BogdanR

Actually I went a bit backward on this one and was the easiest, most pleasant car buying experience ever. It turned out in the course of my quest for a P-car I stopped a few times PFAFF to get maintenance history on some of the cars I was looking at. They were very nice, never charged me a penny for that and offered a coffee every single time. Long story shot, I've got to know one of their reps, talked to him quite a few times about other dealer's cars and he offered advice without ever being condescending towards anyone.

It just so happened the right car appeared at this dealership and the rep knew already what i was looking to spend roughly, what my preferences were so I never negotiated anything at all. I ended up getting a pretty nice discount without even asking. And because they knew me already, the process was really smooth and enjoyable.

I do understand this is not the norm, but if you have patience, like I did, you could do the same really... It took a few months but I got a vehicle I won't probably sell anymore...

As always YMMV...

3point8

gonzo and falcondvr make the most sense here

zirrah

+1 gonzo and buddha. If you prove to them that you will walk, you will get the bottom dollar.

CosmosC4S

Being in the car business, this is interesting listening to all your negotiation tactics

larrytrk

A car salesman once said to me " your taking the bread from my children's mouths", when we concluded the deal.
It was a decent deal, he still made money and I was OK with it. :- )

Dark Helmet

I make one offer, tell them to call me when they're ready to take the offer...

if they don't call, I don't care... there are others.

JB in AR

Yup.

A car purchase is the second most expensive purchase an average person makes after their house, yet most car buyers pull the trigger on emotion rather than rationality, and few do any real homework before stumbling onto the lot. Additionally, the actual purchase is only one of several profit centers at the dealership. They also make money in the F&I process. A car purchase also isn't something the average person does often enough to be that good at, either, even though they may think they have a "system." Car buying is a lot like craps. If you don't do it very often or not at all, then your chances of winning big are pretty slim.

In no particular order:

1. Do your homework before you even consider buying a car.
2. Check the dealer's reputation on-line.
3. Know your credit score before you walk onto the lot.
4. If trading a car, clean it up before you get an appraisal, and bring a printed KBB and Edmunds report with you to justify the TRADE IN value of what you want for your car.
5. Check out www.iseecars.com and auto trader for what similar cars you are interested in are going for retail in your area.
6. Buy an off lease vehicle if possible. These have generally been better maintained and cared for, and usually have some original warranty remaining. Service records are also usually more complete.
7. CarFax only shows accidents that have been repaired as an insurance claim, so use it only as a guide, but ask specifically if the dealer is aware of any other accidents or major repairs..
8. Buy an OEM CPO vehicle or one still in new car warranty if possible.
9. If financing, find out what rates your credit union will offer, and let the F&I guy know you would prefer to use your credit union unless he/she can beat that rate. Unless you do this, the F&I guy has no need to be competitive, and you will leave money on the table.
10. Ask to see a list of inspections, services, and repairs by the dealer that were done prior to the car being placed on the sale lot.
11. Buying emotionally is like falling in love with a one-night stand. It may seem great at first, but she may turn out to be more expensive than it was worth down the road. Always be prepared to take the deal or the door. You always have that choice.
12. Expect to pay a little more if the car is a sweetheart and hasn't been on the lot very long. Time in this case is on the dealer's side, not yours. The longer a car has been on the lot, the more negotiating leverage you have as a buyer. The cars on a lot don't belong to the dealer, they belong to the bank in most cases. The bank will "float" a car at no interest to the dealer usually for 30 - 45 days. After that, the dealer starts paying interest on the value of the car, so the dealer will be more willing to reduce his margin to move the car at that point rather than continue paying interest.
13. It's REALLY important not to be a ***** to the sales guy. These guys are trying to feed their families and pay their bills just like you, so deal with them courteously and respectfully. They work long hours and make their paycheck from a commission on the gross, so at a certain point, it won't make much sense for them to continue courting you as a potential buyer - especially if you are rude.
14. One of the most naive things you can say to a dealer is, "What's your very best price on this car." If you've done your homework on-line and know what a particular model car is retailing in the area for, then why even ask that question?
15. The first or second offer from the dealer are usually throw aways - especially if they know you have the means and motive to buy the car. Let the sales guy know what REASONABLE PRICE you are willing to pay after the second offer. If that doesn't work, then take the door.
16. When possible, buy toward the end of the month - especially if the weather has been crappy that month. Car sales are very weather dependent, and crappy weather almost always means hungry sales staff and dealers willing to dig a bit deeper to make numbers.

Good hunting!

Thedips

Yea agree too with falcon and gonzo. Be in position to know more about or as much about the car as possible. And what you are willing to pay (maximum ) for the car. Know your price be firm and willing to walk away. Close when fair price is reached. Better to understand market rather than what/how/why that particular car ended up at that dealership. Bought my car in Los Angeles without even seeing it or test driving it once. Ppi was a must and was huge in why my car was priced as such. And then started getting real whys and answers to questions about the car



Edit : lol just posted same time as jb.. Agree a lot with that too. Also go in next to closing time had some pretty desperate sales due to them wanting to just wrap it up and go home

Para82

I don't waste time negotiating. I make an offer, if it's refused then I walk.

BrakingBad

I decide the maximum price I want to pay for the car and then offer a couple thousand less. 9X out of 10 they will come back at or less than the price I want.

