gives a rat’s **** what the sell value of our 997 is/will be. But, it is a good time to be in a 997—vaguely reminiscent of the 993; modern, fresh, and pleasing to the eye; truer to its form than the 991 Panamera Coupe.
Drive it; enjoy it; thank the Lord for how lucky you are to have one of these in your garage. Yet, treat it for what it is: a car—meant to be driven, enjoyed, and moderately abused. Much like your hot college girlfriend.

snake eyes

BTW, on the 991.2. This will be my car once the used one's hit the market. I never buy new ( well did it once on a Lotus S260 Sport) Made money on it , which was nice.
However, very rarely you make money on cars and although leasing is SMART. I don't like someone else owns my car not me.

As for the 997.2 it is not air cooled and if it is not a GT3 4.0 or Classic or Speedster it will be at 996 values soon enough.

Alexandrius

Look at Warren Buffet for god's sakes he drove a cadillac CTS because he isn't really an enthusiast and wanted something sensible and comfortable and worthwhile as a depreciating asset (because a cts cant depreciate that much, on a cash basis not % basis).

I know one or two people with estimated net worth over $100 mill from selling companies, and one of them drives anything he gets until it blows up.

The other values his time more as he isn't a car guy, and drives a decent car until it blows up and doesn't even bother getting it serviced until a light comes on. He had a newer model jaguar and maserati because he liked the styling, but he sold them simply because the maintenance issues he encountered annoyed the hell out of him. Even hiring someone to handle **** like that for you was an annoyance and burden for him.

I think those that keep those cars as investments AND have great wealth are also in the very small category of filthy rich true car enthusiasts who just want to be able to re-sell the car to be able to sensibly enjoy the next SUPERCAR.

That is how I would think if I was rich and didn't want to keep my Porsche 918 forever, I'd keep miles low so I could sell it, take a small hit, and buy something else.

I think very few people buy it straight up as an investment...if they do it's a really stupid choice and is more speculation. I say that with confidence.

snake eyes

Lease don't buy. Simple.. I bet someone on here who works at a Porsche Dealership can pull the lease numbers. I'm sure its not shocking that anything above a v6 panamera is leased. I had a GM at a store tell me just that.

Blu311

I agree about moderate depreciation being an additional reason why a 997 can be a 'not dumb' purchase. I also got mine about 6 years old and roughly 50% of sticker, even if it drops to 50% of its current value in the next 6 years it will still not be as bad as most new cars. But to expect appreciation any time soon on a 997 (non GT or special car) would be irresponsible in my opinion.

And when you consider the cost to drive it, store it, maintain it, insure it, and the time value of money, very few come out ahead in the long run. Yes, there are short term flipping opportunities, guys that enter/exit the car market at the right time due to strategy or luck, or guys that held on to cars for 20+ years... but for 99% of us, the ROI is a daily thing!

I also heard a rumor that Black Edition 997s will be worth seventy-bajillion dollars in a few years if you never drive it!

SpeedyD

Well, the very safest investment one can make is to buy a limited edition Ferrari (F40, F50, Enzo, LaF). Instant return because of how Ferrari operates... So I would hold back the confidence a bit...

As for the ultra wealthy, it is arguably irrational for them to limit the mileage (if they are car enthusiasts) on those cars in order to save some $$... even if that $$ is in the millions.

The benefit to someone of having another $1mm in the bank, when they have $500mm is quite virtually (or literally) zero. Dying with $500mm or $501mm...

It is a psychological issue more than anything else. Of course there is a middle ground... someone worth $10mm buying a $1mm supercar may justifiably care if the car can be sold for $800k in the future vs. $200k after driving it into the ground.

I'm most impressed by the truly wealthy who clearly are free to enjoy their wealth, in a rational manner, without the burden of needing to constantly accumulate more and more for the sake of accumulation. When people feel the need to just keep accumulating it is a very small difference between the hoarders that fill their homes with junk and the multi-billionaires that feel a need to hold onto and get more and more $$$, even at the expense of using or enjoying what they currently may own.

Everyone has their own views but I would rather be poor than ultra rich but burdened with that mentality.

SpeedyD

One other thing... it is worth reading one of the better biographies on Warren Buffett. He is an odd one... Brilliant, of course, but very, very, very odd...

Alexandrius

You make good points but I would argue buying a Ferrari purely as an investment is still speculation. Its also limited to a very small group of people even able to invest in it, so I consider it like an ipo. Good to get into if you can.

I agree as well I'd rather go to my grave having enjoyed life sensibly and not with a $ tally to represent my worth.

In the end though I've known some of these enthusiasts to put low miles on their cars because to them, given their investment experience, they find it physically painful to lose so much money buying an automobile. Even if it isn't much more than a drop in the bucket. Mental issue likely but he liked having the option to keep much of the value in the car to try the newest coolest thing when it comes out.

SpeedyD

Yeah, hard to get over certain ways of thinking.

I still scoff at overpaying for a can of tomato paste sometimes... rationally I know it isn't worth the 20 seconds of thought to save 15 cents but hard to avoid sometimes. When I catch myself doing that I try to step back and re-assess my priorities, so there goes another 30 seconds!

jhbrennan

Lunch in Frankfurt, breakfast in Stuttgart...that would be worth doing.

utkinpol

I bet 991.2 will be a way better car than any 997, which will not make me like my 997.1 any less. To each his own.

dalancroft

Bratwurst? Sauerkraut? Schnitzel? Sauerbraten?

dalancroft

When I drive my strapping 11-year-old son home from karate (his maternal grand pop was 6'6", I'm only 5'9" but have benched nearly 300 lbs in my heyday; right now he is 96% weight, 92% height for his age) I pass two gas stations. The ARCO on the left is almost always super-crowded, necessitating AT LEAST a 10-15 minute wait, while the 76 on the right (easier to get into and out of, as they are both in the shadow of a busy freeway, H-92) is almost always empty. The differential in price is maybe 8-12 cents a gallon, which even if you have a 20-gallon tank, which 911s don't -- my Audi Q5 takes about 18G on a standard fill-up -- you're looking at about $1.60-2.40 in savings. Don't know about you, but my time is worth a HELL of a lot more than $8-12 an hour.

Turns out most people really aren't that bright.