If that fails, try the Polish hostage technique.

91469972

I buy all my cars only dealing with the dealer on the internet and when we come to an agreement I tell them to get all of the paperwork done and I will come in and finalize everything. Also I tell them not to try and sell me anything else while dealing with finance. When I bought the Q7 they actually got it from another local dealer and I was in and out in half an hour including the test drive and inspection.

niner niner seven

So why don't you add some value to this discussion so we can learn?

tbrom

AMEN brother! I just love comments like the dealer made BUT if he told us anything he'd be ratting out himself and every other dealer now wouldn't he? Right

Now with that said there are a few posts that I think cover a lot of stuff related to dealers and one mentions treating them nicely because they have families to feed too. You know we shouldn't need to be told that but I suspect that there many of us that might!

The post from JB, I thought was not only helpful but right on every point! One of the best posts I've read since Gary Simms passed!

Another post mentioned going in late in the month and one mentioned late in the day - both of those tactics have worked for me.

Being prepared to walk is a very strong position to take and you have to be ready to walk.

From my own experience it is ALS really important to do your homework. Check Edmunds, KBB, and NADA or even Hagerty if it's a classic. Check autotrader and Porsche.com too and get a feel for the value of a car. And lastly and in my opinion most importantly do not go after cars like this with a "I gotta have one in a week", in other words you have to be patient - really patient. I've been looking for months and I'm just not going to "settle" anymore. I'm going to wait till the right one comes along and that's it.

That's my strategy along with JBs list - you employ these things and you pretty much can't go wrong.

CosmosC4S

JB in AR has already posted a pretty good list of guidelines.

There is really no bible to negotiation tactics. Basically, you gotta know what the car is worth, and what you are willing to pay. Some may say they will stay firm with their offer, and will not hesitate to walk. Well, if it is the right car, and you want it, you would have to decide whether you walk or you pay. True, there are more options out there, but the dealer may also feel there are more buyers out there. A good deal is really in the mind of the buyer. Many times, buyers drive off in their new cars thinking they got the best deal...but they may not have. And then there are those cheapo's who steal a car when the dealer decides to just let it go for a little loss (YES, dealers do sell cars at a loss!!!) yet, they still believe that the dealer made a ton out of them.

Buying a new car is easy and simple. Pricing, invoice, incentives - these information are easily accessible on the internet. You then shop on the internet from various dealers, and buy from the best offer.

Used cars is a little tricky, you don't know what the dealer paid for the car. One thing is for sure...dealers will never take a vehicle in on trade, or from the auction, for more than what its average trade value is. Sometimes, they may pay clean value just to make a deal. Most dealers use the Black Book. You could use KBB, Edmunds, NADA, etc. They will all come in different values, and a little higher than dealer numbers. Once you determined a good estimate of what the dealer paid for the car, you would have to add on Certification costs, if it's from a franchise dealer and the car is Certified. This varies with makes, and I'm guessing for Porsche's it's about $2000? and could end up several thousands more depending on what needs to be replaced or fixed. From there, you generate your set of intelligent numbers, and decide how nice the car is, and how much you are willing to pay for it. Don't just "come up" with a number, and tell the dealer take it or leave it. That is not very smart, especially if you are a serious buyer, and you like the car. But of course, if price is your priority, then please look elsewhere.

Find a pleasant and professional salesperson to deal with. Treat him as you would like him to treat you. You hate car salespeople, they hate "certain kind" of buyers too! Contrary to what some suggested, the General Manager does not have time for you, unless you are a loyal VIP customer. You may get to deal with a Sales manager, but most times, a salesperson will be delegated to deal with you. I recommend shopping online, and dealing with an Internet Sales Manager. Once you are able to establish a business relationship with a salesperson of integrity, you will be surprised how that contributes to a pleasant buying experience, and who stands behind your purchase after the sale. Sometimes, the cheapest price is not everything.

From my whole year of looking for a C2S, C4S before ending up with my GTS, I have seen most Porsche dealers stacking on a hefty $10k-$15k markup on their preowned cars! This is from my estimates of their markup from cost to asking price, not considering any reconditioning & CPO costs. Non-Porsche dealers on the other hand, are more willing to let high-end vehicles go with a lower profit. They normally stack on $3k-$6k with minimal reconditioning, and no CPO costs.

Now, if you are trading in a vehicle...that is another area to cover. It is all about the bottom line when the deal is agreed upon.

PrimeMvr

Agreed that the key is to be able to suppress emotion and walk away if you have a fair price in your head and they won't meet it.

When I bought my 997 I had been in the dealership 3 times before, but they wouldn't budge on price. After three weeks they dropped their listed price 4k. I emailed the same offer I had been making, which was 8k below what they were originally asking, and the salesman said ok. When I got there someone else stepped in and said he shouldn't have done that and they can't sell it at that price, because blah, blah, blah. I shook his hand and headed for the door. On the way out I told the sales manager it was the last time I would visit their dealership. They gave me my price.

It was August in Illinois and they wanted to clear the cabs off the lot for Panameras and Cayennes.

Markets vary, but with "commodity" 911's there are so many options for buying that the dealers never really have a negotiating advantage unless they are willing to sit on their cars until someone who believes that comes in.